The New Trans Pacific Partnership (TPP) Thread

[notorious bum]

Lmao, that is straight out of the script of some sci-fi dystopian government scene reading.

[Buffy]

This thing needs to fucking die. Secrecy on internationally binding treaties? What the hell is going on.

[Ragnus]

This really looks like the first major step towards Mega-Lo Mart from Wall-E here. The phrasing in the article that talks about big businesses being able to sue national governments is scary.

[Andalusian girls]

well corporations, and individuals, have always had the ability to sue governments, what is novel is that as transnational trade has risen you're seen an accompanying rise in the incidence rate of international corporations going across state lines to bring lawsuits against countries in which they operate but not in which they are based. many take it as a violation of sovereignty.

what is most objectionable in the TPP, as i understand it, is that corporations will not have to prove damages in the domestic court system of the country they are suing, but instead the matter will be resolved by cabalistic sounding international arbitration panels staffed by lawyers.

[Buffy]

Yah, that's the correct take imo. Corporations can and should be able to sue governments for breaches of contract and etc. It's the ability to sue over lost future profits without deals ever being signed (as I think was outlined in a video in this very thread) is the screwy thing. That combined with the fact that it never sees a judge, just a tribunal of other corporations, is what is so screwed up. This thing is terrifying.

There is a legitimate scenario here where Exxon could want to drill off the coast of California, the US government says no, we don't think it is safe, and Exxon could sue the US for 1 trillion dollars (made up number) in lost future profits, and this tribunal could return with a judgement in favor of Exxon and the government would be LEGALLY BOUND BY INTERNATIONAL TREATY to pay them the money.

[TummieGaruda]

There is a legitimate scenario here where Exxon could want to drill off the coast of California, the US government says no, we don't think it is safe, and Exxon could sue the US for 1 trillion dollars (made up number) in lost future profits, and this tribunal could return with a judgement in favor of Exxon and the government would be LEGALLY BOUND BY INTERNATIONAL TREATY to pay them the money.

The scenario has already played out due to NAFTA. The US company Ethyl Corp. sued Canada because the country banned the import and sale of the gasoline additive MMT citing health concerns (neurotoxin that causes seizures in mice) and Ethyl Corp. wanted $350 million for damages and loss of future profits. In the end, the Canadian govt settled out of court for $13 million and issued a statement saying that MMT posed no health concerns.

[kuronosan]

My biggest gripe is how hard the President is trying to push for this, despite overwhelming lack of support from pretty much every citizen on the planet.

You know something isn't good when the people who opposed pushing through "Obamacare" because we couldn't read it are totally in favor of pushing this through.

[Cantih]

who opposed pushing through "Obamacare" because we couldn't read it

Not quite.
The complaint was there was insufficient time to read and debate the ACA, but the content of the legislation was always known and available. Though it was still just a bullshit excuse, they just didn't want it to pass.

[kuronosan]

Well, the Senate voted in favor anyway. The point is now moot.

[Waraji]

You know this some next level evil shit, when Republicans are working together with Obama.

[Buffy]

This is the TPA that passed, right? It gives Obama the right to negotiate the actual terms of the TPP, then can present the TPP for straight up/down yes/no vote without any risk of an amendment being attached, right?

This wasn't the actual TPP that passed.

[kuronosan]

If authorized a fast track.

[Buffy]

Right, what I mean is the house/senate can still vote to authorize/not authorize the actual TPP whenever it comes to a vote. They just can't add amendments or shit they normally add to other bills.

[Quicklet]

The House still needs to authorize fast track, and it is out of session until June 1st. It's unclear how hard it will be to sway enough Democrats to pass it, but I don't think anyone should be surprised if it does pass. Next week is scheduled as "district working days" so house members might have town hall meetings, etc. -- it would be a good time for people to address their local representatives about the TPP to keep fast track from passing the House.

[SamanosukeShiva]

You know this some next level evil shit, when Republicans are working together with Obama.

This is old news, Obama is a closeted republican.

[Andalusian girls]

[myreality]

http://www.theguardian.com/business/...fast-track-tpp

Here’s how much corporations paid US senators to fast-track the TPP bill

This is why lobbying should be illegal.

[Niiro]

Yea someone should pass a law about that.

................................owait.

[Andalusian girls]

bad defeat for Obama and pro-trade Republicans as House Democrats squash fast track efforts

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politi...y.html?hpid=z1

[Waraji]

Pretty happy about this actually. No TPP is good TPP.