Patch 2.5 Notes

[Ratatapa]

So you take a way a monster looks from a previous iteration and make it look and move better. That doesn't sound at all like FF. Pretty sure 65% and a dozen more are meaningless numbers, but if you have a source for the copypasta (not that I doubt it could happen but considering the majority of those monsters are small time it doesn't really mean much) then that would be good.

Of course, you would have to discount the original monsters and bosses but I suppose you don't care about that and only care that a few monsters came from XI so therefore XIV owes EVERYTHING it has to it. Ridiculous.



While they both control pace to a certain degree you can't force a GCD system to be faster than it is, whereas with stamina you can burn it all in 3 seconds and have to wait for 10 or you can pace yourself. People need to realise that stamina is it's own concept and not interchangeable with GCDs or point systems.

Stamina combat and GCD combat aren't bad, but 1.0's combat (like Seravi said) was unpolished and lacking in just about everything. Good ideas don't mean shit when executed poorly.

All i meant is that the stamina system was 'closer' to the GCD system then the TP system

Also if people wanna bitc habout some old 1.0 stuff. Why arn't people bitching about

Physical Levels
The fact that in 1.0 to gain EXP you had to do actions and randomly the actions gave your EXP (and cure almost never gave EXP)

[Ratatapa]

i'd rather Dr Mog than Mr Happy in a heartbeat

at least Daeva of War datmined shit and whatnot, wtf does Mr Happy do

Gets money off dumb people twitch subs?

[Kaslo]

i'd rather Dr Mog than Mr Happy in a heartbeat

at least Daeva of War datmined shit and whatnot, wtf does Mr Happy do

Say what you will, but Mr. Happy does try to get very simple guides out for people quick. As much as the strats eventually get replaced with better ones, they are at least there to try to raise the "skill" level in the ocean of non-hardcore players.

Plus, I don't get the hate on anyone who gets subs on twitch. I mean if someone enjoys watching him and wants to throw money at him and twitch, why hate on that? (Note: I don't sub to Mr. Happy, but do to two other streamers: ProfessorBroman and TeaWrex).

With all that said, at least SE respected Dr. Mog to make him a character in a Final Fantasy game? (Record Keeper )

[Ophannus]

Yeah but in previous ff games mobs were redrawn. In ff14 they're literally the same model.

[ronin sparthos]

Say what you will, but Mr. Happy does try to get very simple guides out for people quick. As much as the strats eventually get replaced with better ones, they are at least there to try to raise the "skill" level in the ocean of non-hardcore players.

Plus, I don't get the hate on anyone who gets subs on twitch. I mean if someone enjoys watching him and wants to throw money at him and twitch, why hate on that? (Note: I don't sub to Mr. Happy, but do to two other streamers: ProfessorBroman and TeaWrex).

With all that said, at least SE respected Dr. Mog to make him a character in a Final Fantasy game? (Record Keeper )

Happy's guides are entirely too bloated for their own good. They manage to drag on and on and on. Seriously. Fortunately, he's been getting better at getting around to a point. Generally though, MTQCapture manages to trim most of the bloat and her videos are quicker to get through.

Both are pumping out valuable guides needed in a game where the community is too impatient and has no time for anything.

[Rocl]

Yeah but in previous ff games mobs were redrawn. In ff14 they're literally the same model.

Like I used in the Behemoth example, it definitely looks more "redrawn" than "literally the same model" to me.

I mean if that's what "literally the same model" is to you then holy shit something is way different in our copies of XI, XIV, PCs and eyeballs

[Elcura]

Yeah but in previous ff games mobs were redrawn. In ff14 they're literally the same model.

Please do tell me what ARR owes to previous games aside from a few monsters looking the same (that, mind you I asked for a source on direct copypasta). A lot of monsters that were in previous games could have been remade (it's not exactly hard for professionals) to look the same so without proof it's just hearsay. Because frankly most people would be happy that monsters or enemies that they like or look cool get a HD treatment but I guess Yoshida and his team are lazy for making FF fans happy.

Seriously, what is your point? Are you even trying to have a conversation?

[Niiro]

Twintania, Wyverns

These were from XII fyi.

Also, I didn't notice before but Phoenix is too.

I thought the model for Giruveganus/Pains was from XII as well but I guess the name just lead me to think it was (Giru in XII was a T-rex mob) but I could have sworn I recognized the model from somewhere when I first saw it....

[Elcura]

These were from XII fyi.

Also, I didn't notice before but Phoenix is too.

Wait, XIV's Phoenix is XII's Phoenix? Because...no. Seriously I wonder if people even have eyes unless you're looking at something else entirely. You know what, you can't say this mob is that mob without a direct picture comparison of what you're looking at vs what is really there.

Because I'm having some doubts about you people.

[Rocl]

These were from XII fyi.

Also, I didn't notice before but Phoenix is too.

I thought the model for Giruveganus/Pains was from XII as well but I guess the name just lead me to think it was (Giru in XII was a T-rex mob) but I could have sworn I recognized the model from somewhere when I first saw it....

It's been a long time since I played 12 truth be told, I did think they might be similar but I also don't know if the same skeleton is necessarily the same as LITERAL PORTS JUST HD RESKINNING OMG

It's also FFXII and not FFXI which is apparently where XIV gets over 70% of its models now !!11

[ronin sparthos]

Yeah but in previous ff games mobs were redrawn. In ff14 they're literally the same model.

And? It's meant to be an ode to nostalgia for us XI folk. I'm not really sure why this irks people at all. It's cool seeing HD models of some of the monsters we've come to know and loathe and it helps save development time for more important things - like content. ARR has enough unique models in its own right and the borrowed monsters from previous Final Fantasies is a mainstay of the series. Pretty cool seeing a Mirrorknight from XII for instance.

The XI and 1.XX hate completely misses the point. If we're going to only home in on the bad aspects of those two games then we might as well discuss the lack of an overworld, the instanced fodder funnels and virtually non-existent economy of ARR. Not fair right? Thought so. Both XI and 1.XX had valuable things that would help to make ARR a better game, not limited to such things as elemental weaknesses, skillchains, useful overworlds, endgame progression and itemization. Argue why the game would suffer from more depth in its combat and progression models, please.

If we're going to talk 'bottom line' as a reason why we should run from anything predating ARR, I present the WoW-clone problem. In an attempt to capture a wide market with a lowest common denominator approach your MMO goes through a rapid cycle of birth-life-death and hits the F2P bin faster than you can say 'The Elder Scrolls'. If you want to create an MMO that lasts, you've got to do something that makes it unique or at least captures the attention of a fierce fanbase that will keep your game afloat.

On this point, Tanaka proved himself. Yoshida has not.

[Akiyama]

Is this a thread about 2.5 patch notes and so on (I guess for the patch tomorrow too) or a full on complaint about how A Realm Reborn does stuff lazily compared to the past iterations and all that jazz? Most notably from a couple specific people.

Either way, not trying to backseat mod as it's not my job, but can't we just make a thread or something to talk about this and talk about the future patch notes that should be coming out late today and what not? :< Just a suggestion. Hate clicking the thread for updates only to see more bitching.

And as far as Yoshida not proving himself, I'll say that it's obviously rather bleh that so much has been brought over from older games and transplanted into XIV for pure nostalgia reasons, but.. the game's still a subscription based game with a good few playing it still. How many new, recent "WoW killers" have come and gone and are either totally dead or resorting to F2P models, and still have no one playing em?

I dunno, obviously this new version of XIV hasn't proven itself completely in comparison to XI because that shit happened so long ago when good MMOs were few and far between.. at least compared to the market FFXIV has to compete with, but still; gotta give credit where credit's due IMO.

[Rocl]

Given that it's not a "true patch" the notes won't be up until after maintenance begins probably

[Akiyama]

Given that it's not a "true patch" the notes won't be up until after maintenance begins probably

I mean it still has some important stuff!

[Kaslo]

I feel like everyone forgot that they wanted to focus on making a playable (and profitable) game first and foremost with XIV 2.0, Yoshi has even mentioned that they are planning to take more risks with 3.X stuff now that the system is stable.

[arus2001]

My inner artist cringes every time someone confuses textures with skeletons and the assumption XI used the same rendering program(s) as XIV. It's like saying Win95 is the same as Win7. Sure, you could maybe run compatibility mode with some things, but a lot on the skeletal end would need redone if you want any degree of complexity and smooth animation on par with the rest of the (updated) world. Stuff like Shadow Dragons rear kicking isn't a matter of impossibility, either, just that it wasn't done. XIV arguably had a lot more mob/NPC models to iron out with ARR's launch than vanilla XI did, where you see the SD as early as 2-3.

Perhaps an adequate comparison would be those who've used XI models in the Miku Miku Dance things. It wasn't as simple as just throwing the DATs at the MMD program and everything worked automagcially even though things certainly looked like they would've in XI once done despite all the under the hood tweaks.

[Niiro]

It's been a long time since I played 12 truth be told, I did think they might be similar but I also don't know if the same skeleton is necessarily the same as LITERAL PORTS JUST HD RESKINNING OMG

It's also FFXII and not FFXI which is apparently where XIV gets over 70% of its models now !!11

I'm not really arguing the borrowed models thing but I don't see the difference between copying mobs from XI and copying them from XII and XIII if the point is the reuse of old assets.

[ronin sparthos]

ARR is so much faster paced, things like rear kicks would seem like wasted effort. When mobs are being grouped up and blasted with a million AOEs, does it even matter? ARR spends most of its time more concerned with larger mechanics like insta-wipes, 'dont stand here', tank swapping and more 'modern' raid tactics.

[Rocl]

I'm not really arguing the borrowed models thing but I don't see the difference between copying mobs from XI and copying them from XII and XIII if the point is the reuse of old assets.

I mean, I understand they were assets borrowed/used/taken from FFXII, and I acknowledge I fucked up by listing them as unique to XIV (I didn't add the Deathgaze/Snakes/Mantis/Dullahan in my listing since they were obvious XII ports for example) but this guy said XIV models are over 70% XI models which is pretty much false as fuck. My point of umbrage wasn't complaining about reusing assets but being so ridiculously wrong about the reuse of which assets.

Pretty sure 70% of the mob models in XIV are recycled XI models with an HD skin plastered on.

is my point of contention

[Spider-Dan]

Considering XIV is an actual success... yeah. I'd say it had such substance.

Funny how ARR being a success now is always touted as proof of its quality, yet XI being a success for years is quickly swept under the rug while it is dismissed as a failure.

Where's my time machine, so I can travel 10 years into the future and retroactively declare ARR to be garbage?