Dragonball Z (2015)

[Tyrath]

Whether they can or not, it doesn't matter. They are on that same top level that someone like Zamasu isn't.

[Cream Soda]

Whether they can or not, it doesn't matter. They are on that same top level that someone like Zamasu isn't.

He also could either be wrong or lying. Wouldn't be the first time a character has said something and then was proven wrong later.

[Salodin]

Whis (stated by Toriyama himself that if Beerus is a 10, Whis is a 15) *cough* Vados (claims to be slightly stronger than her brother) *cough*

I took this as the same thing we've seen before, Whis is on another level. He's confirmed for Angel, so who knows what other abilities they have other than time rewind.

[Cream Soda]

I took this as the same thing we've seen before, Whis is on another level. He's confirmed for Angel, so who knows what other abilities they have other than time rewind.

That was a direct response to what was quoted. You said we haven't met anyone who can beat a GoD, and we have. What level he's on is irrelevant. He's someone; and he can beat them. Nothing more, nothing less.

[Tyrath]

Which brings up another issue though. Our timeline isn't the main one. (Cell's should be; the one where Cell kill Trunks and stole his time machine), so if there's only one, why the hell would he decide to go live in our fake timeline of all 5.

Who says he does though? The place where All-chan is could be a place beyond all universes and time.

[Salodin]

Well, for that matter I don't think Black could defeat Whis either, but we haven't seen Whis in any particular rush to participate in any universe going ons unless it's in influencing how Beerus responds. Recall how quick they were to snitch on Champa and Beerus during the last tournament? They have a job and stick with it, fighting Black isn't that.

Ill revise my statement, no one except All-Chan or an Angel stands up to a GoD. If this arc ends with GoD or All-Chan intervention, it'll be an exciting entrance followed by wtfpwn. Immortality or not, I think any diety intervention ends in overwhelming force which sets up the next arc which is probably the tournament.

[Cream Soda]

Well, for that matter I don't think Black could defeat Whis either, but we haven't seen Whis in any particular rush to participate in any universe going ons unless it's in influencing how Beerus responds. Recall how quick they were to snitch on Champa and Beerus during the last tournament? They have a job and stick with it, fighting Black isn't that.

Ill revise my statement, no one except All-Chan or an Angel stands up to a GoD. If this arc ends with GoD or All-Chan intervention, it'll be an exciting entrance followed by wtfpwn. Immortality or not, I think any diety intervention ends in overwhelming force which sets up the next arc which is probably the tournament.

My post really had nothing to do with saying who Black could beat or not. It was simply saying the statement you made was incorrect. I wasn't saying anything about Black fighting/being able to stand a chance vs Whis, lol.

Who says he does though? The place where All-chan is could be a place beyond all universes and time.

Which is purely 100% speculation, which is why I'm asking "why are people stating this shit like it's fact" when nobody knows; but everyone is super sure of themselves. Maybe he does, maybe he doesn't. We won't know till the time comes.

No matter which theory you look at, there's an aspect of it right now that isn't going to match up to make complete sense.

[Tyrath]

This is all speculation.

People are making guesses and you keep taking it as "stating as fact."

[Cream Soda]

I was asking that question in a general sense, not specifically a BG sense.

Like go look at Reddit. If you say something about Zeno; they'll be like "no that's wrong because he exists out of time" So that's where my original question came from "where in the show is that stated or proven" due to the way I've seen probably over a hundred people on various forums talk about him by now (and the amount of upvotes/people they get agreeing with them)

[Tyrath]

It doesn't but it would make sense if the all powerful creator existed out of time. But why are you even bothering to argue with the hivemind of reddit lol.

[Cream Soda]

Nobody said he created anything though. They said he was the ruler, not the creator.

[Tyrath]

All-chan is gonna smite your ass for doubting him.

[Cream Soda]

Topkek

[Ratatapa]

Get a room you two!

[Xno Kappa]

Who gives a shit what reddit posts lol

[Seha]

Nobody said he created anything though. They said he was the ruler, not the creator.

Didn't they say he can create and destroy universes?

[Vandalhart]

Yeah, I could have sworn I remember hearing something about him creating the 12 universes, and that there used to be more, but they were destroyed by him.

[Cream Soda]

Didn't they say he can create and destroy universes?

They said he had enough power to wipe out all 12 universes. Key word being power; aka he's just strong/has high energy. I can't recall them saying anything about creating at all; though I'll have to go back to the like 2 episodes he's in and double check

[Tyrath]

Pretty sure they did say he created more and had destroyed some of them.

[Cream Soda]

Episode 47
Whis: "It's no surprise Beerus was scared. Zeno-sama is the greatest person in the this world" (also key words there being "THIS world", didn't pick up on that before)
"There's no person above him.

Then Goku asks about if he's a strong fighter.

Beerus: "Zeno-sama doesn't fight, but he is indeed the strongest... Ridiculously stronger than anyone else"

Whis: "Zeno-sama can destroy anything he wants, in an instant; such as evil people, obviously. Or a planet, a galaxy, or an entire universe. If he felt like it, he can even erase the entire world."

Cross referencing w/ Crunchy roll's subs

Whis: "If he wished so, he could erase all existence"
Vegeta: "Has he ever done so?"
Whis: "Yes, there used to be 18 universes"

So even taking "all existence" into account, at least in this case, they were referring to doing so in specific universes.

Then they start talking about the tournament again.

He isn't really brought up again until episode 54/55 (when they announce Zeno wants to see Goku, and then Goku going there in ep 55) which I'm about to check out now.

But so far the word create hasn't been used once, nor implied