Meanwhile, in Florida.

[Kaisha]

February 1, 2007: $8.00 minimum wage in Ontario
Price of a Big Mac: between 3.63 and 3.88 (3.75)

Fast forward 10 years, October 1, 2018: $14.00 minimum wage in Ontario
Price of a Big Mac: 6.65 to 6.77 (6.70)

Minimum wage went up 1.75x, Big Mac went up about 1.8x.

Wasn't HST introduced between those two periods, or is that just the raw price before taxes?

[Anoat]

What benefit has come from raising fed min wage from 5.15 to 7.25? There is no benefit to raising the minimum wage, outside of increasing costs of everything else after the fact.
Minimum wage is not meant to raise your family off of, nor is it the golden standard to try to live by. I don't understand the argument in favor of raising the min wage when we've all grown up in the lifetime that saw in the workforce the last one happen.

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It may not be ideal but millions of people are attempting to do it and it’s just not sustainable. To quote Bernie, someone working a full time 40 hour week should make a livable wage and right now that is not reality. People living on less than $20k annual salary should not be something happening in this country.

[NynJa]

Wasn't HST introduced between those two periods, or is that just the raw price before taxes?

Like I said in my OP, I dont know what province they sourced from. I'll assume the source is someone in Toronto, because its always Toronto, or it could be from a couple places and it takes the average, seeing as how prices rarely end in anything other than .99

It may not be ideal but millions of people are attempting to do it and it’s just not sustainable. To quote Bernie, someone working a full time 40 hour week should make a livable wage and right now that is not reality. People living on less than $20k annual salary should not be something happening in this country.

No ones saying its bad, were just saying that raising the minimum wage wont fix the problem when the cost of goods and services and housing and everything else go up accordingly. It will be a good catch up point, since its clearly documented that the cost of goods and services has clearly gone up at a greater rate than the rise of minimum wage...but those who have to pay their staff more arent gonna give a shit about that. Theyre gonna see their net profit has gone down, and will adjust accordingly.

[archibaldcrane]

Everything doesn't go up accordingly because most things a household spends money on isn't dependent on labor from minimum wage workers. Using the Big Mac index here is particularly dishonest because it's a product of a narrow field of goods that IS particularly dependent on the price of unskilled labor.

[NynJa]

Everything doesn't go up accordingly because most things a household spends money on isn't dependent on labor from minimum wage workers. Using the Big Mac index here is particularly dishonest because it's a product of a narrow field of goods that IS particularly dependent on the price of unskilled labor.

Still waiting for you to

Run that exercise with anything else, if you can find historical pricing data.

I wont hold my breath cause I fully expect you to pull a Trump and not provide any evidence of what you're saying.

[Day]

You just said things go up either way a few posts back, do you really think they wont adjust prices when wages increase? Of course companies are going to either raise their prices, reduce work force or go bankrupt trying to cover payroll. Its simple math and the accounting departments have calculators. The companies that can afford a govt mandated rate hike could do it already, but alas, they do not.

I dont see how this doesn't absolutely crush a lot of small businesses especially during a pandemic.

I already saw how extra money plays out with the unemployment bonus this year, do you think most folks set that aside or paid off debt with it? Everyone I know bought shiny new shit and were right back were they were before getting 23 an hour for a couple months. Maybe I just have stupid friends but I suspect we all do.

[archibaldcrane]

There is an inflationary effect to minimum wage increases

It's just very small.

[archibaldcrane]

If you want answers to these questions you have to actually look at research, not just wing it with anecdotes.

[Day]

big time research you googled and didnt even click on the first result lol

[NynJa]

Ah yes, comparing minimum wage to the big mad index is "anecdotes"

[Day]

big mad index

leave it

[NynJa]

lmao

[Tyche]

Ah yes, comparing minimum wage to the big mad index is "anecdotes"

I mean, that's the exact definition of an anecdote.

[NynJa]

And what has Archi offered up to prove his point? A google search of one article that he didnt even read.

[Tyche]

You offered the price of one good in a single province you can't even identify...

And he pointed to a google link...of a study...of an entire set of goods and services.

If you want to argue his laziness, that's fine. But how comprehensive the arguments are isn't really a debate.

[Tyche]

Here's your key points from the article.

A 10 percent increase in the minimum wage in a Metropolitan Statistical Area (MSA) is associated with an overall (all-items) inflation rate that is 8 basis points higher relative to MSAs that do not change their minimum wage. Yet this rise in inflation is not evenly distributed across all goods and services. Minimum wage increases have the largest and fastest measured impact on food prices, especially on food consumed away from home: a 10 percent rise in the minimum wage leads about a 0.3 percentage point rise in prices on food away from home for the first year after the wage increase, and an additional 0.1 percentage point the second year after the increase. The rise in inflation is slower to feed through to prices on other goods and services, primarily due to a slow price response in the service sector. By the end of the second year, the total city-level rise in inflation amounts to a 0.3 percentage point increase for a 10 percent rise in the minimum wage.In locales where the share of low-wage workers is greater, price increases and price adjustments are larger, more rapid, and more significant across expenditure categories. Across cities, for a 10 percent rise in the minimum wage, food away inflation rises 1.1 percentage points in locales that have a one-standard deviation higher share of low-wage workers, as compared to these same prices rising 0.6 percentage points in areas with an average share of low-wage workers.Consumers increase the quantity of food that they consume away from home in response to a rise in the minimum wage. Real spending on food away from home goes up about 0.5 percentage points for a 10 percent increase in the minimum wage. Real consumption of food at home also goes up.Spending on durable goods increases in advance of the minimum wage change going into effect. This result is consistent with minimum wage increases leading to more credit being available to low-income workers, and households engaging in intertemporal substitution in anticipation of real income gains.Increases in minimum wages also lower debt among households with low credit scores, raise auto debt, and appear to increase access to credit.

[NynJa]

Ok, shit, you must be absolutely right, minimum wage will go up, and every corporation who employs people on minimum wage are gonna keep their costs constant even though the wages they're paying out are going up by 25-50%.

[Tyche]

Ok, shit, you must be absolutely right, minimum wage will go up, and every corporation who employs people on minimum wage are gonna keep their costs constant even though the wages they're paying out are going up by 25-50%.

That's completely disingenuous. Not every worker in any corporation is making minimum wage, and likely, it's a small percentage. And the wages are only part of total business expenditures. Just because wages go up some number of percent doesn't mean all business expenditures go up. A 15% wage increase may only be an overall 6 percent increase in expenditures.

[Salodin]

Why the hell is nynja going full florida when there's an election going on and he's Canadian

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[Milkster]

Looking forward to the Netflix special on this