The Pope thread

[Rooney]

That right there is exactly why young people are moving away from the church. Preaching tolerance, mercy, inclusion, etc and then doing the opposite (in secret meetings no less).

[Aksannyi]

I've been away from the Catholic church for many years - nearly half my life, at this point - but I have to agree, meeting behind closed doors sends the message to me that he is concerned about his image being tainted, particularly in the minds of the young people he is more than likely trying to entice back into the church. While I'd agree to some extent that conscientious objection on religious grounds is all fine and dandy, the fact that she's a government employee in a nation where separation of church and state is very much supposed to be in practice and using that government position to impose her religion on others is very concerning, and that's a step backward for the Pope to take, honestly.

[Marootsoobutsu]

Let's say you meet the Pope and he doesn't really speak English and you don't really speak Spanish. What do you do? Smile at each other and then spend some time petting the Pope? Does the Pope like scratches? Who's a good Pope? I do not understand why the meeting was not publicized officially. It was clearly scheduled for the sake of media coverage and to nod to the conservative arm of the Church, so why make it secret for a few days?

Maybe he wanted to find out for himself if she seemed like she was doing it because faith, or doing it because "I HATE TEH GAEZ!" and didn't want to seem like he was supporting her until he found out? Or maybe he wanted to tell her, "Hey, it's fine to stand up for your faith, but chill dawg. You're making things worse."

[Tyrath]

Maybe he wanted to find out for himself if she seemed like she was doing it because faith, or doing it because "I HATE TEH GAEZ!" and didn't want to seem like he was supporting her until he found out? Or maybe he wanted to tell her, "Hey, it's fine to stand up for your faith, but chill dawg. You're making things worse."

Except he already made comments before meeting her that she was doing the right thing. And during the meeting supposedly told her to "stay strong."



On lighter hearted pope news

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/p...drank-from-it/

Thou shalt not steal is a pretty central tenet of the Bible.

But it seems Rep. Bob Brady (D-Pa.) couldn’t resist the temptation to swipe the water glass that touched the lips of Pope Francis.

Yes, on Thursday, while other lawmakers were distracted with the pope’s departure from the House chamber, Brady sneaked up to the lectern and snatched the glass used by His Holiness, the Philadelphia Daily News first reported.

[Dimmauk]

HOW DARE HIM MEET SOMEONE! He probably told her that she is going to hell for all for her sins. He probably said it in Spanish, and Kim was probably like "THIS IS AMERICA, SPEAK AMERICAN" AMIRITE?!

[Aksannyi]

I think it's less about the meeting having took place than the fact that it took place in secret, especially surrounding a rather polarizing and current political incident.

[Dimmauk]

The pope also has secret meetings with poor people back in Rome. He dresses as a regular priest and randomly visits the homeless. How terrible.

[Rooney]

Except the poor in Rome aren't actively defying the law and denying other people their rights while still getting paid for not doing their jobs? Meeting or ministering to the poor in Rome is exactly what he keeps talking about. Meeting with Davis is none of the points he keeps talking about.

He probably does that in Rome so he doesn't get mobbed by people going "OMG TEH POPE!!11!" He was trying to play both sides of the issue, and from initial reactions I'm seeing it's blowing up in his face.

[Aksannyi]

Except the poor in Rome aren't actively defying the law and denying other people their rights while still getting paid for not doing their jobs?

This, in a nutshell.

I'm not anti-Pope, by any means, but this move just has me scratching my head.

[Dimmauk]

So people that don't believe in something or religion, don't agree with the beliefs of a religion? The leader of a religion is stunningly trying to change some of those beliefs causing major backlash from the religious right and conservatives, but also gets backlash for not doing enough?

What exactly can the Pope do to make atheists happy? LOL

[Aksannyi]

I'm not an atheist, for what it's worth, I'm just not a hardcore theist. I grew up Catholic, my children are still being raised Catholic, and many of my family members are Catholic, so what the Pope says does affect me, despite the fact that I don't follow his theology.

[Dimmauk]

We don't even know what they talked about. I'm excited to see the incoming twitter battle between the Pope and Kim Davis about what they actually said to each other.

[Dimmauk]

I'm not an atheist, for what it's worth, I'm just not a hardcore theist. I grew up Catholic, my children are still being raised Catholic, and many of my family members are Catholic, so what the Pope says does affect me, despite the fact that I don't follow his theology.

I was raised Jewish, parents converted to Catholic, I was baptized when I was 16 years old, I never go to church unless its my mom's birthday, my kids don't go to church either.

[Rooney]

Just to clarify my position - I'm all for the pope actually making changes, however tiny, to make the church more modern and tolerant. But what we're seeing is a lot of talk and no action. This meeting is counter-productive to everything he keeps talking about. That's my issue.

It's a good thing he's at least started a conversation about some issues. We all know the church enacts changes at a glacial pace, but I think most people are expecting the church to actually do something at this point considering how many people are leaving organized religion (especially younger generations).

[Gredival]

Just to clarify my position - I'm all for the pope actually making changes, however tiny, to make the church more modern and tolerant. But what we're seeing is a lot of talk and no action.

I think the very opening of the dialogue, the extended hand, to say that he cannot judge a gay person is action. Not just because the Church is an institution that naturally resists change, but because it's literally the starting point when you consider where we are now vs. where we were because Francis.

[Tyrath]

And then he has a secret meeting behind the curtains with a fringe anti-gay figure and tells her to stay strong. How do people not see the dishonesty and meaninglessness of the gesture of "I can't judge a gay person" after that?

[archibaldcrane]

Yeah, he shouldve met her as a media event to declare her actions against the gay agenda as a role model for all Catholics to follow!

[archibaldcrane]

I mean, fuck the pope for meeting with that miserable troll, but the idea that he shouldve made a public spectacle out of it is just WTF

[Blubbartron]

I mean, fuck the pope for meeting with that miserable troll, but the idea that he shouldve made a public spectacle out of it is just WTF

Are you intentionally failing to understand that the point is regarding his two-faced dishonesty, exemplifying the fact that he isn't really progressive at all? He's a PR stunt by the Catholic church.

[Jaybar]

No you're unrealistically expecting him to completely overturn all church doctrine. And this ENTIRE THREAD is about the semantics of "progressive" I'm surprised we all haven't been banned yet.

Yea he's going to be anti-abortion, thankfully he didn't pull a Huckabee like Archi said. He also stated in his address to Congress we need to care about life in all of its development (birth to death). So you can pigeon hole his stance into abortion but he's really advocating for the welfare of every - single - person regardless of age/race/religion/gender/sexuality. But let's focus on one thing and not call him progressive enough.