The Ferguson, Missouri thread

[Gadritan]

Not to interrupt the bickering, but an update on the man who was killed.

Cops have given a few completely different versions of events, ranging from being at the home to serve a simple warrant, to chasing a suspect through the woods to his house.

His cousin was on the phone with him when he was shot and says he heard a "tussle," then one gun shot.

The family isn't helping matters. They set a bunch of furniture in his yard on fire, then set the woods across the street on fire after that was put out. There's still protests going on as well.

Doesn't sound like the officer will be identified until the SBI has concluded their investigation. If he's white, well, I'll see ya'll on the national news.

[kuronosan]

bum understands how co-opting and dismissing of messages work beyond the surface level of understanding that the rest of you have. Yes, it is important to identify the oppressed and how they are oppressed. No, it is not ok to state things in a way to trivialize that.

No, he doesn't. And you? You're just plain wrong. Nobody is trivializing "movements". The movements trivialize themselves much the same way that religion does.

[notorious bum]

Everything is trivial about these protests until commerce gets a taste of disruption, major highways impeded, and their knights in shining armor get exposed for the racist, barbaric, or incompetent little rats that they are. Then you start getting people who used to not be bothered to start putting shit together and realize just how little has changed from the 60's.

Anyways, Gad, that shit sounds like some 3rd world village crime story. The hell you going to start lighting trees up for? We really are living in some wild wild west shit, huh?

Also, Millennial AU is testifying in federal court today on the police brutality in STL. I'd love to read THAT transcript lol

[notorious bum]

Using those Mexican police tactics, I see lol

Undercover Cops Outed and Pull Gun on Crowd [UPDATED]
During the ongoing protests in Berkeley and Oakland, on Dec 10th 2014, two undercover police were outed by the crowd, and proceeded to pull out a gun, and make arrests while still wearing their masks. https://storify.com/CourtneyPFB/unde...l-gun-on-crowd

[Quicklet]

You know he's serious because he's pointing it sideways.

[Khajit]

The problem I have with all these "movements" is that they become self defeating. Once you state you support it, all you have to say is "I think it matters for everyone" and instantly you're the enemy.

Why the heck would I get behind a movement if the slightest difference in opinion makes me the enemy?

I think the core of this atm is that it sounds like it's going along a similar track to colourbind theory.
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/...is-form-racism
Thanks to the obvious implications of the link above it instantly makes a bunch of people immediately suspicious even if they can't explain why but at the same time colourblind theory has it's own form of automatic defense. Anyone who criticizes it or points something out related to the theory is totally racist or trolling. (Yes trolling. I got called that when I pointed out that Morgan Freeman saying racism can be stopped if we(individually) just don't talk about race means Morgan Freeman is an idiot.)

#AllLivesMatter is technically true but it distracts the focus away from the fact that this currently stems from a disproportionate amount of black deaths. It turns it to a more nebulous and less specified thing almost like the purpose colourblind theory serves. It's difficult to point out that the focus was on disproportionate black deaths without ending up looking like you're against all lives mattering due to how our minds tend to categorize as for/against.
I'm probably thinking way too much into this though.

[Ezek]

Everything is trivial about these protests until commerce gets a taste of disruption, major highways impeded, and their knights in shining armor get exposed for the racist, barbaric, or incompetent little rats that they are. Then you start getting people who used to not be bothered to start putting shit together and realize just how little has changed from the 60's.

lol.

Also, having highways and financial districts disrupted isn't going to earn you any brownie points with people uninvolved. It's just going to make them pissed off that you're fucking up their daily life. See: Hong Kong protests.

[Khajit]

lol.

Also, having highways and financial districts disrupted isn't going to earn you any brownie points with people uninvolved. It's just going to make them pissed off that you're fucking up their daily life. See: Hong Kong protests.

Ah yes. Torture people, divert billions of dollars in tax money to the pockets of the people that caused a worldwide financial crisis, demolish the concept of freedom of the press and all the crap happening since Ferguson, but the second people are protesting at a highway all the rage comes out.
That is one fucked up sense of priorities.

[Salodin]

Ah yes. Torture people, divert billions of dollars in tax money to the pockets of the people that caused a worldwide financial crisis, demolish the concept of freedom of the press and all the crap happening since Ferguson, but the second people are protesting at a highway all the rage comes out.
That is one fucked up sense of priorities.

But those aren't the people doing that to you. And once they try and stand up with you and say "all lives matter", you come and say fuck you, black lives matter? Cmonnnnn

[Koul]

If it's selfish or if I have shitty priorities because I want to get to work so I can pay my rent or buy food then I guess I'm selfish.

[RKenshin]

Everything is trivial about these protests until commerce gets a taste of disruption, major highways impeded, and their knights in shining armor get exposed for the racist, barbaric, or incompetent little rats that they are. Then you start getting people who used to not be bothered to start putting shit together and realize just how little has changed from the 60's.

As another poster mentioned, all this is going to do is piss people off and get people off of your side... and make the protestors look like lunatics/idiots.

A few weeks ago people 'marched and blocked' interstate 95, going through Providence. All it did was piss people off and make them frustrated with the protestors, calling them idiots and cheering on the police.

If you want people to support your cause, you don't try and punish them 'to open their eyes.' Especially not by causing traffic, something that is already more than frustrating/time-wasting as it is by itself. The protestors are already getting a bad rep with all the looting and crime going on/being reported in the news, actions like that only make it worse.

[kuronosan]

But those aren't the people doing that to you. And once they try and stand up with you and say "all lives matter", you come and say fuck you, black lives matter? Cmonnnnn

This. People just don't seem to get basic human psychology.

Getting in your face because you don't say things the same way, or interrupting your day to stick it to someone else is not going to make them angry at them, it's going to make them angry at you.

I'm already angry at the system for producing such wealth inequality to the point where I'm struggling, and now you're going to make that worse in order to make it better?

There are ways to influence people to your side, and the point I was making was that ostracizing people who are sympathetic to your cause because they say "I'm for humanism" or "all lives matter" instead of educating them as to what they can do to make it mean something is only going to alienate them.

It's already pissing me off, and I'm as far as you can get from conservative, racist, or sexist. I'm incredibly tolerant but this shit is not the right way to do it.

This is why I hate the social media circus. This crap is all for show and then violence eventually replaces it. Nutjobs like bum call it a second revolution but then forget the connotations of such a word and throw it around like it was "the".

What we need is not a physical revolution. We need a social revolution that makes all lives matter, all genders matter, all sexualities matter, and all races and cultures matter.

If that has to start with blacks, so be it. But don't you dare tell me I don't get it and I don't care because I'm not willing to live on the street with my wife while hashtagging shit instead of putting myself in a position to MAKE change.

Too many people talking about change and not enough people lifting a finger. Until you drop the natural human tendency of "Us vs. Them" your change will NEVER happen because there will always be something getting in your way.

[notorious bum]

If anyone is focusing on random looting and alleged-related crimes reported on the "news" with this movement, they can go fuck themselves, they aren't worth the time in convincing them that Black Lives matter and racism is real, in 2014.

Real recognizes real. Protestors receive more support than hate in the grand scheme of things, don't let the news dictate the narrative. Those who are inconvenienced by some traffic? Too bad. Being black in America is an inconvenience everyday. Losing family and friends to some bullshit petty crimes is a real inconvenience.

[kuronosan]

And you are the reason you have absolutely no credibility. You went from having my support to "full retard" in two shooting threads over the course of a year.

Your reasoning is rapidly becoming recognized as less activism and more zealotry.

[notorious bum]

Props on using retard as an insult, so progressive. Thank you for doing your best "CNN concerned news anchor" impression, though. Next, we'll learn about how MLK hated all violent forms of protest and the Black Panthers were all terrorists.

The news won't tell you how this movement grows or where it's going next, but I'll do my best, as long as I have the spare time, to come here and give updates. Peace.

[kuronosan]

Clearly you've never seen Tropic Thunder, so I'll give you a moment to come down from your throne to watch it with the rest of us who have sense of humor and can't lift a flaming sword of self-righteousness.

[BaneTheBrawler]

Never go full retard. That being said, that's one reference that should probably be avoided in this section. "Retard" is just too loaded.

[Khajit]

But those aren't the people doing that to you. And once they try and stand up with you and say "all lives matter", you come and say fuck you, black lives matter? Cmonnnnn

Way to prove my previous post it sounds like you're trying to reference. At no point whatsoever did I say that "All lives matter" is an incorrect statement. I even pointed out that it's technically/perfectly correct although I did mention it seems to serve the general purpose of removing detail from the subject. You're even reacting exactly as predicted with colourblind theory.
Eg a person points out colourblind theory doesn't work or isn't that great an idea in practice. People then focus on the "everyone is human" portion and take any criticism of the philosophy that it's merely a part of as a criticism of "everyone is human" instead of a possible criticism of anything else stemming from or in the theory.
Pointing out that while yes it is true that "all lives matter" we are currently dealing with "Black lives matter" due to a disproportionate amount of death/incarceration/etc for black lives in particular somehow gets misconstrued as " fuck you, black lives matter" as if trying to pay attention to the "current issue" means a dismissal of "all lives matter" as wrong.

[Talint]

I'm sorry. If you're pissed off that your commute to work was delayed because of protests, then you were never on the side of the protesters to begin with.

It's really that simple, and really NOT an example of extremism. Either you have empathy, or you don't.

And, as I said earlier:

Violent protests is apparently a no-no.

But so are peaceful protests, because that might inconvenience others.

Guess the only way left to protest is through hashtag slacktivism.

[notorious bum]

Appreciate the colorblind explanation, Khajit, it really does apply to this whole recent social media hashtag fuck-up. In response to what was being discussed earlier about the disruption of commerce and inconveniencing folks while protesting, this just happened:

Walmart CEO Doug McMillon: We'll Do Away With Minimum Wage Pay In New Year
http://www.forbes.com/sites/clareoco...y-in-new-year/