Vagary Findings

[Targaryen]

we got pet belt off Plouton called Incarnation Sash and stats are DEF:15 PET: Accuracy+15 Ranged Accuracy+15 Magic Accuracy+15 "Double Attack"+4% for the jobs BST/DRG/SMN/PUP

[Sechs]

Then why is someone in your screenshots shouting right now for a GEO and guaranteeing pop & win?

Unless it's some other message I didn't see (hey I just woke up!) I didn't see guarantees or anything, just someone shouting to replace a BRD (since I had to go to bed)

You quoted someone other then that when you said that.

As far as not sharing, actually that is kinda funny cause some members have talked to others in tell about strat, and also we took some pug ppl in our last run that was with us and got win. Just because we have not posted exact strat on forum yet does not mean we won't share. And I have heard that others have gotten it to pop on Asura, so people are figuring it out by what what we have been saying. It is confirmed can have no deaths in run for it to pop, and weather day does not matter for MB. More details will be incoming soon.

Yeah, Fiv sent me some tells and I shared with him everything I knew.
Plouton popped randomly on step 3 after a multistep doublelight SC with multiple light magic bursts (quantity, not damage).
Some say it popped just after the SC, before the MB. It was hard to notice frankly.

This method sometimes worked, many other times we did the same exact thing it didn't work.
Maybe because of some other variables (people who died? Day? Weather? No clue).
These variables have nothing to do with Perfidian (who, btw, can be popped on the same run)

Personally the fact that this thing doesn't work 100% makes me believe that there's something else.
Also I dunno about you but I don't see SE envisioning players to use level 1 weapons, weather spells and obis to reduce SC damage so that mobs can survive multistep. Do you? It sounds an idea too stupid even for them.
While this method seems to be working sometimes, I'm pretty sure the "real" method is simpler and different from this.

I dunno what my ls kept doing yesterday anyway, went to bed after a while and I just woke up. If they found out something else meanwhile I have no clue.


If you guys think we're trying to sell wins for 20000 billions you're completely off the track.
If you're in Asura you know you haven't seen us shouting to sell stuff in almost an year now.

[Sechs]

but repeating it just feels like bragging.

I got the same feeling from some posts.
But I'm not a teacher or a drill sergeant, I can't wave my whip at people if they behave in a way I don't like, there's no military regime.
Plus, while I can perfectly understand this looking annoying, I can also understand someone being particularly excited for achieving something cool, even if he still doesn't fully understands how it happened. It's exciting, I'm sure a lot of us felt like that at least once in their lives.

[Tatham]

Then why is someone in your screenshots shouting right now for a GEO and guaranteeing pop & win?

That was me shouting and I was (we were) not selling clear spots. I was shouting for a 4-song Bard as we lost ours (Sechs!) due to the time and figured we might as well fill up the open slots with BLM and SCH who wanted the clear. People wanted to keep going so I had to find replacements from somewhere.

In case you're interested you can ask the players we invited whether or not we charged them. Some of them are JP however.

Jebas, Akemi, Akomo, Nashell.

[Sechs]

If that is working for you then great but from our experience we never did impact in our runs. Looking forward to seeing the ss of your wins when you beat it.

I'm pretty confident there are multiple ways, and we cannot understand that because, as I was saying before, we still haven't found the CORRECT way to do this.
We used Light SCs btw, and low tier nukes/spells

[Sechs]

There's just something specific we're missing

^ this for 10.000.
Plus randomness.
Plus I still don't buy the 6 step thing, even if it worked.

Oh also now that I remember, while we didn't post a lot of stuff on forums I already mentioned sharing what little knowledge I had with Fival, and I know stuff has been shared with Pergatory as well (afaik they're in the same LS).
So it's not like we didn't want to share, we were just, I dunno, confused? (and someone instead was particularly excited and decided to brag a bit, but as annoying as that can be, I find it a "human" behaviour and understandable, given the excitement and the context)
I still am partially confused, but then again I'm a galka so can't really blame me.

[bob]

^ this for 10.000.
Plus randomness.
Plus I still don't buy the 6 step thing, even if it worked.

Oh also now that I remember, while we didn't post a lot of stuff on forums I already mentioned sharing what little knowledge I had with Fival, and I know stuff has been shared with Pergatory as well (afaik they're in the same LS).
So it's not like we didn't want to share, we were just, I dunno, confused? (and someone instead was particularly excited and decided to brag a bit, but as annoying as that can be, I find it a "human" behaviour and understandable, given the excitement and the context)
I still am partially confused, but then again I'm a galka so can't really blame me.

Hey hey hey now, dont take 1 for the team, us galka have to stick together.
It is all the tarutaru's fault for being verticlly challenged!

[Hoshiku]

Based on what our group has experienced versus what others have could it be possible that the requirement is to magic burst above some threshold that does not kill the elemental?

Has anyone figured out how to predict what elemental weakness he will swap to? I'm pretty sure the tp move gates of taurtaurus only happens when you cure the guy with a bad guess nuke and the forced weakness is annoying on a fight where you can have no deaths.

[Zerowone]

Just going to put this out there:

There is a way to pop Plouton without popping Perfidien. However, you need to have already defeated Plouton to be able to do this. Also this might possible just be bad design as well.

Defeat Plouton and obtain the fabricated pearl of the false king.
Return to Leafallia and speak with Skkorr.
After the cutscene select the Odessyan Passage again.
Select the option you want a new prototype pearl of the false king.
To obtain it you will need to trade in your prototype ashenwing ki.

Now you have the prototype pearl of the false king and are relieved of your ashenwing (perfidien).


Also if you do happen to pop Perfidien while trying to pop Plouton, which ever stage you were working on appears to be reset. Not a big deal since more than likely you will be trying to complete the third requirement at that time.

[Pergatory]

So I had a thought last night as I was laying down that would explain why groups are having so much difficulty reproducing the pop conditions of other groups.

I think you need some number (~6 maybe) of two simultaneous magic bursts, likely of the same element, where one deals almost exactly twice as much damage as the other.

When our group was getting the best success was with Impact MB (~7-8k) followed by Lunar Bay MB (~13-20k). Yet other groups have been able to pop with T1 and T2 nukes. I suspect those T2 nukes were doing almost exactly twice as much damage as the T1 nukes when they got it to pop.

[Saevel]

So I had a thought last night as I was laying down that would explain why groups are having so much difficulty reproducing the pop conditions of other groups.

I think you need some number (~6 maybe) of two simultaneous magic bursts, likely of the same element, where one deals almost exactly twice as much damage as the other.

When our group was getting the best success was with Impact MB (~7-8k) followed by Lunar Bay MB (~13-20k). Yet other groups have been able to pop with T1 and T2 nukes. I suspect those T2 nukes were doing almost exactly twice as much damage as the T1 nukes when they got it to pop.

We only did tier I nukes on ours, though I do think you need more then one MB in order for it to count. We had three or four people lighting off Fire I on our liquefaction chain, and then the same with Aero I on our L3 light SC. Worked like clockwork every time even though we frequently changed out members.

I do believe this functions like a hidden RoE objective where you need to do X or Y in order to get the light upgrade but your never told when you successfully complete one which is whats creating the confusion. Too many people are doing silly stuff like big SC's and MB's without first going back to the basics. 400 damage Seraph Blade to 400 damage Red Lotus Blade makes a weak Liquefaction that gets a weakish Fire I nuke MB'd on. 800~1000 damage CDC SC with another similarly weak CDC for a 1500~2000 damage light and serveral weak Aero I MBs. After 5~6 we get the Perfidian key item upgrade message, another 5~6 and we get the Plouton key item upgrade message. Then it's just do four SC's in sequence to pop Perfidian and six SC's in sequence to pop Plouton. No 10K, 20K, 50K MBs needed, no double light SC's needed. Go back to the basics, have people turn off gearswap so they don't blow it up and do level 30's Jungle era SC Magic Burst complete with coordination.

[Fival]

The proc rate on Odium's death is as depressingly low as twilight scythe, if not lower, probably lower to account for more swings. I'll edit this post with an example if it ever procs.

There it is, 1 proc in 166 samples, and i did this for like 10 minutes before i even loaded scoreboard, so 1/250+ easily.

[BerenTebogo]

The proc rate on Odium's death is as depressingly low as twilight scythe, if not lower, probably lower to account for more swings. I'll edit this post with an example if it ever procs.

There it is, 1 proc in 166 samples, and i did this for like 10 minutes before i even loaded scoreboard, so 1/250+ easily.

Looking forward to same from death spikes.

[Fival]

At least both pieces are really great pieces for other reasons.

[BerenTebogo]

What observations, for or against, have those who have killed Plouton noticed about killing hybrid elementals? Have you had runs where you've killed some and popped Plouton? Have the runs where you've killed some been runs where he couldn't pop?

During out pop attempts last night we ended up deliberately trying to avoid hybrids / sleeping any that aggro / etc and it, in general, felt like a hassle. Wanted to get some word on whether we have the OK to just kill them if they aggro without any effect on pop conditions.

[Foldypaws]

What observations, for or against, have those who have killed Plouton noticed about killing hybrid elementals? Have you had runs where you've killed some and popped Plouton? Have the runs where you've killed some been runs where he couldn't pop?

During out pop attempts last night we ended up deliberately trying to avoid hybrids / sleeping any that aggro / etc and it, in general, felt like a hassle. Wanted to get some word on whether we have the OK to just kill them if they aggro without any effect on pop conditions.

We have killed hybrid elementals and popped Plouton.

[BerenTebogo]

We have killed hybrid elementals and popped Plouton.

Thanks!

[Montag]

no spawn after 6 attempts, will try more tomorrow

MBing comet seemed to get us the first message, even if it didn't kill the monster (only 1 instance this occurred.)
After completing condition 1, we couldn't complete the 2nd magic condition.

After that, we did magic kills first, got that condition completed and then we couldn't MB comet for the 2nd condition. We tried to do t1/2 scs with t1 nukes a few times as well and that didn't give us a message.

Tomorrow i'll try doing t1/2 scs + t1 mabs the entire way through. If that doesn't work, we'll do the magic kills, and then t1/2 scs+ t1 mabs. If THAT doesn't work, then we'll try MABing impact on darkness and doing magic kills as well. If that doesn't work, well then I'm outta fucken ideas!

We just went through in a 5 man party and did Light, darkness, liquefication, distortion, fragmentation and gravitation SCs (from 1 SAM) with T1 MBs (from 2 GEOs) for 45 min and only 1 upgrade. MB damage was in the 1k-7k range. I threw in about 5 T4/T5 Blizzard MBs in the 20k range and nothing. We killed at least 3 of every ele type except water cause we didn't have the people to kill Umbril NM. Entered on Windsday I think and it was iceday when we exited. So it feels like we're really missing something here.

Also highest capacity/exp chain was probably 11-13.

[Cyleena]

What observations, for or against, have those who have killed Plouton noticed about killing hybrid elementals? Have you had runs where you've killed some and popped Plouton? Have the runs where you've killed some been runs where he couldn't pop?

During out pop attempts last night we ended up deliberately trying to avoid hybrids / sleeping any that aggro / etc and it, in general, felt like a hassle. Wanted to get some word on whether we have the OK to just kill them if they aggro without any effect on pop conditions.

We did not bother with hybrid. We just full out nuked them and killed them. It did not affect pop condition by killing them. This is confirmed. You can go ahead and just kill them, and it will be fine.

[mesheef]

The more I read this the more I get to wondering if it is accumulated sc dmg or accumulated MB dmg. Some people say 6-8 kills, others swear buy 10 kills and some people are saying 12+.

Maybe 100k of sc dmg and 100k of MB dmg?
Idk I am just throwing ideas out.

More I think about it, I wonder if magic dmg to weakness of element is causing the ki to proc instead of just the kills, the nuke damage alone might be killing them, but I wonder if it is the marker of reaching a certain point of damage as well to elements weakness.

So maybe..
100k+ dmg to element weakness
100k+ sc dmg
100k+ MB dmg

100k is just a number off the top of my head, could be 250k+ for all I know. I am just trying to find out the 100% trick to it all.


Edit:
We just ran in with a soboro sam and everyone in 0 MaB gear MB every SC we saw, even MB lullaby and silence (making sure to keep dmg low) We saw probably 30+ MB, however we did not see the MB ki upgrade. I am really thinking it has to do with amount of damage dealt with MB, SC and opposing element.