The Ferguson, Missouri thread

[Thunder]

People should be free to express themselves and choose their own path, and not what popular opinion dictates.

This isn't popular opinion just yet lol. And most people don't have a choice in their "path" so they do just go with the popular opinion

Like I said in the feminism thread, it's actually important to get people on your side and "sell" your shit.

It's funny, because I see this, and I see people who want so desperately to be a part of it and they never took a moment to learn from those who have succeeded before them. Here's some advice and warning from two dudes that I think have a pretty big say in successful world-changing:

“To put the world in order, we must first put the nation in order; to put the nation in order, we must put the family in order; to put the family in order, we must cultivate our personal life; and to cultivate our personal life, we must first set our hearts right.”-Confucious

"...
And the problem with changing your outer world without changing yourself is that you will still be you when you reach that change you have strived for. You will still have your flaws, anger, negativity, self-sabotaging tendencies etc. intact.

And so in this new situation you will still not find what you hoped for since your mind is still seeping with that negative stuff. And if you get more without having some insight into and distance from your ego it may grow more powerful. Since your ego loves to divide things, to find enemies and to create separation it may start to try to create even more problems and conflicts in your life and world."-Ghandi

I also just wanna point out that there's been a HUGE increase in black related violence coverage in the media in the last year or two. This isn't because violence against blacks increased in 2014, I think we all know that, there's always been this same racism. It's just because the media runs with what sells. And what people willingly want to listen to sells. Easiest way to get people to listen is to show them some injustice to get them upset. The "movement" started on the back of media riling everyone up.

Guess what happens when that movement gets the average American more upset than the violence on blacks that got covered a while ago and is getting forgotten? They'll run with that story. And the world will hate you. All because the people a part of the "movement" couldn't be trifled with working creatively to sell their message. Ego's too big, fuck those people who don't immediately join our side!

[Gadritan]

I did give more details.

Ya'll are amazing.

[Dantrag]

Not to interrupt the bickering, but an update on the man who was killed.

Cops have given a few completely different versions of events, ranging from being at the home to serve a simple warrant, to chasing a suspect through the woods to his house.

His cousin was on the phone with him when he was shot and says he heard a "tussle," then one gun shot.

The family isn't helping matters. They set a bunch of furniture in his yard on fire, then set the woods across the street on fire after that was put out. There's still protests going on as well.

Doesn't sound like the officer will be identified until the SBI has concluded their investigation. If he's white, well, I'll see ya'll on the national news.

Here's the details for those that missed it(I did).

[RKenshin]

When people said details, I get the feeling they were looking for an actual article, video, audio, pictures, etc... and not just a few lines from a random post. You know, like just about every single other post here that leads to discussion (often starting with a video or AT LEAST a news article).

It's hard to argue/care much about what someone is saying about a news event on the internet, without actually even providing a link to it (or even being able to find it yourself). Not like you can google "black guy gets shot gadritan" and get the result.

[Dantrag]

I don't disagree, just posting the info he did.

[RKenshin]

Yeah, and appreciated - my comment was directed at gadritan, for clarity.

I did actually see that post the first time, but my immediate thought was to wait for a post with a news article/video/update or something to provide a better account of the event. It never came, and so it was forgotten about.

[Gadritan]

There wasn't one at the time that had even that much detail. That was from people in the neighborhood.

I'll elaborate more when I'm off work with links and such.

Starting to sound like the guy basically got killed because he was a scumbag, not because he posed a threat to the officers. The PD here is corrupt as fuck and it looks like they're gonna get away with this.

[tyven]

TAKE EM DOWN GAD

[notorious bum]

Small victory for the protestors in Ferguson. I don't think this will be the last time we'll be hearing from these women.

Keith Rose @KWRose
1. HUGE NEWS!!: All day today a federal judge in STL heard testimony about the police #UnifiedCommand response to #Ferguson protests.

Keith Rose @KWRose
2. Our #Ferguson legal team spent months building the case. Defendants were Chief Dotson, Chief Belmar, & Capt. Johnson.

Keith Rose @KWRose
4. The judge has just GRANTED our request for a Temporary Restraining Order (TRO)!! We will learn about her full ruling tomorrow. WE WON!

Alexis @MusicOverPeople
We get an understanding of what this ruling means tomorrow, but it's amazing that we got this win.

brittany. @bdoulaoblongata
And @kirabanks “@KWRose: 3. Plaintiffs included @MusicOverPeople, @bdoulaoblongata, @MoKaBes owner Mo, and others.”


Demonstrators File Suit Challenging Police Overreach, Ask Court to Order Police to Stop Misuse of Tear Gas

[NynJa]

I did give more details.

Ya'll are amazing.

Sorry i didnt see that post, i was expecting an article

[Nephlite]

Small victory for the protestors in Ferguson. I don't think this will be the last time we'll be hearing from these women.

Keith Rose @KWRose
1. HUGE NEWS!!: All day today a federal judge in STL heard testimony about the police #UnifiedCommand response to #Ferguson protests.

Keith Rose @KWRose
2. Our #Ferguson legal team spent months building the case. Defendants were Chief Dotson, Chief Belmar, & Capt. Johnson.

Keith Rose @KWRose
4. The judge has just GRANTED our request for a Temporary Restraining Order (TRO)!! We will learn about her full ruling tomorrow. WE WON!

Alexis @MusicOverPeople
We get an understanding of what this ruling means tomorrow, but it's amazing that we got this win.

brittany. @bdoulaoblongata
And @kirabanks “@KWRose: 3. Plaintiffs included @MusicOverPeople, @bdoulaoblongata, @MoKaBes owner Mo, and others.”


Demonstrators File Suit Challenging Police Overreach, Ask Court to Order Police to Stop Misuse of Tear Gas

http://www.kmov.com/special-coverage...285575751.html

TL;DR

Nothing has changed. The police will still respond to violent protesters and riots the same. The ruling just reinforces the SOP that's already in place for the St. Louis PD.

So my question is, an hour/two hours warning prior to use of dispersal methods isn't sufficient anymore? I suppose they'll want each individual protester to be warned before they spray them. Good victory for them /s

[notorious bum]

Granted, they will continue to ignore court orders, like wearing name tags, pushing protestors off of side walks, and so on, but your constant siding with a police force that has mostly supporters of the most bigoted flavor is really nauseating. Will you stand with them as their compromised boat sinks to the bottom of the ocean?

[Nephlite]

Granted, they will continue to ignore court orders, like wearing name tags, pushing protestors off of side walks, and so on, but your constant siding with a police force that has mostly supporters of the most bigoted flavor is really nauseating. Will you stand with them as their compromised boat sinks to the bottom of the ocean?

Well, yeah. I am a cop after all. I know about unity and sticking behind my brothers and not running at the first sign of trouble. We still have a job to do.

You should try asking how bad it is for the cops, or the rhetoric that they signed up for the job, knew about the hazards, etc. still rings true?

What's with the name tags thing? I forgot where that was the law that it was a requirement to wear one...

[notorious bum]

The DOJ has told them it's against the law to refuse to wear name tags, not to mention the refusal to identify yourself as a police officer, it's a pretty big deal.

[Nephlite]

That's purely a subjective requirement based on the departments standards, and is not a regulation across the board.

In my department, I'm merely required to tell you my name. There's nothing that says I have to wear a name plate. But, the fulfillment of identifying myself is at my discretion, not at yours. Which means you'll likely get my business card after the encounter and I'm prepared to release you or take you to jail.

[Sho]

But those aren't the people doing that to you. And once they try and stand up with you and say "all lives matter", you come and say fuck you, black lives matter? Cmonnnnn

Stating that "all lives matter" detracts from the problem at hand. No one is arguing that fact at all. People are placing a spotlight on the term #BlackLivesMatter because they want emphasis to be placed on the fact that at times (especially when it's dealing with the police, govt.), Black people are seen as 2nd or even 3rd class citizens when it comes to dealing with them as a group of people. Stating that Black lives matter is supposed to play to the humanity of others when viewing them.

However, it's pretty obvious how the statement can be taken far out of hand by some people. All Lives do matter and should eventually supercede the current cause and discussion, because it's not just a Black problem, but a White, Hispanic, Asian and Indian problem as well.

[Acevalefor]

You don't see any problem with not identifying yourself as a law enforcement officer when enforcing the law? You don't remember the dozens of officers on film threatening protesters, being cockheads, and pointing their guns at them? You think they would have acted like that if they could be identified and disciplined?

[Nephlite]

You don't see any problem with not identifying yourself as a law enforcement officer when enforcing the law? You don't remember the dozens of officers on film threatening protesters, being cockheads, and pointing their guns at them? You think they would have acted like that if they could be identified and disciplined?

Of course I have a problem with it. That's why I always wear my nameplate. I'm just pointing out that it's not a requirement.

I also can give you some reasons why I personally wouldn't identify myself in those situations. Many police officers have had their lives turned upside down by the media. Your name gets out there, and you'll get much more than just discipline. You don't know of some of the officers having 24/7 protection details because people have threatened them and their families, or receiving constant death threats, or those dumb ass Anonymous idiots hacking their personal bank accounts.

But, we're expected to take it, because that's the risk we run doing the job. Our personal lives and information aren't protected because we're public servants. We lose much more than most people in the interests of transparency, even those of us who did nothing to gain that type of response.

[Sho]

You don't see any problem with not identifying yourself as a law enforcement officer when enforcing the law? You don't remember the dozens of officers on film threatening protesters, being cockheads, and pointing their guns at them? You think they would have acted like that if they could be identified and disciplined?

It's one of the major problems with law enforcement right now. It's essentially why you as a person should learn your rights and also learn document everything if you are being harassed without probable cause, as well as ask for their badge number. There are ways of being able to assert yourself to a harassing officer, without being arrested yourself. Example, ask for the officer's number and [last] name after being issued a citation or ticket, so they aren't at liberty to write up extra crap because they are annoyed that you asked their information in the first place (which they like to do a lot). If they write an additional ticket, you can cite the officer on grounds of abuse of power and quite possibly have the entire charge to be thrown out. There's also a way to handle officers with video as well -- you must always inform them that you (or another person, a witness) will video record the event, before you (or they) do.

Granted, a protestor situation is much different as minor chaos is ensuing and much of the face to face interaction is thrown out of the window. I agree that yes, if an officer(s) were readily identifiable they would definitely not act in certain ways on camera at all. There's much more than punishment coming for an officer, due to their public service.

[notorious bum]

Just another day in the life of a STLPD pig lol

Keith Rose ‏@KWRose
Is that a teargas gun?! At noon! While the protesters are eating popcorn and making speeches! WTF STL? #Ferguson