Israel vs. Gaza round 99

[Ksandra]

Btw, I know it sounds like I am focusing a lot more on the Palestine issues than the Israeli issues, but that is because the Israeli stuff, I find, to be a little more straight forward, and AG's summary of the history of that area was on point.

It's just this civil conflict isn't really being addressed, and everyone (internet) has been quick to jump onto the idea that this is some easy solution if Israel would leave Palestine alone we could all just hold hands, and while Israel has been way more aggressive than they ever should be, it's not that simple by any means due to all these factors.

[Byrthnoth]

Pro Palestinian just means that you are in favor of Palestinians having a shot at a decent life. Their current political institutions suck. Hamas is a bag of dicks and the Palestinian Authority is impotent because Hamas undermines it and Israel's politics make them uninterested in peace. There can be only bad options, but that doesn't mean the people aren't suffering.

The Arab Israelis deciding to strike is an interesting wedge. We will have to see how increased rightward drift of Israeli politics fractures their society and pushed them even more towards apartheid domestically.

[Ksandra]

Pro Palestinian just means that you are in favor of Palestinians having a shot at a decent life.

I agree with this, but I mean, that's gonna have to come from Palestine's gov't, not Israel.

[archibaldcrane]

I agree with this, but I mean, that's gonna have to come from Palestine's gov't, not Israel.

Israel substantially controls the Palestinian economy and the freedom of those within.

[Ksandra]

Israel substantially controls the Palestinian economy and the freedom of those within.

Yes, but Palestine is under civil unrest. They won't ever get that freedom with the current gov't standing.

[Andalusian girls]

I am fine on dropping the whole word of "Palestine" and just saying "Fatah" and "Hamas", as I agree with you, there really is no Palestinian state. However, I disagree that Hamas has just as much a claim to the title of "Palastine" as "Fatah" if we were to give the state to someone (figuratively speaking for terms), especially when we look at them as active governments. The Palestinian government began with the West Bank And Gaza, and Hamas didn't take over Gaza until the 2000s when they were ousted by Fatah. Before that, it was a definite political game between both political parties to hold as much influence in government for both areas.

while i would certainly prefer Fatah of the two if we're giving statehood to anyone the fact remains Hamas defeated them in the most recent elections, and easily took Gaza from them with the acquiescence of large segments of the populace. in an ideal world Fatah destroys or subsumes them, in the world we live in Hamas represents a significant portion of the Palestinian people.

[Andalusian girls]

Israel substantially controls the Palestinian economy and the freedom of those within.

this may be the understatement of our brief millennium. World Bank estimates the Israeli blockade on Gaza chokes off as much as 50% of potential GDP and has annihilated once productive manufacturing and trading centers. the Israeli blockade causes foot shortages (don't laugh at me koyangi), systemic power shortages, makes it so clean water is difficult to find. absurd to pretend Israel is not actively undermining the quality of life for millions of Palestinians.

[Koyangi]

foot shortages, lol

[Day]

if i lived in palestine i would simply become jewish and move across the creek

[Andalusian girls]

foot shortages, lol

https://www.wfp.org/countries/palestine

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...d-un-head-says

food insecurity is endemic in the Palestinian territories and there would likely be starvation and mass malnutrition if it weren't for the foreign aid that floods into Palestine keeping many (barely) afloat

[Andalusian girls]

DISREGARD I CAN'T SPELL

[Andalusian girls]

tho giving their bombing campaign perhaps it's both at this point

[Ksandra]

this may be the underestimate of our brief millennium. World Bank estimates the Israeli blockade on Gaza chokes off as much as 50% of potential GDP and has annihilated once productive manufacturing and trading centers. the Israeli blockade causes foot shortages, endemic power shortages, makes it so clean water is difficult to find. absurd to pretend Israel is not actively undermining the quality of life for millions of Palestinians.

This is a good point, but I don’t think Israel is ever going to release that grip. They do this to keep Palestine weak so they can easily defend themselves.

If they leveled the playing field, they fear complete annihilation.

I just cannot see any future of peace in that region. Which sucks for the average citizen.

[archibaldcrane]

The rest of the region has abandoned the Palestinians, Israel has less to fear now than they literally ever have.

And will continue to annex land unabated.

[Ksandra]

If Israel literally gave Palestine everything they wanted Hamas would still continue to try and wipe them off the planet.

[Ksandra]

Again, I am not on the side of Israel, but this situation really does suck and we can’t ignore all the pieces.

[Roranora]

there may be no Palestinian state but i'm p sure Palestine still somehow lost WW2

[Roranora]

might have to brush up on a few dates and names of wars but i'm sticking to it

[Meresgi]

It's bad when Geraldo is the "sane" one.

Lol "Yo Hamas shooting rockets from on top of a hospital so why would you not blow up that entire fucking hospital and murder you some babies?! ISRAEL IS DOING THE RIGHT THING"

[Salodin]

If they're shooting rockets from the roof of a hospital, why would you do nothing as your nation and citizens are attacked?

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