Pokémon Sun/Moon - Nov 18, 2016

[Silenka]

I swear the more I see of this game the more it seems like a shakeup to the pokemon formula, and I think I like it.

Not only that but for me this is aesthetically absolutely the best crop of pokemon ever, even better than 1st gen. I'm loving almost all of them. Lots of cute ones and really interesting ones, the silly is kept to a bearable minimum so far. Very inspired designs all around, it's the first time I'd be actually looking forward to filling out my entire Pokedex rather that seeing it as kind of a chore.

If the water starter really ends up a siren why would it not be water / fairy? It looks like it's gonna be water / fairy. Grass / dark would be cool for the owl but I could see it ending up as grass / fighting or anything really. I really hope the cat won't be fire / fighting and I don't think that's the way they'll go this time since there have already been so many and it seems they're intent on shaking up the formula, but its design, if true, isn't promising...

[Seravi Edalborez]

Grass/Fighting would be a disappointment imo since the last grass, Chesnaught, was that type also. As much as I'm a Fighting lover.

e: While we're on the subject. As much as I don't actually like any of the gen4 starters I think they represent the most diverse type combinations of a generation because they get muddled against both of their counterparts (Fire/Fighting, Grass/Ground, Water/Steel). Empoleon gets especially weird because Steel is a great type yet he becomes weak to both of the others' subtypes.

[Rooney]

I just went with what they did in x/y for the starters, where there's both a fire>grass>water cycle and a fighting>dark>psychic cycle. I agree that fairy looks like a better fit, but judging based on what we know so far I'd wager pscyhic. :/

[Moss]

I swear the more I see of this game the more it seems like a shakeup to the pokemon formula, and I think I like it.

ugh idk, worried it's gonna be too kiddie. should be interesting at least

[Draylo]

I'm worried its gonna be too easy for the normal gameplay. Not saying Pokemon was always super hard but stop giving everyone 1~3 Pokemon that you just one shot. They need to introduce intelligent trainers/gym leaders that swap their Pokemon out based on certain variables or actually are challenging. Probably asking too much though considering who their audience is.

[Drai]

Isn't it Canon that Gym leaders aren't allowed to swap Pokemon during a match? only the challenger? :O but I do agree they need stronger pokemon overall, or at least full teams maybe

[Vaspinne]

No gym leaders this time. Each island has trials/trial leaders and when you finish the trials you face off against the island's Kahuna before moving onto the next island.

[Drai]

^ yeah, no gyms this time either way, and the trials aren't totally about battling, some have puzzles and such to solve.

[Silenka]

The games are marketed towards children though. As many children as adults play. So unfortunately they can't really tweak the game to be much more difficult than it already is. For we adults I suppose there is the "endgame" of breeding and battling against each other, and self-imposed challenges like Nuzlocke or filling out the entire pokedex, or catching all the shinies (or playing difficulty-enhanced versions of the games if you can find them online...)

Personally, I think they have always struck a pretty good "family friendly" balance. There are parts of the game that are tougher than other parts, and sometimes there are things that require you to do a long string of tasks before you can progress in the game. The games aren't totally completely no-brainer stuff, but also not truly difficult by any stretch.

What would really be good this time is if they shake up the formula enough that even adult players have to momentarily pause to figure some really new things out. If we can break the mold of Gym -> HM -> Gym -> HM -> Beat up Team Whoever -> Gym -> HM -> Elite [insert # here], that would be a great shakeup already. More puzzles would be nice too.

[Vaspinne]

What would really be good this time is if they shake up the formula enough that even adult players have to momentarily pause to figure some really new things out. If we can break the mold of Gym -> HM -> Gym -> HM -> Beat up Team Whoever -> Gym -> HM -> Elite [insert # here], that would be a great shakeup already. More puzzles would be nice too.

I try not to use the word literally often as it gets so overused and is really annoying to read, especially since so many teens who use the word use it in terrible context. But this is literally what is happening with this game.

No more gyms, looks like HMs are going to be in the form of "rent-a-Pokemon", trials will have a few different elements to them, etc etc.

Though it is 40 minutes long and you can skip a lot of it, that game explain video posted above is a really interesting watch in regard to what sort of stuff we can guess we'll be getting with this game

[Moss]

I'm worried its gonna be too easy for the normal gameplay. Not saying Pokemon was always super hard but stop giving everyone 1~3 Pokemon that you just one shot. They need to introduce intelligent trainers/gym leaders that swap their Pokemon out based on certain variables or actually are challenging. Probably asking too much though considering who their audience is.

it's been this way for a while (forever?) though, unfortunately. At least in Gen 1, which I just finished replaying, opponent level increases at a pretty high rate. My 5 poke team was in the upper 40s by the time we hit the E4, which were low 50s-mid 60s. Each gen after that it has been getting lower and lower. I don't know how you make it harder honestly, besides giving opposing trainers stronger pokemon and more balanced teams. any player with a strong knowledge of typing and team construction is going to OHKO just about everything

it would be cool if they really boosted the opposing trainer AI and strategies to make each battle an actual challenge. in turn they could make losses more forgiving (no longer losing half of your $ or w/e it is)

[Silenka]

I didn't think there was a consequence for losing.

[Seravi Edalborez]

bulbapedia to the rescue: http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Black_out

In the Generation I games, Generation II games, and Pokémon Ruby, Sapphire, and Emerald, the amount of money lost is simply half of the money the player has. In Pokémon FireRed, LeafGreen, and all games from Generation IV onwards, the money lost is calculated using the following formula:

Money lost = Level x Base payout

Where Level is the level of the player's highest-level Pokémon and Base payout is looked up using the following table:

(Table doesn't lend itself to pasting very well but tldr it's based on # of badges)

The minimum amount of money that the player can lose is $8 (if the Pokémon with the highest level in the player's party is level 1 and the player has 0 Badges; 1×8=8), while the maximum is $12000 (if the Pokémon with the highest level in the player's party is level 100 and the player has 8 Badges; 100×120=12000).

[Karbuncle]

I'd just be okay with a difficulty adjuster (I.E Easy, Normal, Hard).

Easy could be the casualness, Pokemon are lower levels, Trainers are basic like they are now with crap IV/EV's
Normal would be a bit harder, Trainers Pokemon are ~5 levels higher than normal or more, Have about Half IV/EVs in their Pokemon.
Hard would be well, hard, Trainers Pokemon are maybe 10~15 levels higher, and have near perfect IV/EV's for their Pokemon, as well as better A.I.

Special trainers that already have perfect IV Pokemon or EV can just be better AI and higher level. Would be nice to play a Pokemon game on Hard always feel like I just breeze through it, they should acknowledge the want for a more tangibly difficult experience for the adult Pokemon audience they should expect to have now, like what, 15-20 years later? Make your easy mode but give us the option to be punished

[Draylo]

it's been this way for a while (forever?) though, unfortunately. At least in Gen 1, which I just finished replaying, opponent level increases at a pretty high rate. My 5 poke team was in the upper 40s by the time we hit the E4, which were low 50s-mid 60s. Each gen after that it has been getting lower and lower. I don't know how you make it harder honestly, besides giving opposing trainers stronger pokemon and more balanced teams. any player with a strong knowledge of typing and team construction is going to OHKO just about everything

it would be cool if they really boosted the opposing trainer AI and strategies to make each battle an actual challenge. in turn they could make losses more forgiving (no longer losing half of your $ or w/e it is)

There are tons of fan made games based off the originals that are quite challenging. I haven't played a majority of them but some of them have the gym leaders and trainers with smart choices and tough pokemon that they also swap in and out. I don't see how it would be too difficult for the real pokemon DEVs to do that but I guess they wouldn't want to make it hard for the casual gamer. I just wish they would and maybe have the hard mode they introduced in Pokemon Black.

[Robertfb]

Need to realize the pokemon games are in essence a game series geared toward children, so by making it artificially hard defeats the purpose of targeting the audience they're aiming the games at.

[Guitarman]

I've always enjoyed the pokemon games being easier. I approach them looking for a fun, lighthearted way to relax and unwind.

Eh, maybe its just me. I understand the want for more difficulty. I guess I just take it for what it is and enjoy it.

[Moss]

There are tons of fan made games based off the originals that are quite challenging. I haven't played a majority of them but some of them have the gym leaders and trainers with smart choices and tough pokemon that they also swap in and out. I don't see how it would be too difficult for the real pokemon DEVs to do that but I guess they wouldn't want to make it hard for the casual gamer. I just wish they would and maybe have the hard mode they introduced in Pokemon Black.

I did not know that was a thing, will have to look into that

Need to realize the pokemon games are in essence a game series geared toward children, so by making it artificially hard defeats the purpose of targeting the audience they're aiming the games at.

realizing that and dreaming of them being harder (or having a difficulty setting) are not mutually exclusive

[BadKarma]

fire starter gonna be fire/dark.

I love that typing so fucking much

[Karbuncle]

Need to realize the pokemon games are in essence a game series geared toward children, so by making it artificially hard defeats the purpose of targeting the audience they're aiming the games at.

Eh? They know and have acknowledged they have an older/adult audience (Its been cited here hasn't it?)... and regardless of that or not an Optional game mode for a higher challenge defeats nothing, their children can still play normal mode or easy.

I'm not saying it needs to be mandatory but I'd like the option to have more of a challenge than ... zero. Will not having it stop me from buying it? I mean no, I'll probably still get the game, its simply a matter of complaining out of love