FFXIV Random Complaint Thread II: DPS can't count to potato

[Destinye]

Personally I know why I liked XI's combat and content. It was more team oriented for the most part. While XIV's is team jumprope, just the way XI's felt was more.."natural" in a sense. When you finally get to the point you can do Dynamis Xarc and the Dynamis Lord (back in the day) it felt like progression because it was a long journey with more than likely 18-45 others then you finally get to fight the 'real boss' and the mechanics were quite different (for example yin/yang management) and so on. Even in more modernish XI with stuff like Provenance Watcher, while it was Voidwatch and you could pop your medicines and whatnot, there's just a different flow and feel.

XIV just feels more like...it's just there. Not to mention if a DPS, for example, decides to tunnel vision, whelp wipe and start over or rage quit. I think the fact XI was more of an RPG in feel is why I liked it so much. You had to actually prepare and organize for encounters..like most if not all FFs of the past, not just load up a matching system and go balls to the wall. EVen the "watch a video" mantra isn't really preparing in the same sense.

[Churchill]

Or just play other games and log in to to raid and cap lol.

That sounds awful. Plus, Wildstar is way more fun: http://www.twitch.tv/thrashinc/v/11308570

[Hiryo]

They did recycle old content with the introduction of enhanced Primal weapon, but sadly it wasn't great. If only they could give more importance to crafters & give them real quests to obtain an advanced knowledge of lets say "Allagan Armory" then they could chain on that & get the crafter to keep enhancing or desynthing drops from previous raids. Making very good craftable gears with a 5-10 iLv lesser than the current top raid gear while keeping this iLv bs could give some horizontal options while still being in a vertical progression system.

Doing so would bring options & old content recycling.



Making very old gears mats for new gears would do that.

Yeah Kirimu BiS was a real thing and when light bonuses were in turn 4, it was actually being done.

[Fiye]

Like, I'm willing to deal with it I guess. I find the combat fun and the challenges are there. But unless they change the game in the future, I'll probably always complain about the lack of shit to do even if I'm talking to the wall.

Literally any horizontal progression could not hurt. It feels really dumb that, as long as you are level capped, you can unsub until 3.2 then join up and instantly grind points for whatever the new shit is. Maybe they should just stop doing tomestones for gearing and make it all drop from content, and give us content to do? Maybe too crazy. At least the new Relic quest should hopefully give us something grindy to do for a bit.

Its literally how they designed the game. They designed the game this way because that is what helps keep the lights on in those server rooms. It's whats keeping my wife engaged with FFXIV. She loves the quirks and details. She does her daily expert and tries out some PvP. And in return Squeenix gets an extra $13/mo.

You can unsub and be back up to speed. I left 2.0 without clearing Titan HM. Within a month of resubbing right before 2.3 I was caught up on MSQ and doing SCOB. It might be a flaw of FFXIV, but its also a strength. There isn't a tall ass mountain to climb when you get back. Now crafting is another story.

Kirimu being BiS was because the gear provided by square enix has terrible stat allocations. Once 2.5 dropped the BRD body was WoD was preffered outside of melding the shit out of Kirimu. The dev team wants to avoid having crafted gear bought with gil to be the big thing at all costs. The issue is they come up too short and the entire thing becomes useless.

Why would I use an i170 crafted body piece when I can wear a i200 with some esoterics that has +9 STR at a minimum. Thats +90 of Crit or Det to most jobs.

[Destinye]

Speaking of A2, fuck the first pull with 4 gobbies and 2 snipers

Healers ALWAYS let me die when I'm tanking it in pubs, even if I pop HG or Sentinel before hand. They don't seem to understand the concept that the tank is gonna take a huge alpha strike, and that they should probably stop huffing paint and stuffing their face full of mountain dew and doritos for long enough to make sure the tank doesn't die.

(Though usually they just don't heal at all until after every mob has had long enough to personally run up and genderly caress me with their weapons four times)

Which makes it worse as I'm doing it as DRK..

I mean if I had dreadspikes from XI or Stygian Spikes from 1.0 I'd be ok..but...

[Ragnus]

Everytime I remember the mechanics of FFXI and see videos of combat in that game I want to know why I liked it so much.

I often wonder this also. Combat for a DPS was mostly run up to mob, watch your character flail to 100TP and then change to WS gear while WSing before going back to Haste/Acc. I kinda wonder how I got on without mob attack broadcasting also, but then again you didn't really have much to do other that watch the chat log because Combat was all Auto-Attack and buffs.

Where FFXI had it right was the Skillchain and Magic Burst system. Made you feel like you were really working as a team. Then again that shit went right out the window when Weaponburn came into fashion.

[Churchill]

It wasn't hard unless you low-manned or some of the later content where it was basically a requirement to zerg it. Since I'm linking videos:

This was something that was hard for the playerbase to do. This is why content that shouldn't be difficult in XIV (outside of obvious gear limitations set by the development team) is actually a nightmare to complete.

[Carth]

I often wonder this also. Combat for a DPS was mostly run up to mob, watch your character flail to 100TP and then change to WS gear while WSing before going back to Haste/Acc. I kinda wonder how I got on without mob attack broadcasting also, but then again you didn't really have much to do other that watch the chat log because Combat was all Auto-Attack and buffs.

It was due to this that FFXI was a helluva lot more social than XIV. Since you didn't have to play stepmania on your keyboard, you let your character bash some heads while you chat with your party or linkshell about Digimon or something.

It was also easy to ignore the "carrot on a stick" format because due to it being primarily a numbers game (even more so than XIV), it was easy to see the improvements when you went from Hauby to Kirin's Osode as a WS piece, in comparison to say... an i170 body piece to an i180 body piece.

The game was pretty much a chatroom with special effects.

[Fiye]

XIV just feels more like...it's just there. Not to mention if a DPS, for example, decides to tunnel vision, whelp wipe and start over or rage quit. I think the fact XI was more of an RPG in feel is why I liked it so much. You had to actually prepare and organize for encounters..like most if not all FFs of the past, not just load up a matching system and go balls to the wall. EVen the "watch a video" mantra isn't really preparing in the same sense.

FFXIV is as much of an RPG as FFXI. At least the story's been staying pretty constant (Rather than leaving the RotZ+CoP plotlines to a dead halt while you run across the other side of the world or sometimes back in time to fuck around). Everyone praises the story in CoP but everyone's pretty fucking mum about everything else.

And lest be honest. In FFXI instead of watching a video, you went to ffxiclopedia.org found out what abilities were in the fight. And you went "Okay, if this then do that". Or if you had SMN you found 5 other SMNs and blew the fucking fight apart. FFXI was so improperly balance that half of the classes weren't even used. A body was better than nothing. But more often then not if you were MNK you weren't bringing it to the fight unless the name of the game was TP burn. And even the Samurai handed your ass on a silver platter. Unless you were lucky enough to be a DRK with kraken club.

[Destinye]

A chatroom that still remains to introduce actual content with only like 10 or so people even working on it..if that. XIV adds content..sure..but we'll never see things like Rearing/Monstrosity/Dynamis/Einherjar(etc type content) introduced and not because of the PS3.

[Churchill]

Watching that video I can't believe I'm even typing in combat, or at all.

[Taint]

Old school Apoc DRK in PW!

FFXI was all about prep work first and fights second. We spent HOURs mathing out gear sets and then carrying them over to spellcast. Weeks were spent camping mobs and NPCs. Then we had to make sure the rest of our group was in the same situation. All the ideas, math, scripts, spellcast were all shared amongst the community. The imbalance lead to imagination. (Like the SMN example) The random pop times led to some interesting moments. Claiming Nidhogg at 2am in a 4 man group and then texting/calling people for help or negotiating a team up with other people in the zone or losing claim but keep spamming voke incase they wipe. There were truly epic moments beyond that first time you clear something.

FFXIV we spend minutes figuring out gear sets then there is no interaction. We then watch videos and copy the video. There is very little sense of community beyond your raid buddies.

[Ragnus]

It was due to this that FFXI was a helluva lot more social than XIV. Since you didn't have to play stepmania on your keyboard, you let your character bash some heads while you chat with your party or linkshell about Digimon or something.

It was also easy to ignore the "carrot on a stick" format because due to it being primarily a numbers game (even more so than XIV), it was easy to see the improvements when you went from Hauby to Kirin's Osode as a WS piece, in comparison to say... an i170 body piece to an i180 body piece.

The game was pretty much a chatroom with special effects.

It's funny. I was trying to explain to one of my friends who also plays FF14, but never touched FFXI, what the game was like. And I pretty much summed it up as such. Everyone had a reputation, most people knew all the really bad players on a server and the really great ones.

That's something I totally miss from that game. I feel like I don't know anyone outside of gimick characters in this game.

[Fiye]

Content? The last two patches they just added reskins of existing stuff. Lets take Sky, make it all fucking grey, add some NMs and call it a day. At least in 3.1 I know I have a dungeon with completely new assets in area design and bosses. A retool of an existing dungeon with new story attached and new bosses. A 24 man "raid" that'll feature new assets, 4 bosses, and once again story. Airship fights which will provide a new era of PvE content. A new primal fight with extreme version.

FFXI is bone dry. Most of their content nowadays are QOL things that should've been added years ago. Seriously, the august patch finally introduced the ability to see status effects on other people.

[Taint]

Content? The last two patches they just added reskins of existing stuff. Lets take Sky, make it all fucking grey, add some NMs and call it a day. At least in 3.1 I know I have a dungeon with completely new assets in area design and bosses. A retool of an existing dungeon with new story attached and new bosses. A 24 man "raid" that'll feature new assets, 4 bosses, and once again story. Airship fights which will provide a new era of PvE content. A new primal fight with extreme version.

FFXI is bone dry. Most of their content nowadays are QOL things that should've been added years ago. Seriously, the august patch finally introduced the ability to see status effects on other people.

Its year 12, they have skeleton crew making content and it still has more depth then FFXIV.

That gray sky, involves a pop system, a proc system, crafting, Adjuration to go with the crafting, there are zone buffs, BiS drops and new mechanics.

Those new dungeons will be cool 1 time. Trash > Boss > Trash > Boss. They will be beautiful for sure, but the drops will be garbage and they will be only repeated for tomes and probably the relic quest.


Edit: Complaint, why doesn't 14 have an Abjuration system??? They can gate the Abjuration behind content and give crafting some life. It worked great in FFXI combining crafts with content. Instead of upgrading i200 to i210 with a raid drop, have it drop an adjuration that combined with a craft item gives the player an upgrade.

[Destinye]

Its year 12, they have skeleton crew making content and it still has more depth then FFXIV.

That gray sky, involves a pop system, a proc system, crafting, Adjuration to go with the crafting, there are zone buffs, BiS drops and new mechanics.

Those new dungeons will be cool 1 time. Trash > Boss > Trash > Boss. They will be beautiful for sure, but the drops will be garbage and they will be only repeated for tomes and probably the relic quest.

Was making a lengthy post but I'll just go with this:

Yes, XIV will have "new stuff" and yes XI retools things - My main point is: Despite literally having no dev kits to work with anymore the small crew on XI still manages to pump things out. That QoL change, while nice..was never needed in XI unless you simply failed at your job. You had enough time to tell your healer /sub heal if you're silenced or paralyzed and such..but usually, windower scripts aside, healers knew because unlike XIV, the log displayed a nice yellow (or w/e color you picked) "YOUR TANK IS PARALYZED." if you didn't filter it out. XIV has a small animation..but even seeing debuffs/buffs and shit..people fail fantastically at basic healing/removal of debuffs.

If we're to say XI reskins content..XIV is the king of reskinning content. It's not bad, people enjoy it..but unless Void Ark, Knights of the Round Extreme and Pharo Sirius are completely different from what we seen before in FFxIV, those too are reskins. The airship content will more than likely be pick sector from map, teleport your party too it, people kill the Vanu Vanu that pop..go gather at nodes. It's not really "new" PvE in a sense as they don't want us having mounted combat for whatever reason outside of instances.

[Fiye]

Pop system? So we're going back to Sky/Sea/ToAU. It might as well be more hunts then.

Proc system - added back in Abyssea. Its not new, just a part of the fighting system.

Crafting additons - More recipes. We see that like we see it in FFXIV.

Abjurations - Argubly would make crafting WAAAAAY more important in FFXIV. However, since the time of RotZ abjurations have always been craft gear. Get abjuration from NM. Apply abjuration to gear and profit. "Lets say the monster dropped the gear directly, then you could skip the middle man altogether." - FFXIV logic.

You can poke as many holes into FFXI as you can FFXIV. FFXI requires less developers now because it is an older game. The man hours for animation, effects, 3D objects, artwork to be plastered onto 3D objects is far less than that of FFXIV.

[Carth]

Yeah, I can't place reskinning things as a point against XI when XIV has literally been reskinning dungeons and trials since day 1. In the case of Ifrit, Garuda, and Titan, they have been reskinned twice.

[Fiye]

To me, its not on a FFXI level. I played FFXIV heavily through 2007-2009 and what I saw was nothing but re skinned content. Wings of the Goddess might've well been Vana'diel (Hard) with the exception of a handful of locations. Abyssea was a god awful culprit of this. FFXIV I feel makes new content more often then they remake content. 3.1 we'll see remakes of Pharos Sirius and an Extreme version of Singularity.

[Taint]

To me, its not on a FFXI level. I played FFXIV heavily through 2007-2009 and what I saw was nothing but re skinned content. Wings of the Goddess might've well been Vana'diel (Hard) with the exception of a handful of locations. Abyssea was a god awful culprit of this. FFXIV I feel makes new content more often then they remake content. 3.1 we'll see remakes of Pharos Sirius and an Extreme version of Singularity.

Most of FFXIV mobs are reskineed from FFXI.