December 10th Update Weaponskill Adjustments testing

[Ophannus]

I wonder why they made rudra so fuckkng good when the idea i thought was to make every ws useful, rudra was already pretty powerful after thr last ws buffs, this was kinda overkill i think. Sword and axe dont have a rudra equivalent of a 19ftp ws and even fudo doesnt approach these 30k equivalents.

[Fival]

But you can fudo for 10k at least 6 times before a dagger has 3000 tp. Only 6 is pretty probably a low estimate too.

[Ophannus]

People reporting rudras doing 7k+ unstacked so its not exactly a pushover too. Also 30k ws at least twice every 50ish seconds would be equivalent to 6 fudo worth of damage if i go by that 10k fudo guesstimate. I wonder if in the end if it narrows the gap substantially. Definitely puts THF at or exceeding DRK/DRG/MNK/WAR for certain.

[Fival]

30k is with 3k tp, Sam ws in general are spammed at 1k and even if they did the same as an unstacked rudra, the difference in frequency and Sam self skillchains is absurd, lets not get carried away. Its exciting but I don't see this bringing balance to anything.

[Sechs]

Balance? No.
Closing the gap? Maybe.
Making pt leaders more willing to bring some jobs? Totally yes, imho.

[Fival]

Its not like thief wasn't already coming to most incursions I've done, but in the grand scheme of things, the drg buff was pretty huge and that did very little to convince people to bring drg too.

[Damane]

Its not like thief wasn't already coming to most incursions I've done, but in the grand scheme of things, the drg buff was pretty huge and that did very little to convince people to bring drg too.

people need at least 6 months + to process the changes in job balance. Example GEO: was allready potent at the beginning of this year, and went overboard, and peopel just started to realise the potency 2-3 months ago (if at all)

[TummieGaruda]

Do you picture the current tier list of dagger WSs being any different according to your att vs target's def? Like in situations where you're seriously lacking attack, would other WSs become better than Rudra? Thinking about Exenterator, with its 100% Att buff which should now apply to all hits in theory.
Honestly the difference is so big I don't expect changes in that list, but just wondering.

Maybe someone can double check as well, but I modified my copy of the DNC spreadsheet making the ftp changes and I still see Pyrrhic Kleos pulling ahead in low attack situations. Overall it just seems to be the better WS to spam right now unless you are using Rudra's at a higher TP(or stacking it). The only time I see Rudra's pulling ahead in high level fights unstacked is if your acc buffs drop or a mob puts up an evasion buff that drops your accuracy down. Evisceration does have some spikes to pull it ahead of Rudra's but I think it averages out to the same if not slightly less than Rudra's. So the order may be:

PK > Rudra's >= Evisceration > Exenterator

[Classikmage]

Was spamming Rudra's unstacked today in Dynamis, never saw anything less than 8k, killed everything on WS no matter how much HP it had, even if I procced on pull. And even though it's a 1-hit WS, I never missed it once.

[TummieGaruda]

Updated the OP for tracking purposes. We are missing data from the following weaponskills:

Mandalic Stab
Mercy Stroke
Expiacion
Savage Blade
Vorpal Blade
Calamity
Mistral Axe
Blade: Ku
Blade: Kamu
Blade: Ten
Judgement
Mystic Boon
Randgrith

[scaevola]

PK > Rudra's >= Evisceration > Exenterator

Is this even without Terpsichore?

[TummieGaruda]

Is this even without Terpsichore?

When I did it in the DPS spreadsheet it was without Terpischore. Just waiting for the official updated sheet in case I mucked something up and others to validate.

[NynJa]

Its not like thief wasn't already coming to most incursions I've done, but in the grand scheme of things, the drg buff was pretty huge and that did very little to convince people to bring drg too.

Treasure hunter is a hell of a drug man.

[dasva]

Treasure hunter is a hell of a drug man.

The addiction is even greater now with gifts

[scaevola]

When I did it in the DPS spreadsheet it was without Terpischore. Just waiting for the official updated sheet in case I mucked something up and others to validate.

So unless I'm missing something this basically bumps Terps up to Ryuno level, no?

[Byrthnoth]

Here is my current modified DNC sheet. It includes a few pieces of new gear and a strange JA delay calculating system. I also changed how defense down works a little, so watch out before you modify it.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ayejryvsfp...0Dnc.xlsx?dl=0

[scaevola]

WS Dmg 11783 15884

oh thank god

[Safiyyah]

Here is my current modified DNC sheet. It includes a few pieces of new gear and a strange JA delay calculating system. I also changed how defense down works a little, so watch out before you modify it.

Hmm. Those DPS values are extremely high. Comparable or better than Koga SAM. Interesting.

[Byrthnoth]

Someone was asking about Twashtar earlier. I find that Twashtar/Izhiikoh with 40% ODD using Rudra's every 1750 TP is approximately equivalent to Terpsichore/Izhiikoh spamming Pyrrhic Kleos without AM3. With AM3, Terpsichore is the clear winner. So Twashtar still sucks. It might be better than Carnwenhan for Bard without AM3, but it is going to lose to an AM3 Carnwenhan for sure.

Edit: I had some broken links in the spreadsheet and fixed them. It changes almost nothing.

A word about that spreadsheet's JA calculations. It assumes all WS buffs (Building, Climactic, Strike, and Ternary) were applied during that TP cycle. This is not necessarily true for Climactic Flourish even during a constant fight, so it underestimates the value of Climactic Flourish. If used out of battle, it is not necessarily true for any of them.

It also assumes that all buff JAs used (Berserk, Aggressor, etc.) are used at some point during the fight as often as it is valid for and applies a static multiplier based on that. So if you assume 1.3 seconds JA delay and Berserk lasts for 3 minutes, it multiplies your delay by 180/(180-1.3) (<1%)

[Foldypaws]

Someone was asking about Twashtar earlier. I find that Twashtar/Izhiikoh with 40% ODD using Rudra's every 1750 TP is approximately equivalent to Terpsichore/Izhiikoh spamming Pyrrhic Kleos without AM3. With AM3, Terpsichore is the clear winner. So Twashtar still sucks. It might be better than Carnwenhan for Bard without AM3, but it is going to lose to an AM3 Carnwenhan for sure.

What about for thf?