Transgender Philosophy (Questions, Ideology)

[archibaldcrane]

My issue with privilege is that generally it's racist... My girlfriend is white but comes from poor background. She grew up in a predominantly black neighborhood and was *gasp* bullied and discriminated against because she was white. She recently had a class in college taught by a black woman who basically told her that couldn't have happened to her because she was born with white privilege. What privilege exactly? In her childhood she didn't get any of that privilege because of where she lived.

I'm not white and it irks me when white people tell me that they can't be discriminated against. It's basically another way for a white person to tell me how privileged they are

Here

http://occupywallstreet.net/story/ex...e-white-person

[Tyrath]

I didn't argue that privilege doesn't exist, simply that many proponents of privilege don't see beyond your skin color. Those people are the ones who need that article.

[Cream Soda]

The thing about privilege, is that often people with it don't see it. They see that the world is good, and things are good - because that's the world they experience. So to say "I don't see color," is ignorant, because people of color recognize that their lot in life is more difficult, and that they will have to work harder to earn respect from the police, their bosses, their colleagues, the media, etc. It's the same for women, trans people, homosexual people, etc.

Now the people who will yell out things like "check your privilege" are generally only trying to get people with privilege to understand - but they're doing it in a rude way. Simply saying that accomplishes nothing, because again, people with privilege don't typically recognize that they are privileged. And of course it doesn't mean that white males (highest tier privilege) won't have personal problems, it just means that despite those problems, that person will have it easier than anyone who isn't a white male with the same problems. So simply saying "I'm colorblind" is actually ignorant - while the idea is, in theory, that you treat people equally, it also says, "I'm a person who doesn't understand the privilege that I have," often resulting in that person holding such fun thoughts as, "Pull yourself up by your bootstraps and just get it done!"

So it does matter.

eh; it may be more common, but nothing is absolute. You could be a white person working for a black boss, who's higher up is black, and the CEO of the company is also black. I don't think a white person in this company would have ANY privilege here. A black person having troubles at this same job may not be as bad as the white guy's problems.

Oh I definitely believe white people can be discriminated against (I have experienced that on at least one occasion), but it's not nearly as large in scope as discrimination against other marginalized groups. The problem is, like you've outlined, when people refuse to listen to someone who had a similar background or experience and look only at color, which is the exact problem in reverse.

Looking at it as a group does nothing to help the white man I just described. Just because other people of the same skin color may be privileged, that has no (positive) effect on him at his job (the black bosses may be taking it out on him; so potentially negative).
It's worse for blacks just because it happens to more blacks? I look at each situation as an individual case. If there are 1 million blacks wronged and 1 white person wronged, I don't look at it like "black have it worse" I look at it like "Damn there are 1,000,001 wronged people right now"

[archibaldcrane]

I didn't argue that privilege doesn't exist, simply that many proponents of privilege don't see beyond your skin color. Those people are the ones who need that article.

Proponents of privilege? You mean like the KKK? Or do you mean people who recognize the obvious truth that various privileges exist?

[Eurell]

Proponents of privilege? You mean like the KKK? Or do you mean people who recognize the obvious truth that various privileges exist?

He's probably referring to people like the professor in his story?

Spoiler: show

thats not actually a question since it's pretty obvious exactly who he was talking about

[Tyrath]

Proponents of privilege? You mean like the KKK? Or do you mean people who recognize the obvious truth that various privileges exist?

Pretty much people who jump to asinine examples as the KKK when the way privilege is talked about is questioned at all.

He's probably referring to people like the professor in his story?

Spoiler: show

thats not actually a question since it's pretty obvious exactly who he was talking about

At least someone can read.

[archibaldcrane]

I was just mocking your phrasing - keep up.

[Tyrath]

I was just mocking your phrasing - keep up.

White man mocking the language of a foreigner for whom English is a second language. If this ain't privilege I don't know what is!

[archibaldcrane]

I'm probably the most privileged person who posts here

[Penthesilea]

Wouldn't that be Wop?

[Blubbartron]

Wouldn't that be Wop?

Does Wop even still post on BG? Thought he bailed after some white knight got him shitcanned for joking about a female colleague.

[Lyall]

Does Wop even still post on BG? Thought he bailed after some white knight got him shitcanned for joking about a female colleague.

...is this actually a thing that happened?

[Blubbartron]

...is this actually a thing that happened?

I forget the exact details, but that's the gist, yeah. I think he was asking for people to photoshop a picture of her or something, and the joke was pretty unprofessional/offensive, but some dickwad got their panties in a bunch and contacted his job and pointed them to the thread, and he was promptly fired.

[Stumblingdrunk]

He was banned for threatening to sue BG

[Aksannyi]

I forget the exact details, but that's the gist, yeah. I think he was asking for people to photoshop a picture of her or something, and the joke was pretty unprofessional/offensive, but some dickwad got their panties in a bunch and contacted his job and pointed them to the thread, and he was promptly fired.

It was shopping Miss Piggy on one of his coworker, hence the reason why the thread is now called the "Miss Piggy's grocery store headlines" when it used to reference wop by name.

[Raldo]

It was shopping Miss Piggy on one of his coworker, hence the reason why the thread is now called the "Miss Piggy's grocery store headlines" when it used to reference wop by name.

It should probably also be mentioned that he wanted the picture to use as a dartboard target, if I recall correctly.

Would love to know where his privilege stands today

[Pirian]

It should probably also be mentioned that he wanted the picture to use as a dartboard target, if I recall correctly.

Would love to know where his privilege stands today

Almost certain his wealth came from his family, so I would say it is probably similar if not exactly the same.

[Cantih]

I remember in a thread, he posted some big name jewelry that he got, and it literally looked like a gem encrusted piece of poo.

[Jefe]

Nah, there were some Dubai dudes who posted their Lamborghini/Ferrari in that 'whatchu drivin' thread.'

[arus2001]

All the media you seem to be talking about here is porn.

Right, and there is definitely an element of, "Stop not liking what I like!" that goes on and fuels backlash, but I don't really think it matters if it's porn or Shakespeare. If the representation is unrealistic, not-good things happen. This is partially where I cringe a bit during labeling/identification arguments, or more accurately, those who want to insist they're not different so treat them that way or else. Media serving as a safety bubble or creating unachievable empowerment can coddle this potentially toxic mindset.

Overall, I'm getting the feeling this specific tangent isn't gonna get much traction because "safer" media hasn't approached the subject very often in the mainstream. A film like Mrs. Doubtfire really isn't about a guy wanting to be a girl, it's a guy who wants to be with his kids and does it to pull it off. Then you get comical abominations like White Chicks. On the other hand, recently re-watching the Hercules series on Netflix had an episode where Autolycus (Bruce Campell) and Salmoneus (Robert Trebor) dressed up as women and joined a showgirl troupe to avoid capture. There was almost a feeling they were deliberately portrayed as ugly as possible, but at the same time, the only person who didn't fall for their act, but didn't out them, was Widow Twanky (A recurring character played by Michael Hurst, so maybe a bit of lampshading at play). They even played the Trap card with the warlord chasing them falling for Sal's female persona after a terribly gaudy striptease scene. For a lot of people, scenarios like these are where they maybe get introduced to the notion. Maybe not full-on, but enough where the reaction is more along the lines of, "Eww..." than acceptance.