Job Points discussion

[Sechs]

Not sure if it has been said but I was surprised to be getting JPs in Dynamis yesterday. Like 80ish Capacity Points per kill in Tavnazia

I think it's 75 per kill on nightmare mobs. Some of the demons gave up to 98 JPs.
It's strange. Is it me or it seems that the amount of JP from Dynamis is higher than expected, considering how much XP they normally give?



Also about the JP/Jap/Jpn thing, despite me having a degree in linguistics (semiotics to be correct) I never fully understood the USA people's obsession with the "JAP" thing.
I could say the same about many other "no-no" words, some of which belongs to different countries/cultures, but personally I never agreed with such an attitude.
I understand the socio-cultural implications behind it, but I still find it stupid.
People should be more concerned about the meaning (or intentions) behind the words, instead than focusing on the words itself, which can become just empty shells in some circumstances.
I mean, it's more like the appearance vs substance old issue.
It sounds a bit hypocrite to me to ban the use of certain words in certain contexts. What should be "banned", or punished, or at least obstructed, is the meaning behind.
It's no use if you ban a word but then allow certain individuals to say the same exact offensive/racist way in a more "creative" way using different words, is it?

I mean, take it on another perspective, another form of "racism"; homophoby.
I don't think the use of words like gay, homo or faggot should be banned, it makes no sense. What should be banned (or at least obstructed, or in some circumstances even made illegal because of anti-homophoby laws) should be the meanings behind it, no matter which words you choose to express it. (ok we're entering into a dangerous "freedom of speach" field now, mine was just an example to emphasize that the attention should shift from the shell (words) to the contents (meaning))

[Damane]

the incentiv to recreate merits partys via woh or doh gate fired back, noone is bothering with job points or wants to join a shout for JP party

[Sechs]

If incentivation of old merit pts setups was their goal, I welcome it with open arms because I've been missing them.
But something clearly went wrong in there. Are there even good camps (mobs placements, repop rates etc) in Gates zones?
Also the max 30merits cap and the insanely low JP accrue rate didn't help with the project.
Last but not least the requirements for JP are insanely high and majority of JP at the moment makes little to no sense at all.
In hindsight I'm not sure people (myself included) really wanted merit setups to come back. We probably miss that idea, those times, we feel melancholia etc, but we've been too spoiled by other means of XP farming to be able to enjoy oldstyle merit setups for more than a couple of days (after the melancholia effect stops being effective, basically)


Like one of the flaws of the system is also one of the core ideas. The fact that you can only farm JPs for that job while using that job.
Good luck gathering such an intense amount of CP on some of those jobs nobody would want in a PT.
Good luck being stuck playing on a job you're capped on already (like healer, or support) and farming JPs you won't need.
Imho it's a cool idea in theory (I love it), but it's very very very unpractical.

[Damane]

another problem is also that barely anyone has time. between trying to keep up with content an trying to gear other jobs left behind there isnt much time left for a merit point PT

[Sechs]

between trying to keep up with content

I thought this was just an issue of people like me who lately get barely enough time to be online.
Is it an issue for hardcore and reknowed players such as you as well?
Hmm... interesting.

But still, I'd rather whine because I can't keep up with content than whine because there is nothing to do and I'm getting bored, no?
Or is it? I'm not sure.
The second one just brings stagnation, boredom and eventually you drop the game.
The first one brings frustration... and that too can make you drop the game I guess but I see it more as an extreme and rare possibility.

[Damane]

I thought this was just an issue of people like me who lately get barely enough time to be online.
Is it an issue for hardcore and reknowed players such as you as well?
Hmm... interesting.

But still, I'd rather whine because I can't keep up with content than whine because there is nothing to do and I'm getting bored, no?
Or is it? I'm not sure.
The second one just brings stagnation, boredom and eventually you drop the game.
The first one brings frustration... and that too can make you drop the game I guess but I see it more as an extreme and rare possibility.

no i have a hard time keeping up with content, while I could gear 5 jobs preivously (whm cor sch war blu) perfectly fine I had to drop 2 of them... cor and blu. I am focused on whm sch war gearing (and rdm since it shares alot equip) but I have fallen way behind on gearing blu and destroyed my cor (only buff gear available as of now). I cant keep up with content because of 2 reasons:
1.) sometimes its alot of content if you want to gear multiple jobs at a time, barely enough time (RL + RL Job)
2.) barely enough people to play with during EU prime time

for me the 2.) reason is the most frustrateing and is the biggest reason... the EU population is not existent almost and its getting more and more difficult to play during that timeslot where i might have to say to myself: "the game is done", from an EU player perspective. Its really grave when there are no shouts happening during EU prime and your own LS cant fill 1 PT without needing 1-2 mules. You cant play during JP prime due to language barrier, and you cant play during NA times because thats your sleeping time before hitting work next day.

they need to merge servers, because i am not the only person feeling like this. The longer they hold on to not merging the more will leave for the good ¬.¬, i mean whats the point of playing an MMO when you have barely any people to play with.

[Sechs]

PM for you.
But yeah, they did a good and bad job at the same time with reforged AFs.
It's a huge timesink and gilsink as well, which is good for them (keeps people busy without whining for "OMG GIVE US NEW CONTENT!") and I guess for the economy, but it's also very stressing for players with multiple jobs.
I had to drop several jobs as well, but I'm a sad case so that doesn't count.
Delve 1.0 gear really helped me in that sense, because a lot of my jobs could share those gear, and it was relatively easy to get them even before I could get 6nm runs. It was just a matter of taking 3x Airlixirs+2 to max them up, but once you managed to do it, several of your jobs could use those pieces, so it was awesome and reason why I loved stuff like Manibozho, even if it was a pretty plain (and boring?) set.
It's kinda a shame how some manibozho pieces are still the best accuracy sets you can get atm lol, wish stats on Qaaxo were mixed in a different way. Like for instance +acc instead of +eva on A path!

[/rantoff]

[dasva]

And even if you manage to do all the big content there is still stuff like RoE or SKCNMs to mess around with. And then all the old content and farming etc. Heck in someways it's even hard just to keep up with figuring out how to gear your jobs lol.

[FaeQueenCory]

the incentiv to recreate merits partys via woh or doh gate fired back, noone is bothering with job points or wants to join a shout for JP party

I don't really believe that was ever their intent...
I believe it's what a portion of the playerbase wanted...
But given how Job Points work...
I seriously doubt they intended for it to "bring back 75era exp parties"... in any possible meaning of that phrase.

I say that because of one simple reason: banning chain bonus from yielding Capacity Points.

Because that's the difference between an "old school" and a "modern" experience points party.
Old = relying on the chain bonus to generate ample exp.
Modern = GoV/FoV in place of that chain bonus... and Abyssea's whole chain experience gimmick. (which has anyone else noticed now you get full exp during the exp RoE? When did they change it from just "150/kill" or w/e it was?)
Which is why I see no difference between the "old" and the "new"... grind is grind. There were always leechers... and there were always and always will be max-level tards who can't play their job. (my RL friend... 24/24 stat merits... 20/20 job merits... 4/5 stardiver... had to get "yelled at"-his words- by someone in the aby-worm party before he used the fancy-lv-80+ spirit-w/e jumps... because "I didn't know those existed".... Not to mention has told me that the reason he doesn't use High Jump.... is because it's recast is 100s... yeah. I can't make this shit up.)

What I think they intended.... is to artificially prolong the content's life.... with arbitrary limits placed there upon.
Why must it be Lv100+ mobs? You don't not gain Limit Points from mobs <75.
Why no Abyssea? No chain bonuses? Why make this content practically scream to not be done due to the effort and the punishing of party play?
Because "the problem" with Adoulin is that it's completed too quickly and easily.
Heck, Matsui even admitted that that was the biggest complaint with Skirmish... which is why S3 has such a dumb KI droprate. (have they made that less "hardcore" and more "casual" like they claim that content is for? Cause... someone needs to tell them that the people who finish content on Day 1 and/or can spend full days doing the same content until they're 100% on w/e... are not the "casual" players Skirmish is allegedly set up for... S1-2, heck yeah, super casual. S3? Um.. no. It practically demands to grind... 1/50 for a KI is "hardcore"... for "casual" content... that's just silly.)

[Twilight Sky]

for me the 2.) reason is the most frustrateing and is the biggest reason... the EU population is not existent almost and its getting more and more difficult to play during that timeslot where i might have to say to myself: "the game is done", from an EU player perspective. Its really grave when there are no shouts happening during EU prime and your own LS cant fill 1 PT without needing 1-2 mules. You cant play during JP prime due to language barrier, and you cant play during NA times because thats your sleeping time before hitting work next day.

As a US player that prefers to play with EU players(because unlike most NA players, my free time is in the day, and EU events usually happen around noon my time), I've noticed this.

But to that end, I don't see any JP players either lol. GHOST SERVER.

[dasva]

I play during NA times but at least several months ago when delve was still big the only big lss that did it were jp and EU

[Damane]

As a US player that prefers to play with EU players(because unlike most NA players, my free time is in the day, and EU events usually happen around noon my time), I've noticed this.

But to that end, I don't see any JP players either lol. GHOST SERVER.

its allways like that, on phoenix: JP prime 1600 players~ Na prime: around the same, EU prime: the fuck 700 players, and like most of them are afk Bazaars. and phoenix is one of the servers considered to have a rather "healthy/big" popullation so I dont want to imagine how it is on lesser populated servers... i have heard sometimes somethign around 200 people on Eu prime on ghost servers ¬.¬, so I dont know how EU players can even play on those server

[Yugl]

LS member confirming 55 pts for full upgrade.

[Byrthnoth]

Yeah, 110 points to fully upgrade everything released right now for one job. That's about 220 hours soloing with Trusts. I get about 120 CP/kill and about 1500 limit points per kill, which means that capping job points right now for one job is equivalent to getting 4,125 merits. For reference, upgrading all merit points currently available in the most expensive way for all jobs requires 2526 merit points. So you can upgrade all merit points for all jobs, change your mind about almost every job-specific merit, and re-merit them using only the exp you get from farming 110 job points.

Is the current system ridiculous? I don't know, you tell me!

[Damane]

Yeah, 110 points to fully upgrade everything released right now for one job. That's about 220 hours soloing with Trusts. I get about 120 CP/kill and about 1500 limit points per kill, which means that capping job points right now for one job is equivalent to getting 4,125 merits. For reference, upgrading all merit points currently available in the most expensive way for all jobs requires 2526 merit points. So you can upgrade all merit points for all jobs, change your mind about almost every job-specific merit, and re-merit them using only the exp you get from farming 110 job points.

Is the current system ridiculous? I don't know, you tell me!

I wouldnt call it ridiculous, would rather call it insane ¬.¬

[NynJa]

In case anyone is wondering, since I was defending this before:
Now that we know the lvl up progression, each subsequent level being +1 of the next is ridiculous and requiring 300k JP to go from lvl 9 to 10 is stupid.

[dasva]

In case anyone is wondering, since I was defending this before:
Now that we know the lvl up progression, each subsequent level being +1 of the next is ridiculous and requiring 300k JP to go from lvl 9 to 10 is stupid.

You mean cp?

[NynJa]

I thought we agreed to go by JP since CP is conquest points.

[Priran]

JP is also japanese.

Everything about this system is stupid bullshit!

[dasva]

I thought we agreed to go by JP since CP is conquest points.

So wait we are calling both capacity points and job points JP?