Politcal forum rule changes, asking for input.

[Zeb]

There are plenty of decent threads in the forum that make having it worthwhile. Should just lock threads when they derail or circle the drain too many times. People can continue their shit flinging in PMs if they want to.

[Mazmaz]

The best part about this thread is seeing how many lurkers actually turn up to read what we write. Like I said before:

the only reason I continue to try this hard is so new people can see my posts and may be convinced.

[Zeb]

Uh, people new to a thread don't bother reading the whole thing. Lucky if they read the last page. I personally just skim for shit Tyven says. I'm awaiting his next level 5 beaner infraction.

[BaneTheBrawler]

the solution to that is to actually enforce the existing rules and do normal modding things like rebooting megathreads, but that requires work.

[Tarage]

Since no mods want to touch this place, why not bring on someone who does?

If I wanted to have an echo chamber for people who agree with me, I'd be there. I like it when people have different opinions. It helps me solidify my own.

God, I don't know what else we are going to say here that will amount to anything. Mods, your user base is flat out telling you that they don't at all want what you are proposing. Period. There isn't anything else to debate until you decide you are doing being scared and actually post what your issues really are. If you insist on hiding in the corner, there's no possible debate. If Ksandra can post and not get killed, you sure as hell can do. Stop making her do your dirty work you are too lazy or scared to do. For god's sake, man up for once.

[Aleth]

I know forums aren't about free speech per se...

But BG and its political section are as close as we get to honest opinion from a segment of the population we have some mutual respect for through shared experience. ie. FFXI players (and XIV for newer folk).

It's why people will read and reconsider even unpopular opinions here because you have shared an experience with us so we hold you all in higher regard than posters on other sites. Random Redditors or posters on other sites simply do not command as much free respect/benefit of the doubt as the majority of BGers.

Perhaps it's because FFXI required a bit of grit / determination and organisational skills to progress in, but fellow players were made from at least different stuff than the average web user. It's why we like to read political opinion here not elsewhere. We know you are at least semi-capable people...

[BerenTebogo]

Also, not for nothing, we have lawyers, doctors, political scientists, cops, real scientists from many backgrounds, etc.

Not many places you can get this many people with advanced degrees calling each other "racist, misogynist dicknozzles" while still arguing from peer-reviewed sources (much of the time) instead of just "herp-derp FOX news".

I think that's one of the best things about this place. Oh, our opinions got your panties in a twist? Too bad it isn't an opinion, it's a peer-reviewed study with an N of ~10^5, suck my cock.

Granted with certain recent topics (feminism, etc) this isn't really possible. But you'd be blatantly lying to yourselves and us if you don't realize that is how a number of conversations in here have gone. GMO, silly woo threads, abortion, etc.

[Salodin]

Neph, you gotta chill man. Stop taking things so personally, especially when you have some people in every thread agree with you in some way.

Except that one time you wanted proof a guy was innocent before seizing his money. That was just silly.

[Brill Weave]

Since no mods want to touch this place, why not bring on someone who does?

If I wanted to have an echo chamber for people who agree with me, I'd be there. I like it when people have different opinions. It helps me solidify my own.

God, I don't know what else we are going to say here that will amount to anything. Mods, your user base is flat out telling you that they don't at all want what you are proposing. Period. There isn't anything else to debate until you decide you are doing being scared and actually post what your issues really are. If you insist on hiding in the corner, there's no possible debate. If Ksandra can post and not get killed, you sure as hell can do. Stop making her do your dirty work you are too lazy or scared to do. For god's sake, man up for once.

Holy shit you're fucking stupid.

[Tarage]

Holy shit you're fucking stupid.

And yet somehow, when responses like this aren't coming from someone with a colored name, they are a problem. I get the double standard.

[Marootsoobutsu]

colored name, .

Racist.

[kuronosan]

While there are times I wonder just how stupid Maz and Sal could be, there are times I wonder it about myself and others. There are also times we agree.

I think if you get to the point where you take it too personally you need to step back and leave the keyboard alone for a while.

[Brill Weave]

And yet somehow, when responses like this aren't coming from someone with a colored name, they are a problem. I get the double standard.

Calling a spade a spade dude. Your comment was straight up dumb.

[RKenshin]

If you move to an area that suddenly spikes with the KKK and you're black, it's time to get the hell out of there. Protect your interests, and your dignity. To sit back and fight a losing battle without support is silly, reckless, and won't be honorable when you lose a worthless battle. There's no cowardice in packing it up and going somewhere where your ideals and morals will be supported and encouraged.

A more accurate metaphor:

You're black and moved into a new area you love/enjoy, about 10 years ago. The KKK has a presence in the area too, but you've long accepted it and are not distraught by seeing them around here and there on your grocery shopping. Then the KKK opens up a deli mart where they can do their shopping. You see them around on your trips far less often following it, but soon after you decide to start shopping at this deli mart too. Not because the food is better or because you can't get the same exact food at the non-KKK deli, but you do it just because you can. And now you're getting upset by the oppression you receive there, and then complain about how the KKK deli has ruined the town for you, how you're mistreated at the deli, and the deli should now be closed.

(replace KKK with some less extreme group to make it an actual, more reasonable metaphor too)

News/politics/current events discussion has been around in some form since BG started. Every forum has it to some degree. The only thing that changed is that it was given its own section, so that people who wanted to discuss it could do it here rather than do it in other places and/or go off-topic in other places. Having a single place dedicated to it has increased the discussion of the issues, yes, but beyond that it should have actually made it other sections better for people that didn't want to see it in the first place.

Say what you will; I don't really care. It's not worth it anymore and I'm tired of arguing. Used to come to BG to laugh at the Random Image Thread. Now I come here to get a headache.

I don't even understand why you're willingly subjecting yourself to a subforum you hate, and then claming it ruins the entire forum for you.

It's like me going into the Pony megathread, forcing myself to read it, getting angry... and throwing a fit about how I used to come to BG to laugh, but now I come to BG to cut myself because I just can't take reading the pony thread for 3 hours a day.

How do you find a way to enjoy your time on Reddit when there are legit cop-hating subredits? How do you keep yourself from clicking on them, reading them, and getting passionately invested in arguing there?

Is the same method of self control you employ to prevent yourself from succumbing to that fate on Reddit not applicable on BG?

[Brill Weave]

I'll state again, we don't have problems with people joking around in here. The posters that want to have actual conversations with differing viewpoints is what the forum is for. I will not name names as most of you can figure them out on your own. We have several posters here that contribute nothing to the ongoing conversation. It's mostly those posters that end up causing a topic to turn into a circular argument that last multiple pages. These are the posts/posters that are the problem. Are some mods afraid to post in here or infract someone because they don't want to deal with the repercussions? Unequivocally yes. Like with any job/duty some do more than others. Some are more visible than others.

Regardless of what the outcome is here, this sub will end up being more heavily moderated. We came to this decision after quite a bit of discussion involving all admins and mods. It wasn't something that we came to a snap decision on. This has been heavily discussed for close to two weeks after multiple complaints.

[BerenTebogo]

As has been said multiple times by pretty much all of us: We don't care about the moderation. Please, go ahead and enforce the rules. That's fine.

Just get the fuck out of here with these new proposed rules when you guys couldn't even do your original jobs properly.

If there are still problems after you guys start actually enforcing the 2+ year old rules then sure, let's revisit stricter measures.

Genuinely don't know how the discussion needs to go beyond this statement.

[Brill Weave]

Just get the fuck out of here with these new proposed rules when you guys couldn't even do your original jobs properly.

If there are still problems after you guys start actually enforcing the 2+ year old rules then sure, let's revisit stricter measures.

Genuinely don't know how the discussion needs to go beyond this statement.

Agreed.

[thetruepandagod]

Can't wait to see the first 2 weeks of heavy moderation with timeouts/bans being done by feeling and then tapering off into sheer laze and inactive moderation again.

The posters that want to have actual conversations with differing viewpoints is what the forum is for.

Fucking hilarious considering a fair % of the mods want to flat out ban gamergate/feminism threads.

[Brill Weave]

Can't wait to see the first 2 weeks of heavy moderation with timeouts/bans being done by feeling and then tapering off into sheer laze and inactive moderation again.



Fucking hilarious considering a fair % of the mods want to flat out ban gamergate/feminism threads.

[Salodin]

While there are times I wonder just how stupid Maz and Sal could be, there are times I wonder it about myself and others. There are also times we agree.

I think if you get to the point where you take it too personally you need to step back and leave the keyboard alone for a while.

And there are times I go "fuck I'm being stupid", and times I go "damn that dude is pretty dumb".

I wouldn't come to any of these conclusions with out discussing it, and although we might take it far sometimes, it's the internet. People need to grow a thicker skin and deal with it. There are over 8 billion people in this world, chances are some of them won't agree with you. Least you can do is illustrate why you think you're right, or give another person the time to explain why you're wrong.

God forbid people challenge each other's line of thinking on a forum, right?