The great "My Adoulin Ring is better than yours" Discussion

[JeanPaul]

Honestly I just didn't really know how to account for it. It really helps but hard to say how much

The status description says it decays over time, making it even harder to quantify. From my experiences with /NIN on AA's, using it regularly often saves me a shadow or two from multi-hit WSs or Elvaan's Shield Bash. At the very best, I've dodged whole Guillotines, Rampages, CDC's, etc. Also I'm not sure, but I'd like to think it applies to magic/status WSs as well.

[Martel]

I wish it didn't decay. Makes testing a bitch. I should probably do some more testing to try to get a better value...

[Damane]

Geez for that price they should server hop. Plenty of 30-40k stuff on Bahamut


Honestly I just didn't really know how to account for it. It really helps but hard to say how much

it depends what you are dodgeing with it. on one hit WS stuff its extremly potent. for example galka VD it makes him whiff his entire skillchain attempts mostly. on multihits you will evade most of the hits. you can literally spam it with valliance FC but its very MP cost intensiv. however evasion down debuffs can overwrite it or make it take no effect on cast.

also if you die and get arised battuta is the most OP shit ever. its like being invincible for 2 mins. makeing comebacks very possible.

[Kyreth]

And Adoulin missions done. Orvail Ring, just in time to help with the post-70 skillup pushes while crafting. I'm kinda surprised how few people I see with the clear on Ragnarok- we beat Hades with MNK x3, BLU, WHM, and Kupipi Trust- and I'm not even a l33t MNK. Went in MNK/RUN, other two went in MNK/WAR and we just VSmite -> Spiral (Light SC'd) till he called it quits. Kinda reminded me of the Zilart Archduke fights where he kept swapping element types and WSing the crap out of whoever he had aggro on.

[Damane]

And Adoulin missions done. Orvail Ring, just in time to help with the post-70 skillup pushes while crafting. I'm kinda surprised how few people I see with the clear on Ragnarok- we beat Hades with MNK x3, BLU, WHM, and Kupipi Trust- and I'm not even a l33t MNK. Went in MNK/RUN, other two went in MNK/WAR and we just VSmite -> Spiral (Light SC'd) till he called it quits. Kinda reminded me of the Zilart Archduke fights where he kept swapping element types and WSing the crap out of whoever he had aggro on.

its a very easy fight, handled it with my GEO + RDM mule duo + 3 trusts np.

[Firebrandt]

its a very easy fight, handled it with my GEO + RDM mule duo + 3 trusts np.

Yep. Hell, we forgot about Arcielia rushing in and just did WHM, MNKx2 for first phase without Trusts and it was easy.

2nd Phase was cake as well.

[Kyreth]

Right. That's why I'm surprised more people don't end up getting it done. I got up to Balamor solo, then a random group to the end. I was sorta expecting more from Hades, honestly...

[dasva]

I dual boxed the whole thing with pld and whm easily except that newt thing where I swapped pld for a mediocre geared blm. Honestly this is by far the easiest mission sets to complete when they were released to date and that's without even counting trusts

[Kanriel]

Really not sure which ones to get upon my return. My main is THF and RUN, and I really don't think any of the options are amazing for THF, maybe the DW/Snapshot ring for Ranged set + potential needs to cap delay reduction? Or maybe the -DT ring since I don't have a good dark ring? I imagine my dualbox will get the geomancy skill ring for sure.

[Toth]

Picked up the pet ring for my PUP and SMN. I am happy with my choice

My other 'mains' are COR and GEO but I felt the pet ring is just too good to pass up for extra refresh or geo skill +10....

[Kanriel]

Are these sendable through POL?

[Tarage]

Are these sendable through POL?

Nope.

[Sechs]

Are these sendable through POL?

http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/...12/563/05d.jpg

[Sephiran]

According to Isladar, I'm supposed to bump an old thread before I make a new one. Regardless, I apologize for the necrobump.

Anyway, I have a question regarding the Vocane ring. As you know, SE has explicitly stated that it's knockback resistance +2 stacks with Repulse mantle. Before I choose it as my reward, I have to make sure it will accomplish one purpose, and thus I must request the experience or testing of some good patron here on BG. Read the following before you do anything though:

Everyone I talk to who owns a Repulse mantle says one thing, "Dude, it doesn't do anything. It sux." And this is entirely wrong, you're just not using it correctly. AoE knockback attacks in FFXI work funny. The mechanics can be summarized as follows: If for any reason a player has a resistance to knockback and is in AoE range of another PC or NPC who does NOT have that same resistance, you will ALWAYS be knocked back the unreduced distance when the AoE hits the person NOT wearing the anti-knockback gear. This statement should be taken literally. That means that you will still be knocked back even if the AoE misses you. Yes, you heard that right. As you can imagine, most people don't go around meleeing matamatas or ironclads for fun.



Believe it or not, the repulse mantle alone will completely negate the knockback from matamata auto-attacks as well as ironclad auto-attacks. The same goes for the rockfin spinning attack. However, people never attack these things alone so a lot of misinformation exists on the subject. Now, like I said, SE stated that they stack, but they didn't say how. In other words, I don't know if they stack multiplicatively or additively. So I need someone to tell me how the ring and repulse mantle work together versus Achuka's headbutt auto-attack. You'll need to go alone (or make sure you're the only one getting hit). You can't use Trust NPC's either or they'll (probably) screw the test up. If you're on Bahamut and will do this for me, I'll toss you 500k.

[Sechs]

Your discovery about being knocked back if someone else with no reduction is in range sounds very strange, but not so unbelievable (lolSE).
I'm a bit skeptic about the being knocked back even if the AoE move misses you. I'd be leaning to say I've experienced the opposite on this particular circumstance, but I'm not 100% sure.
I'm 100% sure instead that your findings do not apply to Trust (I've seen myself not being knocked back by Mata AoE with Repulse Mantle, or when the move missed me, whereas Trusts were getting knocked back).

Also, on some powerful foes it doesn't seem to cancel but to reduce (not 100%) sure the amount of yalms you get knocked back. Seen this against Calimh and Hurkan. Please feel free to doublecheck as it might just be an eyeballed thing of mine.


Alas I can't help you on the Vocane question.
This makes me wish I knew how to read packets and could make an anti knockback lua addon myself, similar to how there's one for Ashita.
I know people have been making ones for Windower as well but they are not allowed to release it to the public or share it.

[Sephiran]

Your discovery about being knocked back if someone else with no reduction is in range sounds very strange, but not so unbelievable (lolSE).
I'm a bit skeptic about the being knocked back even if the AoE move misses you. I'd be leaning to say I've experienced the opposite on this particular circumstance, but I'm not 100% sure.
I'm 100% sure instead that your findings do not apply to Trust (I've seen myself not being knocked back by Mata AoE with Repulse Mantle, or when the move missed me, whereas Trusts were getting knocked back).

Also, on some powerful foes it doesn't seem to cancel but to reduce (not 100%) sure the amount of yalms you get knocked back. Seen this against Calimh and Hurkan. Please feel free to doublecheck as it might just be an eyeballed thing of mine.


Alas I can't help you on the Vocane question.
This makes me wish I knew how to read packets and could make an anti knockback lua addon myself, similar to how there's one for Ashita.
I know people have been making ones for Windower as well but they are not allowed to release it to the public or share it.

What would you say if I told you that you could predict Rani using Enthrall by looking at her eyes? (I put that up on Wikia years ago after I finally set foot in Abyssea once its heyday was over.) What would you say if I told you that the messages you get upon entering Delve mean something? (I know what these mean too.) There are things people overlook because they don't play alone or don't pay attention to the full spectrum of possibilities for each occurrence. I, unfortunately being in between shells (my app got turned down to a casual EG shell on Bahamut, so I'm currently out to dry right now with essentially nowhere to go), get to learn a lot from soloing.

If NPC's don't count, then that's news to me. There's been many times where I flat out don't summon them to avoid the knockback effects, but that testing was very old from when Trust first came out. When Tojil runs were the deal, I used to get furious with the BRD for singing songs next to me while I was prepping the matamata, because then my ten adds that I had with me (PDT gear was more rare at the time) would go haywire when I would get the knockback from the BRD getting it. That's when I did this testing, and that's when many others I've talked to seemed to have made their observations also. After all, the Repulse mantle is a very old item, and whatever impressions people make of it will stick until proven otherwise. The same goes for my claims here regarding Trust NPC's. Regardless, the point is the same whether it's been changed since then or not: I should like to see what the effect of the ring and mantle together are in the situation I described above.

Addendum: As of Divine Might II, I know that knockback is determined by unresisting players hit as I would also get pissed at the WHM for standing next to HM and getting hit with Cross Reaver or Havoc Spiral while I was holding the unengaged AA's. If one of them were to WS after knockback, I would lose alignment and Ochain wouldn't block the WS.

[Sechs]

My testing with trusts is also very old. I used to farm XP/CP/stuff in Morimar with trusts out, and noticed they would get knocked out by Mata AoE whereas I would not (with Repulse Mantle, or simply because it missed me).
If something got changed meanwhile I dunno.

Sad that you don't play on EU times or I could direct you to my LS's application form! :D


Regardless your finding is very very interesting. I can totally believe it being the case, I'm just still a bit skeptic about it working that way even when it *misses* you, but if you say you're 100% sure and double checked it I can believe you.

[Sephiran]

My testing with trusts is also very old. I used to farm XP/CP/stuff in Morimar with trusts out, and noticed they would get knocked out by Mata AoE whereas I would not (with Repulse Mantle, or simply because it missed me).
If something got changed meanwhile I dunno.

Sad that you don't play on EU times or I could direct you to my LS's application form! :D


Regardless your finding is very very interesting. I can totally believe it being the case, I'm just still a bit skeptic about it working that way even when it *misses* you, but if you say you're 100% sure and double checked it I can believe you.

I've observed this both in Abyssea versus ironclads and countless times in Delve versus Dakuwaqa and the Volatile Matamata. A stunt I'm working on is PLD Delve boss solos with add-burning, and I can't find appropriate hooked edges in the areas. So that means I have to negate knockback altogether or make a bizarrely strange pull to a dead end.

Addendum: Those Divine Might runs I mentioned were during summer vacation of last year if I recall correctly. Obviously, that does not test Trust, just PC's.

Addendum 2: My apologies. I didn't intend to imply that I was keeping secrets. Rani's eyes glow (as if she were doing the other caturae's version of Afflicting Gaze) when the next TP move she will perform is Enthrall. The messages about the sounds you hear upon entering Delve (not the dreadful energy ones) indicate variations to the spawn/wandering arrays of the enemies contained within. Also, Kumhau's aura has a chance to drop for each weapon skill performed from behind. You can thank the JP Wiki and Tychefm for that one though. Anything else you want to pick my brains on?

[Martel]

Believe it or not, the repulse mantle alone will completely negate the knockback from matamata auto-attacks as well as ironclad auto-attacks.

http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/108...=1#post5810991

If for any reason a player has a resistance to knockback and is in AoE range of another PC or NPC who does NOT have that same resistance, you will ALWAYS be knocked back the unreduced distance when the AoE hits the person NOT wearing the anti-knockback gear. This statement should be taken literally. That means that you will still be knocked back even if the AoE misses you. Yes, you heard that right. As you can imagine, most people don't go around meleeing matamatas or ironclads for fun.

I seem to recall seeing a missed ws still causing knockback before. Windshear irrc.

But the rest of that kinda makes me lift a brow. I can't outright deny it, since I have not specifically tested for it. But I do have some doubts. It's just so nonsensical. I mean, SE does some weird shit sometimes, but this would be the equivalent of picking one target in AoE range, and then using their def to calc dmg taken for all targets in range. Sounds like something that needs a bug report. I'll try it myself when I have some time.

Unfortunately, I can't be of any help regarding Vocane+Repulse mechanics. I had considered testing it then switching rings initially, but decided not to.

[Sechs]

Addendum 2: My apologies. I didn't intend to imply that I was keeping secrets.

Wut? That line out of the blue lol.
I never even remotely thought you were "keeping secrets".
I don't get how you could think I was from my previous post. Maybe the "my linkshell" line? That was more because you said you were looking for a LS, nothing to do with the keeping secrets stuff lol