Paladin 3.0 - Now with +1 Button

[Jahaudant]

My static works on a Main / Sub job system. So if anyone has a STR melee sub then they get priority over us tanks sadly

This really makes no sense... for the sake of improving your actual running setup you should be giving Slaying stuff to tanks before peoples damn non-raiding classes.

Who gives a shit what your main White Mage's Monk can do on Ravana? Get some i210 slaying on your WAR/PLD/DRK and enjoy better raid dps, faster clears, more comfortable dps checks.

[Shaano]

That's how I feel. I am secondary on monk, but 3rd for str pieces. Goes from our main str dps, 2 tanks, then me. I enjoy faster runs vs turtles.

[Krad]

I'm not buying any pieces that drop in A1-2.

Sword > Shield > Body > Head is my current grab order of the day. I also take 5-6 days to cap Eso so the weekly cap isn't a big hang up with my limited playtime.

Can you remember the old stat weight for PLD's det?
I know they have changed now, but I was trying to work out which was better 8 Str vs 66 det.

[Jem]

It's probably similar to the DRG weightings that were posted recently. They had DET at low 0.1's. So 8 STR should theoretically win.

[Arelian]

I was looking at stats, and if i'm going from 180 body to the esoterics body, is it still worth it to nab the shield first? The body stat increases/defense increases seem like they'd be more beneficial over +20something block rate and +4-5 stats compared to the 180 shield.

[Jem]

Well it's unfair to compare just shield to Body. You'd have to compare Shield + another item. I know that I'm doing Weapon > Shield > Waist > Body and I think Taint said the same thing.

[Niiro]

I don't get why people think the shield is a good upgrade, compared to Asuran it's only like 20 more block and the STR/VIT gains are barely accessory-tier.

Does it even bump the block amount more than 1%?

[Jem]

People think it's a good upgrade because it is?

Shield - 3 STR / 3 VIT for 295 Eso
Waist - 3 STR / 5 VIT for 375 Eso
Hands/Feet/Head - 4 STR / 6 VIT for 495 Eso
Body/Legs - 7 STR / 10 VIT for 825 Eso

It's the most efficient Eso > STR upgrade. Secondaries aren't awful either (Crit / SkS) since Hive is Parry/SkS. Especially considering all the other Creed pieces have pretty shitty secondaries (I.e. Acc or Parry and in some cases both, gloves and shield are the only two with double offensive secondaries)

I guess if you're going from 180 body or legs it's slightly different. But if you're going from i190 then Shield + a 495 Eso items is 790 Eso for 6 STR / 9 VIT except you get to pick more favourable secondaries.

Really the only reason Body is worthwhile is because the Alex Savage body comes from A4S.

[Niiro]

Eh, I don't think it's fair to compare shield to other left side gear without mentioning the DEF increases now that they're actually substantial.

I did forget that the shield was that cheap tho.

[Jem]

Well the thing to consider about Shield, which I editted in as you were posting, is that you can get Shield + 1 495 piece for less Eso than the Body/Legs and you get to cherry pick secondaries.

I'd also think the marginal increase in shield stats is probably equally as small a gain as 32 defense (which is what Body/Legs give). I forget how much defense protect gives but adding 32 defense to like 2000+ defense can't be that much of an improvement.

EDIT: Just to compare Body to Shield + 495 piece

790 Eso - Shield + Hands = 6 STR / 9 VIT / 71 Crit / 46 Skill Speed upgrade from the 190 pieces
825 Eso - Body = 7 STR / 10 VIT / -77 SkS (That is a minus not a typo, so essentially not an offensive gain at all from 190 using weighting)

That actually gives me second thoughts about doing Body so soon...

[Carth]

Going by the aformentioned weights, Creed Body is your least effective Esoteric upgrade. However, it's still better than Prototype since you essentially lose no offense while definitely meeting all accuracy checks. That said, if you're looking to avoid garbage secondary stats, you would have to hold out for Gordian.

In comparison to the two sets:

Creed Head > Gordian Head (56 DET > 41 Sks)
Creed Body < Gordian Body (~11 STR Equivalent from Gordian while Creed offers nothing)
Creed Hands > Gordian Hands (~13 STR Equivalent from Creed. Gordian offers nothing.)
Creed Legs < Gordian Legs (63 DET < 94 CRT)
Creed Feet > Gordian Feet (Same weighting, but Accuracy > Parry)
Ardent/Fabled Belt > Gordian Belt

Out of all the Creed BiS pieces, Hands is definitely your best upgrade, then Feet, then Head, then Belt.

Thing is if you're running Savage regularly (which you should be if you're this attentive to your upgrades), you will more than likely be getting Gordian pieces, so it just seems smarter to go for either Body or Legs first. Out of those two, Legs are better.

The only thing Creed Body has going for it is the massive Accuracy boost, which pretty much screw any accuracy check and allow you to add more offensive stats to your pentamelds I guess.

[Shalafi]

I still don't understand why they separate sword and shield, all other jobs pay the same amount for their 1 weapon, especially since they've clearly demonstrated they can handle them together as one.

[Taint]

I still don't understand why they separate sword and shield, all other jobs pay the same amount for their 1 weapon, especially since they've clearly demonstrated they can handle them together as one.

Well PLDs can pair swords/shields in various configurations. So in the end its a little extra bonus to PLD while they shit on PLD in every other department.

[Jem]

There was that one time that the Sword/Shield combo was extra shitting on PLD as it required an extra item to upgrade compared to everyone else. Might have be when it was Sands to upgrade.

And yeah I'd take Gordian into account more if my static wasn't so casual (3-6 hours per week, 3 hours per week only for the next month). I do take my gear choice and shit seriously, I could find a static who took it as seriously as me and did more runs. But I've known the majority of them 10+ years now and the static times were originally worked around me (An EU who moved to NA whilst the rest are still EU) but now happen to work out for everyone.

[Carth]

I still don't understand why they separate sword and shield, all other jobs pay the same amount for their 1 weapon, especially since they've clearly demonstrated they can handle them together as one.

Because Sword and Shield are handled as separate drops in dungeons.

[Edelweiss]

Because Sword and Shield are handled as separate drops in dungeons.

You also have to upgrade Hauteclaire and Prytwen together this time. lol

[Niiro]

There was that one time that the Sword/Shield combo was extra shitting on PLD as it required an extra item to upgrade compared to everyone else. Might have be when it was Sands to upgrade.

Shield always needed an accessory upgrade item (oil/coat).

Expansion gear upgrades sword/shield together but that also means you can't upgrade either unless you have both.

[Taint]

Shield always needed an accessory upgrade item (oil/coat).

Expansion gear upgrades sword/shield together but that also means you can't upgrade either unless you have both.

Yeah I really liked the only way being able to upgrade the shield with just an oil. Yes it took 2 items but for raids it was the obvious first oil upgrade for the team.

[Jem]

Shield always needed an accessory upgrade item (oil/coat).

Expansion gear upgrades sword/shield together but that also means you can't upgrade either unless you have both.

Yeah but the point is that Sword/Shield needed 2 items to upgrade. Everyone else only needed 1. So basically they equalled out the initial item cost by splitting it between Sword/Shield but did not in the upgrade process.

[Shalafi]

You also have to upgrade Hauteclaire and Prytwen together this time. lol

The Asuran sword and shield are upgraded together as well.