Feminist Philosophy

[Churchill]

By which you mean dudes fighting on a chicks behalf/in her name/because-he-thinks-it's-what-a-chick-wants?

no

[archibaldcrane]

It's when a parent turns a child against the other parent, and it's a shitty misleading label for it.

[Marootsoobutsu]

Ah. Maybe it's the red-neck family in CO/Eastern Washington, but I know a ton of dudes who "Hey, he insulted me. Go beat him up." kinda stuff was stupid common... chicks had a problem with someone, but pushed their boyfriend/brother/husband/fiance to do the fighting.

And yeah, if that's what proxy violence is, that's a horrible name for it. Don't get me wrong-- it's despicable and reprehensible, and parents who do that are doing horrible things, but it's not violence.

[Charismatic]

Ah. Maybe it's the red-neck family in CO/Eastern Washington, but I know a ton of dudes who "Hey, he insulted me. Go beat him up." kinda stuff was stupid common... chicks had a problem with someone, but pushed their boyfriend/brother/husband/fiance to do the fighting.

This is a form of proxy violence more akin to what I was referring to though these days women tend to wield the state as their weapon of choice.

It's when a parent turns a child against the other parent, and it's a shitty misleading label for it.

This is a form of DV by proxy which is a related thing but not really the same thing.

[Byrthnoth]

Not when it comes to domestic violence. You couldn't be more wrong. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1854883/

Lets ignore the obvious problems with using this study to actually talk about domestic violence, like the fact that they're asking a bunch of non-cohabiting 22 year olds in mostly >3 month long relationships about their experience with domestic violence, and just take it as if it were relevant to all instances of "intimate partner violence."

That study says both genders of reporter agree that women slap, kick, or punch (1 or more times in the last year) more often than men without retaliation from the male. Okay. I accept that. Girls can get slappy when they're pissed and boys aren't supposed to hit them. Good job not retaliating, guys. When men hit women, there's often retaliation (and it's substantially more dangerous for both parties).

Still, the majority of this nonreciprocal violence for both genders is in the 1-2 slap range (75%). So you're asking a bunch of 20 somethings if they've slapped their significant others (or been slapped) in the last year and whether they got hit back. Depending on the discretion of the responder, you're probably lumping a lot of pretty harmless physical contact in there. Particularly for women, hence the 8% "injury" rate for their nonreciprocal violence vs. 20%+ for every other kind of conflict. I mean, 1-2 slaps is no slugfest. That doesn't even constitute a real fight in my book. Who would really consider one slap in a relationship (possibly at the breakup) a "violent relationship?" Apparently some social scientists that want to get their shit published.

So yeah, I'm happy for them that they got a paper out of it, but how often do the police get called over two slaps? Does this paper address who the aggressor is in reciprocal fights? Can you use it to draw conclusions about what the more domestically aggressive gender is? NNNnnno.


To draw it back in to the original article, the context we're looking to address here is "domestic violence severe enough that the police are called."

[NynJa]

To draw it back in to the original article, the context we're looking to address here is "domestic violence severe enough that the police are called."

And how much of that is the patriarchy though, "men have to be stronger than women"? How about an emotionally abusive partner who does whatever she wants because "fuck you you pussy what are you gonna do? hit me? go ahead and hit me, I'll have the cops here and have you locked up faster than you can lube your asshole you fucking punk"? Its not going to qualified as domestic violence in a physical manner, but its domestic abuse none the less.

[Churchill]

well that solution is simple, no one is going to hit you if you hit them harder.

[Koul]

In regards to domestic violence, I would encourage people to look up seminars by Erin Pizzey. nynja already mentioned mental abuse* edit

Here's a good video regarding Erin Pizzey

[Charismatic]

In regards to domestic violence, I would encourage people to look up seminars by Erin Pizzey. nynja already mentioned mental abuse* edit

Here's a good video regarding Erin Pizzey

I'll have to watch that video later but... she's the one who set up a women's shelter and then started speaking truth about DV (which pissed feminists off enough that they killed her dog and ran her out of the country), right?

[Koul]

I'll have to watch that video later but... she's the one who set up a women's shelter and then started speaking truth about DV (which pissed feminists off enough that they killed her dog and ran her out of the country), right?

Yes, that's correct. I think they even killed her dogs or something ridiculous too

[NynJa]

Wait, a bunch of feminists killed some old ladies dog because she said somethings about domestic violence they didnt like?

Jesus fucking christ

[Koul]

Yes, that's correct. She's also had to live in exile/hiding for 10 years due to all the threats she received from UK feminists. Her events usually get bomb threats too

[Ragnus]

That's really crazy.

[chiyio]

I've read her book, Prone to Violence. It's pretty interesting. And yes, feminists hate her observations and experiences. And were sure quick to jump to violence and threats against her (kind of proving her point, heh) My own personal anecdotal experience is that women are much more violent than men. I think a lot of it is because they face almost no repercussions for escalating to violence, where with men, shit is going to get real, real fast.

Men also have to deal with the totally bullshit and completely debunked Duluth model.

[Marootsoobutsu]

I've read her book, Prone to Violence. It's pretty interesting. And yes, feminists hate her observations and experiences. And were sure quick to jump to violence and threats against her (kind of proving her point, heh) My own personal anecdotal experience is that women are much more violent than men. I think a lot of it is because they face almost no repercussions for escalating to violence, where with men, shit is going to get real, real fast.

Men also have to deal with the totally bullshit and completely debunked Duluth model.

Just read the wiki on the Duluth model-- hadn't heard of it, but man. When even one of the founders says, "Yeah, we found almost zero evidence to support our idea and a ton of evidence that opposed it from the people we worked with. But that doesn't matter; we're still doing it, even knowing we're only finding what we were predetermined to find", my rage bar goes up a notch.

The number of old-timey feminists who have been coming out and saying the current trends are wrong, though, is kind of encouraging. But I'm glad both of my kids are girls.

[Clash Perez]

Wikipedia is a tool of the Patriarchy, didn't you know? Of course it's critical.

[Churchill]

I wouldn't say the wikipedia article is critical.

[Galkaeater]

history is written by those who can edit wikipedia more

[Marootsoobutsu]

Wikipedia is a tool of the Patriarchy, didn't you know? Of course it's critical.

Allow me to show contrition via castration.

[Charismatic]

olde and not particularly relevant to anything except that I posted the same scene from MGS2 a while back (which is what made me even click with this title)