Feminist Philosophy

[Charismatic]

Context always matters. Full stop.
We're talking matters of language. Meanings and usage of words can and do change all the time and therefore context has ever been and will always be important.

[Aksannyi]

I think what Gred says is that it is representative of the mindset outside of that particular arena. Saying that, essentially, if you don't fit in with the preconceived "norm," your opinion is invalid until you do. I'm not sure if that's how he's trying to say it.

[Salodin]

Not everyone feels that way. How many times have rape, abuse, or other similar types of jokes been made and met with fierce disapproval regardless of context?

[Lyall]

I think what Gred says is that it is representative of the mindset outside of that particular arena. Saying that, essentially, if you don't fit in with the preconceived "norm," your opinion is invalid until you do. I'm not sure if that's how he's trying to say it.

Ostensibly. The "norm" that's required, though, is that your identity IS your opinion. The meat attached to the idea is irrelevant. It's not so much that you have to be a CIS-neckbeard-animu person, but that who you are offline has zero merit on your ideas or attitudes. If a completely anonymous group of people come to a consensus that pineapple is in fact the Hitler of pizza toppings, then who those people are doesn't and shouldn't matter in the realm of discussion. It's only when folks try to bring meatspace into a discussion of ideas that it falls apart.

Now, having the discussion of the language itself is a different story. "Tits or GTFO" is basically a proto-form of "git gud" which simply implies you're not good at what you're doing. It IS possible for words and definitions to change over time; I'm of the mindset that Xbox Live and Halo/COD have done "damage' to a certain f-word that's fairly intolerable. The twelve year olds using it to sound inflammatory aren't necessary speaking about your sexual persuasion, even when they insist they are. They're just latching onto bold and scandalous words aimed at getting a reaction.

In short, kids are dumb, I guess. The dudebros those kids grew up into, moreso.

[Aksannyi]

If we want to talk about words that should never, ever be used on COD or Halo ever again, we can start with the f-word (you know which one) and continue with the r-word, because we need to stop trivializing rape by saying that a "BOOM HEADSHOT" in a video game even remotely compares.

(Sorry, that tickled one of my sensors and I know it's unrelated to the discussion we're currently having but ugh, I hate when people use rape colloquially.)

[Lyall]

If we want to talk about words that should never, ever be used on COD or Halo ever again, we can start with the f-word (you know which one) and continue with the r-word, because we need to stop trivializing rape by saying that a "BOOM HEADSHOT" in a video game even remotely compares.

(Sorry, that tickled one of my sensors and I know it's unrelated to the discussion we're currently having but ugh, I hate when people use rape colloquially.)

I choose not to use that word in competitive play, but guess what? Successful troll is successful. You are now more apt to quitting whatever game you were playing, or being angry enough to have it affect your play, which is the exact reason the word remains used.

I'm not even sure how to combat that. I can't say "ignore it" because that paints me as insensitive and equally trivializing rape (and I'm sure something about privilege, too) but the only way to kill trolls is to starve them to death.

[Tyrath]

I personally prefer rekt as my choice of r-word. I think that way I can insult people without marginalizing anyone?

Inb4 someone comes up with how rekt marginalizes someone.

[Aksannyi]

I don't think rekt marginalizes anyone, to me, it gains the SJW seal of approval.

[Blubbartron]

I choose not to use that word in competitive play, but guess what? Successful troll is successful. You are now more apt to quitting whatever game you were playing, or being angry enough to have it affect your play, which is the exact reason the word remains used.

I'm not even sure how to combat that. I can't say "ignore it" because that paints me as insensitive and equally trivializing rape (and I'm sure something about privilege, too) but the only way to kill trolls is to starve them to death.

I'm of the opinion that desensitization should be the goal. Things just seem so much better when people stop getting all emotional over every little thing. Emotion overrules logic, so if you desensitize yourself to everything (including rape, slurs, etc), it allows you to actually think about what's going on and then decide if the person/situation is fucked. Too many goddamn carebears in the world.

[Lyall]

I'm of the opinion that desensitization should be the goal. Things just seem so much better when people stop getting all emotional over every little thing. Emotion overrules logic, so if you desensitize yourself to everything (including rape, slurs, etc), it allows you to actually think about what's going on and then decide if the person/situation is fucked. Too many goddamn carebears in the world.

This is what I feel, too, but you can safely bet that someone's going to point out that exposure to the word and removing the impact of it lessens the crime and will somehow make people think it's okay. I've had that point brought up to me before.

[Aksannyi]

This is what I feel, too, but you can safely bet that someone's going to point out that exposure to the word and removing the impact of it lessens the crime and will somehow make people think it's okay. It's happened before, in my experience.

This, essentially.

[Blubbartron]

This is what I feel, too, but you can safely bet that someone's going to point out that exposure to the word and removing the impact of it lessens the crime and will somehow make people think it's okay. It's happened before, in my experience.

When you say "it's happened before", are you referring to someone making that argument, or that it has actually happened and people "overexposed" to rape as a colloquial term really do think rape is okay? Just trying to be clear.

[Tyrath]

I think a better argument might be that it's easy to say "lighten up" when you haven't been the one raped. Or experienced one of the other things denoted by the other words.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for everyone having thicker skin. Just trying to see the other side's argument though.

[Lyall]

When you say "it's happened before", are you referring to someone making that argument, or that it has actually happened and people "overexposed" to rape as a colloquial term really do think rape is okay? Just trying to be clear.

First one. Edited post to reflect. I really need to learn to proofread one day.

[Blubbartron]

First one. Edited post to reflect. I really need to learn to proofread one day.

Gotcha, and good. And as we can see, Aks has already been willing to jump to that conclusion and implicitly made the argument. It's bullshit, to anyone who bothers to think about it.

[Aksannyi]

The thing is, when you're on COD and you shout, "I RAPED you, bro!" generally, you'd sound proud of yourself after saying that. You know who else sounds proud after saying they raped someone? Rapists. "But I'm not a rapist!" You protest.

Well you can see where one might get confused. Really, being the perpetrator of something horrible like rape, murder, etc., isn't something to be proud of, and glorifying it by using self-praise in a video game does actually trivialize the severity of it and other actions.

I'm not saying that video games cause rape or cause murder, at all. But if someone was already in a position where he was considering doing one of those things, hearing someone else glorify and/or joke about it might be the very thing he needs to think, "Well, that guy said it's okay so..." And I think it's subconscious more than conscious, but the brain most certainly works in subtleties and subtext.

[Blubbartron]

The thing is, when you're on COD and you shout, "I RAPED you, bro!" generally, you'd sound proud of yourself after saying that. You know who else sounds proud after saying they raped someone? Rapists. "But I'm not a rapist!" You protest.

Well you can see where one might get confused. Really, being the perpetrator of something horrible like rape, murder, etc., isn't something to be proud of, and glorifying it by using self-praise in a video game does actually trivialize the severity of it and other actions.

I'm not saying that video games cause rape or cause murder, at all. But if someone was already in a position where he was considering doing one of those things, hearing someone else glorify and/or joke about it might be the very thing he needs to think, "Well, that guy said it's okay so..." And I think it's subconscious more than conscious, but the brain most certainly works in subtleties and subtext.

Do feminists really think that rapists go around bragging about the crimes they've committed? This is just absurd.

It's almost as absurd as thinking that using the word rape in a colloquial context (indicating destruction/dominance of an opponent) is implicitly legitimizing rape as an action. This is what people were talking about earlier regarding context. The world is not black and white, and no one is so simple as to go "oh, he said rape while gaming, so now I'll simply stop caring about women being attacked in parking garages or their own homes." If they don't have that internal compass that goes "rape is bad", then they likely don't give two shits about what society thinks, and therefore don't care about what people online say.

[Lyall]

The thing is, when you're on COD and you shout, "I RAPED you, bro!" generally, you'd sound proud of yourself after saying that. You know who else sounds proud after saying they raped someone? Rapists. "But I'm not a rapist!" You protest.

Well you can see where one might get confused. Really, being the perpetrator of something horrible like rape, murder, etc., isn't something to be proud of, and glorifying it by using self-praise in a video game does actually trivialize the severity of it and other actions.

I'm not saying that video games cause rape or cause murder, at all. But if someone was already in a position where he was considering doing one of those things, hearing someone else glorify and/or joke about it might be the very thing he needs to think, "Well, that guy said it's okay so..." And I think it's subconscious more than conscious, but the brain most certainly works in subtleties and subtext.

I just need to take a step back and realize that we're discussing someone hearing "I raped you" as encouragement in a game where you are running around and mercilessly murdering people (read:men) by the score without hesitation, and that murdering the most people gives you perks and benefits to continue murdering.

The state of social commentary. Nothing against you, Aks, but you're saying that you can't (or shouldn't) desensitize people during a form of recreation that exists explicitly because people are desensitized to another horrific, inhumane action.

[Aksannyi]

Do feminists really think that rapists go around bragging about the crimes they've committed? This is just absurd.

I've seen Facebook posts with men doing exactly that. I'm trying to find them.

[Blubbartron]

I've seen Facebook posts with men doing exactly that. I'm trying to find them.

inb4 pictures are actually men bragging about "slaying drunk bitches", which may be unethical, but calling it the same as rape is ludicrous.