GamerGate thread

**tyven** · 2014-10-23 23:00

Yo homeboy called a free game that raised money for charity a standout.

What the fuck is wrong with you people.

**Priran** · 2014-10-23 23:07

Originally Posted by tyven

Yo homeboy called a free game that raised money for charity a standout.

What the fuck is wrong with you people.

"Charity absolves wrongdoing" - guy who kicked this thread off by poisoning the well to the idea that charity absolves wrongdoing

**tyven** · 2014-10-23 23:12

So a sentence at the bottom that said. "Full disclosure I know zoe" and your whole fucking world would be upside down right now?

I mean the nefarious corruption by dedicating a positive sentence to a free game. The horror

**Priran** · 2014-10-23 23:16

Originally Posted by tyven

So a sentence at the bottom that said. "Full disclosure I know zoe" and your whole fucking world would be upside down right now?

Not greatly, as I've said before Zoe was just a spark. Gaming journalism has been rotten for years.

I mean the nefarious corruption by dedicating a positive sentence to a free game. The horror

Full disclosure, it's actually the title, only image, and first game mentioned in the article. And Zoe now makes $34 grand per year just from Patreon.

**tyven** · 2014-10-23 23:18

Damn, I hope homeboy kicks me a sentence one day. That's not bad

**Jefe** · 2014-10-23 23:26

Would you suck his cock before or after?

**tyven** · 2014-10-23 23:27

3 months after as is standard procedure

**Tarage** · 2014-10-23 23:41

Can't I just hate everyone involved and be done with it?

**Voyage1970** · 2014-10-24 02:50

Originally Posted by Kuya

I think regarding the issue of inclusiveness in gaming media, it's ultimately about what's important to you and your life experiences. As a bisexual black male, I DO want to see more media that reflects my preferences and gives me options. I personally don't feel doing this negatively affects games, and I don't think you really have any objective evidence to claim otherwise.

I think there is some miscommunication going on here. I don't recall anyone saying they would be against more inclusive games as a generality. The issue arises when people attack or otherwise question why current developers don't make those types of games themselves. Instead of insisting that the current devs should change their methods, maybe some new devs who want to make those types of games should step up to bat and make their own. That way you aren't hindering the current progress of games people already enjoy and instead add to the pool of potentially good games.

It's like the only restaurant in a town serving Pizza and someone suggesting "Hey I don't really like Pizza, you should make Hamburgers for people like me." Why should they feel obligated to change their menu when the optimal solution is to simply open another restaurant so everyone gets what they want? Pizza place still serves the same amount of pizzas to the people who love pizza and the Hamburger place has a special niche with the people who only want Hamburgers. And shit there will always be plenty of people who just enjoy good food who can choose from both.

Sorry if I'm missing a vital point somewhere, and I don't really give two shits about this whole #GG nonsense as it basically boils down to "lol, internet" levels of self-importance, but this just stuck out to me as a strange sense of logic.

**Mazmaz** · 2014-10-24 05:43

yea guys don't questions devs fuck

**Mazmaz** · 2014-10-24 05:44

no wait questions devs about every single menial detail (ex. graphics in Watchdogs) but leave that inclusiveness bullshit out of it

**Mazmaz** · 2014-10-24 05:47

Also, in case it wasn't clear, unlike social justice, game development is a zero-sum game. The more funding there is for rehashed, non-inclusive bullshit made by the status quo developers, the less funding there is for the "other type" of developers trying to make other things.

**Sepukku** · 2014-10-24 06:11

I didn't really follow this too closely cause its not really a major issue compared to the ongoing military/political conflicts in the world, the emergence of Ebola outside Africa, etc, but from what I gather its about a chick who banged someone in the same field and it led to questionable end products. Rather than have the white knights on CNN paraded, why don't girls police this shit amongst themselves? There ARE girls who fuck for professional gain so it does raise questions when one bangs a dude and it may potentially result in professional results. But maybe if mothers taught their daughters to not sleep their way up the ladder and if all the girls shunned the few women who did cross lines and make problems and questions for ALL the girls, then they wouldn't have this problem.

If the goal is gender equality, that women are evaluated and paid according solely to their work performance, then I'd think they'd want to eliminate these cases of a few women ruining it for everyone else when they bang dudes at work cause its girls like this that turn the review of
"(1) How was your work performance this past work period?"

into

"(1) Did you bang me?
(2) Do I think you may bang me in the future?
(3) Was the work performance at least adequate?"

**Kuya** · 2014-10-24 07:33

Originally Posted by Voyage1970

I think there is some miscommunication going on here. I don't recall anyone saying they would be against more inclusive games as a generality. The issue arises when people attack or otherwise question why current developers don't make those types of games themselves. Instead of insisting that the current devs should change their methods, maybe some new devs who want to make those types of games should step up to bat and make their own. That way you aren't hindering the current progress of games people already enjoy and instead add to the pool of potentially good games.

It's like the only restaurant in a town serving Pizza and someone suggesting "Hey I don't really like Pizza, you should make Hamburgers for people like me." Why should they feel obligated to change their menu when the optimal solution is to simply open another restaurant so everyone gets what they want? Pizza place still serves the same amount of pizzas to the people who love pizza and the Hamburger place has a special niche with the people who only want Hamburgers. And shit there will always be plenty of people who just enjoy good food who can choose from both.

Sorry if I'm missing a vital point somewhere, and I don't really give two shits about this whole #GG nonsense as it basically boils down to "lol, internet" levels of self-importance, but this just stuck out to me as a strange sense of logic.

It's a two part issue.

1. Creating more realistic and diverse female and LGBT characters in gaming media.
2. Not using female or LGBT characters as props.

I feel that it's absolutely justified to attack certain developers if they are known for making games where they dehumanize a whole group of people. For example, one problem LGBT activists have been complaining for a while is that not only are LGBT characters often not present at all in media, but that when they do exist, they are either quickly killed off or presented as completely psychotic characters. In terms of LGBT representation: we've been seeing progress on both points. We've been seeing more LGBT representation and more realistic and diverse LGBT characters. So I don't think criticizing negative portrayals of LGBT or female characters is disconnected from asking for more inclusivity in media. I think they're both inherently tied together.

**Kuya** · 2014-10-24 07:40

Originally Posted by Sepukku

I didn't really follow this too closely cause its not really a major issue compared to the ongoing military/political conflicts in the world, the emergence of Ebola outside Africa, etc, but from what I gather its about a chick who banged someone in the same field and it led to questionable end products. Rather than have the white knights on CNN paraded, why don't girls police this shit amongst themselves? There ARE girls who fuck for professional gain so it does raise questions when one bangs a dude and it may potentially result in professional results. But maybe if mothers taught their daughters to not sleep their way up the ladder and if all the girls shunned the few women who did cross lines and make problems and questions for ALL the girls, then they wouldn't have this problem.

If the goal is gender equality, that women are evaluated and paid according solely to their work performance, then I'd think they'd want to eliminate these cases of a few women ruining it for everyone else when they bang dudes at work cause its girls like this that turn the review of
"(1) How was your work performance this past work period?"

into

"(1) Did you bang me?
(2) Do I think you may bang me in the future?
(3) Was the work performance at least adequate?"

The thing is: there isn't any evidence of any questionable end products from her sleeping with any of those guys. She didn't get any reviews from them nor anything even resembling a puff piece. What Zoe (and the men too) is ethically muddy in principle, but no actual tangible result has been observed. Aside from that, I think that many women would much rather leave this between Zoe and her ex because chiding Zoe for it sounds like slut shaming.

**Kuya** · 2014-10-24 07:47

Regarding inclusivity in media, take for example that new movie Maze Runner and why it annoyed me after a certain point:

Spoiler: show

**Sepukku** · 2014-10-24 09:19

Originally Posted by Kuya

The thing is: there isn't any evidence of any questionable end products from her sleeping with any of those guys. She didn't get any reviews from them nor anything even resembling a puff piece. What Zoe (and the men too) is ethically muddy in principle, but no actual tangible result has been observed. Aside from that, I think that many women would much rather leave this between Zoe and her ex because chiding Zoe for it sounds like slut shaming.

I'm speaking more in generalities, women should police within when women sleep around for professional gain so that women who sleep with a co -worker NOT for professional gain do not have to unfairly answer questions and accusations under suspicion of being in the former group.

And ppl not fucking coworkers
In General would help improve office place equality

**Gokku** · 2014-10-24 10:31

So if netflix made a OITNB game and let you play as Boo , would that calm the feminists.... cuz id play an open "sandbox" where i could prison shank people as a big angry lesbian

**Penthesilea** · 2014-10-24 11:47

Originally Posted by Kuya

Regarding inclusivity in media, take for example that new movie Maze Runner and why it annoyed me after a certain point:

Spoiler: show

While I haven't seen the film, you are correct in that I don't care if they exist or are written into the story. Their sexuality only matters to them and if the story wasn't about escaping mazes and actually about love maybe I'd care. But I don't care and to lazily (Qalberts' suggestion), hamfisted write in something like that I'd probably not go see the movie, not that I will watch it anyways.

**Penthesilea** · 2014-10-24 11:54

Originally Posted by Kuya

It's a two part issue.

1. Creating more realistic and diverse female and LGBT characters in gaming media.
2. Not using female or LGBT characters as props.

I feel that it's absolutely justified to attack certain developers if they are known for making games where they dehumanize a whole group of people. For example, one problem LGBT activists have been complaining for a while is that not only are LGBT characters often not present at all in media, but that when they do exist, they are either quickly killed off or presented as completely psychotic characters. In terms of LGBT representation: we've been seeing progress on both points. We've been seeing more LGBT representation and more realistic and diverse LGBT characters. So I don't think criticizing negative portrayals of LGBT or female characters is disconnected from asking for more inclusivity in media. I think they're both inherently tied together.

What is stopping people from writing their own stories/game ideas that include them? I'm sure there wouldn't be backlash if you know, straight people wrote LGBT material...

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