RDM Fast Cast question

[Protey]

Question: Did you have the proper Weather on? The Enhance Alacrity/Celerity only procs if you have the matching weather up.

I didn't use the feet for the first test on SCH main. The second one I did.

[Protey]

Oh, and in case anyone asks, yes I was using 92% FC, had 26% gear haste, and for magic haste I used Haste2 + 2x marches with ghorn. Basically, way overkill. If one could go over 80% recast reduction with just gear/traits/magic alone, that would have done it. But it didn't happen.

[Protey]

One more thing, just like haste's cap is undone during weakness, so is fast cast. I casted reraise while weakened with 26% gear haste and 92% FC. Recast was 56s.

(60s base recast)(1-(-1 from weakness)-.26) = 104.4s => 104s; (104s)(1-.46 from FC recast) = 56.16s => 56s.

[Fwahm]

What? Haste's cap isn't undone during weakness. and that doesn't show that Fast Cast's cap is either.

[Byrthnoth]

The recast cap is 20% of the base recast. It doesn't matter how you get there and afaik there are no recast-specific caps.

Also, Fast Cast does not (iirc) cap its effects on spell recast at 80% Fast Cast (-40% recast) whether you're weakened or not.

[Trumpy]

Didnt ScHs have to use the magian staves also to get the stun down to 4 seconds?

[Fwahm]

Only because of gear/buff limitations, IIRC. Before the ilvl update, there was very little gear that had both haste and fast cast, and they could only cap magic haste when SV was up.

[Lyramion]

I believe I saw testing that SCH relic head and af feet, the Grimore Spellcast reduction counts as JA fast cast, and subject to a 25% cap.

However -Grimoire Spellcast counts FULLY for recast reduction instead of half like fastcast.

[Protey]

What? Haste's cap isn't undone during weakness. and that doesn't show that Fast Cast's cap is either.

It does, when weakened it no longer caps at 43.75% for magic haste, etc. and FC recast doesn't cap at 40% either during weakness. What I showed above does indeed show that Fast Cast's cap is to undone while weakened. If the caps of 25% for gear haste and 40% for FC weren't undone then the recast would have been (60s) (1-(-1)-.25) = 105s; (105s) (1-.4) = 63s. But it was 56s. That's because the cap is undone. You are still limited to 20% of the base recast, but the caps for getting there are undone.

Edit: as for haste cap being undone during weakness this has been known at least since January: http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/124568-magic-haste

[Protey]

Also, Fast Cast does not (iirc) cap its effects on spell recast at 80% Fast Cast (-40% recast) whether you're weakened or not.

It does, because with 92% FC I was not getting any better results than 80% FC (while unweak that is).

[Fwahm]

It does, when weakened it no longer caps at 43.75% for magic haste, etc. and FC recast doesn't cap at 40% either during weakness. What I showed above does indeed show that Fast Cast's cap is to undone while weakened. If the caps of 25% for gear haste and 40% for FC weren't undone then the recast would have been (60s) (1-(-1)-.25) = 105s; (105s) (1-.4) = 63s. But it was 56s. That's because the cap is undone. You are still limited to 20% of the base recast, but the caps for getting there are undone.

Edit: as for haste cap being undone during weakness this has been known at least since January: http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/124568-magic-haste

That's because Weakness applies 100% magical slow, so you're not getting even close to the 43.75% magical slow cap. The same thing applies if you're hit by a powerful slow; you will still benefit from more 43.75% magical haste because the slow is being counted too.

Gear haste above the 25 cap does NOT further reduce recast even when weakened; I just checked. With 27% gear haste and 39% Fast Cast, I had 1:25 recast on Reraise while weakened; I put on Phasmida belt for a total of 32% gear haste (same amount of Fast Cast as before), and Reraise was still 1:25.

In addition, Fast Cast above 80% also does NOT reduce recast timers whether you're weakened or not. I checked that just now as well: 81% fast cast and 88% fast cast (with capped gear haste) gave exactly the same recast on Reraise (63 seconds) when I kept haste constant.

[Protey]

That's because Weakness applies 100% magical slow, so you're not getting even close to the 43.75% magical slow cap. The same thing applies if you're hit by a powerful slow; you will still benefit from more 43.75% magical haste because the slow is being counted too.

Gear haste above the 25 cap does NOT further reduce recast even when weakened; I just checked. With 27% gear haste and a fixed amount of Fast Cast, I had 1:25 recast on Reraise while weakened; I put on Phasmida belt for a total of 32% gear haste (same amount of Fast Cast as before), and Reraise was still 1:25. I used

In addition, Fast Cast above 80% also does NOT reduce recast timers whether you're weakened or not. I checked that just now as well: 81% fast cast and 88% fast cast gave exactly the same recast on Reraise (57 seconds) when I kept haste constant.

Then explain how I got 56s recast on reraise without using magical haste.

[Ihina]

Question. Hypothetically, with enough magic haste buffs, can you negate the effects of weakness?

[Fwahm]

Then explain how I got 56s recast on reraise without using magical haste.

User error. You either forgot a buff, or misread your number.

Also, I rechecked the notes I scribbled down real quick, and I had 1:03 for the capped fast cast recast test, not 0:57. I fixed that in my post.

I even did a further test where I added 6% more fast cast for a total of 94% while weakened, and it was still at 1:03.

[Fwahm]

Question. Hypothetically, with enough magic haste buffs, can you negate the effects of weakness?

You can (as in have >0% net magic haste), but unless I'm missing some, you can't still cap magic haste. SV March x2 with +5 is 62.6%, Haste II is 30%, and Indi-Haste with Idris is 40%, so with all those and weakened, you only have 32.6% magical haste.

[Protey]

User error. You either forgot a buff, or misread your number.

Also, I rechecked the notes I scribbled down real quick, and I had 1:03 for the capped fast cast recast test, not 0:57. I fixed that in my post.

I even did a further test where I added 6% more fast cast for a total of 94% while weakened, and it was still at 1:03.

Yea, I realized my mistake. I was /sch. Going /whm I got 63s. So FC recast is capped at 40% even while weakened.

[Protey]

You can (as in have >0% net magic haste), but unless I'm missing some, you can't still cap magic haste. SV March x2 with +5 is 62.6%, Haste II is 30%, and Indi-Haste with Idris is 40%, so with all those and weakened, you only have 32.6% magical haste.

You could bolster that Indi-Haste.

[Fwahm]

That's true, and I forgot about Embrava, too. So yeah, you could cap magic haste right past Weakness if you were so inclined.

[vivbiibasjiu]

Don't forget about Mighty Guard!

[Protey]

Don't forget about Mighty Guard!

Don't know much about mighty guard. Does it have it's own separate icon, or does it overwrite other forms of haste?