PC Principal thread

[Blubbartron]

Jesus. The shit getting taught in classrooms.

[TheDirtyHobo]

It's obviously victimology rhetoric, but it's not entirely wrong, either. It just employs the "let's completely ignore parts that don't suit the rhetoric" tactic. Race and science both undeniably exist outside of human influence, but colonization (in its broadest terms) tends to assign high value to them. Any expansion-focused colony will usually erase 'indigenous peoples' (aka very small or underdeveloped colonies, but this is anti-colonization so we'll disguise that fact). Third part is true. I disagree that discovery is rooted in colonization so much as the human psyche, but colonization certainly gives it a higher value. Words do have meaning, meaning given to them by the social constructs of colonies that wish to communicate with each other.

[zoobernut]

How does race exist outside of human influence? I thought that there was essentially no scientific basis for race but it was a social construct to try to categorize people based on a loose set of criteria that includes how you physically look and where you were born.

Outside of human influence different species exist but I am uncertain of race.

[Byrthnoth]

I don't know exactly what you want to define as race, but how you look depends pretty heavily on your DNA.

[Niiro]

Exactly how different does the DNA of 2 different people have to be in order to constitute a difference of race.

It's a fairly arbitrary human construct.

People don't care about a person's DNA when labeling their race, they care about how they look.

[zoobernut]

I don't know exactly what you want to define as race, but how you look depends pretty heavily on your DNA.

And those differences in DNA are statistically insignificant even if we think the end physical result is significant. Also there is tons of DNA variance within a "race" so how is that DNA variance different than the variance between "races"?

You get into even more trouble when you have rare genetic anomalies where someone born to two parents of a particular race happen to not look anything like them and actually look like another race. Does that mean they belong to the race they look like or the one they were born into? How can anyone tell?

[Byrthnoth]

Well, fortunately we're discussing a wikipediable topic.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_genetics

The relationship between race and genetics is relevant to the controversy concerning race classification. In everyday life many societies classify populations into groups based on phenotypical traits and impressions of probable geographic ancestry and socio-economic status—these are the groups usually called "races" in countries like the United States. Because the patterns of variation of human genetic traits can be both abrupt and clinal, with a gradual change in trait frequency between population clusters, it is possible to statistically correlate clusters of physical traits with individual geographic ancestry. The frequencies of alleles tend to form clusters where populations live closely together and interact over periods of time. This is due to endogamy within kin groups and lineages or national, cultural or linguistic boundaries. This causes genetic clusters to correlate statistically with population groups when a number of alleles are evaluated. Different clines align around the different centers, resulting in more complex variations than those observed comparing continental groups.

Do yall seriously think shit like skin color, hair color/texture, eye shape, etc. is determined by experience? Am I seriously misunderstanding your point of view?

[Salodin]

Generally speaking, I think some of you are generalizing species with race. Usually, something is a different species of it can't successfully produce offspring with something of another species. Race is just a subset of that if you reallllly want to give it a label outside of what it already is. Different races of humans can mate, but there are still differences if they really matter to you. Asians sweat less, Africans have higher blood pressure, I'm sure Caucasians and Hispanics have their own thing too. Outside of that, what does it really matter?

Honestly, it's not much different than dogs. Theyre all the same species, but you know for sure some dogs are way different than others.

[Thunder]

Do yall seriously think shit like skin color, hair color/texture, eye shape, etc. is determined by experience? Am I seriously misunderstanding your point of view?

you're in too deep. I can't figure out how you could assume this is anybody's point w/o being overloaded by SJW news >.>

[Byrthnoth]

I leave the interpretation of this to you, then:

And those differences in DNA are statistically insignificant even if we think the end physical result is significant. Also there is tons of DNA variance within a "race" so how is that DNA variance different than the variance between "races"?

You get into even more trouble when you have rare genetic anomalies where someone born to two parents of a particular race happen to not look anything like them and actually look like another race. Does that mean they belong to the race they look like or the one they were born into? How can anyone tell?

[Galkaeater]

Its a social construct in much the same way colour is.

[Psion]

Its a social construct in much the same way colour is.

lol

[Thunder]

I interpret it as;

race, the word, is arbitrary. There is no way to, scientifically, say that X amount of differences in DNA between two humans constitutes them as separate races - especially when you try and account for rare genetic anomalies (whatever that is? albino? idk) where they happen to look like another race but not share that race's DNA

We're all humans and constructing these 'races' was an arbitrary and pointless endeavor

to say he's saying that niggas b black because they experienced something different than a white person is so patronizing it was probably the funniest serious comment I've ever read on here lol

Anyway, hopefully zoob can get in here and clear it up. But I'd bet a lot of dollars on him knowing that skin color, hair texture/color, eye shape, sickle cell, sweating (thx sal), etc etc is environmental only in so far as you can call hundreds of thousands of years of evolution environmental

[Blubbartron]

I agree with most of the general points you guys made. Race is arbitrary in terms of where we draw the lines, but it's absolutely a thing. It also does get a little blurry because of interracial couples currently and in the past, but the difficulty to define it cleanly is partly because nobody wants us to be able to clearly delineate. They assume that having clean lines would give rise to more racism (as suggested in that slide, it's a tool of colonialism or some such nonsense).

I should also mention that the technical term for race is subspecies. A grouping within a species where each grouping has (more or less) unique characteristics in some fashion.

Lastly, while I think using race is important to further our knowledge in medical and policy research, I also acknowledge that in less than 50 years it will be rendered irrelevant due to the ability to quickly, and cheaply, map someone's entire genome. Race is sort of a heuristic method for guessing someone's genome, and it's clearly better to just map it when we can.

[Salodin]

What's the point of this again?

[Niiro]

Someone said race was a construct that exists regardless of human influence.

Genetic differences exist to many different degrees, but that's not what race is to human society where the term is applied far more arbitrarily.

[TheDirtyHobo]

@Thunder
Except that's, again, letting the narrative (of wanting race to be a cultural construct) decide the facts. Race is a thing that exists with or without humans. Period. Human intervention tends to accelerate or accentuate it (dogs, apples, etc), but it also happens naturally. Two populations of a species become isolated and naturally diverge, first racially, then sub-specially, then specially.

[Ksandra]

Is this real life:



and the triggering in it's entirety:

If you've ever wondered why old people go conservative, just wait till we see hard far this shit goes by the time we're 60.

[Niiro]

Except that's, again, letting the narrative (of wanting race to be a cultural construct) decide the facts. Race is a thing that exists with or without humans. Period. Human intervention tends to accelerate or accentuate it (dogs, apples, etc), but it also happens naturally. Two populations of a species become isolated and naturally diverge, first racially, then sub-specially, then specially.

What amount of genetic variation constitutes a difference in race?

[Jefe]

lol

I think the dude meant: boyz = blue, grills = pink*. Not the em spectrum.

*Said claim is only supported by a horrific feminazi website.