NBA OFF/OPT OUT SEASON 2016: THIS IS FOR YOU CLEVE LAND!

[Jem]

That Oladipo trade pisses me off so much as a Magic fan. I really can't overstate how angry I am at our GM right now.

Oladipo was the Magic. He was the clear fan favorite and always gave 100%. He also improved massively at the end of last season. You could have traded away anybody except Dipo or Gordon and the fans would be fine with it. Not with this though.

Spoken to a few friends and basically all our hope for the new season has instantly died. Right now all 3 of us are no longer getting season tickets.

[tyven]

wtf ibaka to orlando

HUGE haul for okc

@WojVerticalNBA
Orlando will send Victor Oladipo, Ersan Ilyasova and rights to Sabonis to the Thunder, sources said.

Wow how is Ibaka worth anywhere near that?

[notorious bum]

That Oladipo trade pisses me off so much as a Magic fan. I really can't overstate how angry I am at our GM right now.

Oladipo was the Magic. He was the clear fan favorite and always gave 100%. He also improved massively at the end of last season. You could have traded away anybody except Dipo or Gordon and the fans would be fine with it. Not with this though.

Spoken to a few friends and basically all our hope for the new season has instantly died. Right now all 3 of us are no longer getting season tickets.

Can't agree more, man. My condolences.

[kisada]

Wow how is Ibaka worth anywhere near that?

thinking on it some more i like it a bit more for orlando. like, it's still an overpay but orlando needed to make sure they had money to keep fournier and they improved tremendously in the frontcourt.

[Jem]

thinking on it some more i like it a bit more for orlando. like, it's still an overpay but orlando needed to make sure they had money to keep fournier and they improved tremendously in the frontcourt.

I don't see how it improves our cap space situation

Ilyasova was a Team Option
Oladipo's contract is 4m less than Ibaka's
We have a shit ton of cap space already (like 50m+)

Also some other issues

Ibaka plays same position as Aaron Gordon move is short sighted / stunts Gordon's growth
Ibaka is in a contract year. We have a way higher chance of Dipo resigning in his contract year than Ibaka
Signing Ibaka means we have given up on Horford so where the fuck are we going to spend our cap space now?
If you're hellbent on trading Oladipo in a package deal, it better be for a fucking star player and Ibaka is not that caliber.

[Jem]

Welp. Don't know whether it's a good or bad thing. Have the top liked post (I.e. rant) on the official Magic post announcing the trade. Which obviously means my phone getting blown up.

[kisada]

I don't see how it improves our cap space situation

Ilyasova was a Team Option
Oladipo's contract is 4m less than Ibaka's
We have a shit ton of cap space already (like 50m+)

Also some other issues

Ibaka plays same position as Aaron Gordon move is short sighted / stunts Gordon's growth
Ibaka is in a contract year. We have a way higher chance of Dipo resigning in his contract year than Ibaka
Signing Ibaka means we have given up on Horford so where the fuck are we going to spend our cap space now?
If you're hellbent on trading Oladipo in a package deal, it better be for a fucking star player and Ibaka is not that caliber.

but it's not about cap space, it's giving huge deals to both fournier and oladipo when they play the same position and only one of them can shoot.

also i like oladipo but let's be real, ibaka is a much better player than he is and likely always will be.

[Jem]

Oladipo still has a year to run on his contract and could have been traded elsewhere for better value. And there's no guarantee that Ibaka resigns so we possibly just did a 3 for 1 trade for a 1 year rental

[kisada]

well the contract thing sucks i understand, especially because orlando fans are gunshy about FA's leaving town. trust me i understand you'll be anxious about his free agency all year.

but i don't really see who else they could have picked up who was better value than a legit modern stretch big who is on the 2nd or 3rd tier of NBA PF's. i like what it does for the team in a vacuum and more than that is a gamble.

[Roranora]

Watched the 30 for 30 on the Shaq and Penny Magic last night - good stuff. I only vaguely remember how they screwed it all up as I was so young. My Hardaway jersey still survives to this day though.

[Dimmauk]

Marc Stein 

@ESPNSteinLine

Story online soon: Sources say Warriors, Spurs & incumbent Thunder are first three known teams to land recruiting meetings with Kevin Durant

8:16 PM - 24 Jun 2016

Goodbye Danny Green

[Buffy]

If the Spurs get Durant, I hope the Bulls try to trade for him.

[Jem]

It's hilarious in Orlando because people here are actually talking like we have an outside shot of getting Durant because of Ibaka. Completely ignoring that it's pretty likely Durant was consulted about Ibaka being traded away

but i don't really see who else they could have picked up who was better value than a legit modern stretch big who is on the 2nd or 3rd tier of NBA PF's. i like what it does for the team in a vacuum and more than that is a gamble.

The rumors were that we were trading Oladipo in a package for Jimmy Butler. And obviously I would have rather had Butler than Ibaka.

Ibaka undoubtedly improves our team and I think we make the playoffs. I just feel we drastically overpaid and we should have been using Oladipo as a bargaining chip to get a player who doesn't have someone similar available in free agency. The Raptors apparently wanted Ibaka, would have been interesting to see if we could have made a 3 way trade to get Lowry

I'd assume we'll lineup as Payton / Fournier / Ibaka / Gordon / Vucevic. Payton is easily the weakest link there and it's obvious we aren't going to addresss that as we probably needed to trade to do that. Whereas we could have made an improvement in the Ibaka area via free agency. Maybe not as good as Ibaka but there's options whereas at PG there isn't. I guess there's Conley but I doubt we get him and I really don't want Rondo. After that we're looking at players at a similar calibre as what we have (Payton + Jennings who is a UFA)

Be interesting to see if Payton's second year regression was due to Skiles or himself

[Moss]

It's hilarious in Orlando because people here are actually talking like we have an outside shot of getting Durant because of Ibaka. Completely ignoring that it's pretty likely Durant was consulted about Ibaka being traded away



The rumors were that we were trading Oladipo in a package for Jimmy Butler. And obviously I would have rather had Butler than Ibaka.

Ibaka undoubtedly improves our team and I think we make the playoffs. I just feel we drastically overpaid and we should have been using Oladipo as a bargaining chip to get a player who doesn't have someone similar available in free agency. The Raptors apparently wanted Ibaka, would have been interesting to see if we could have made a 3 way trade to get Lowry

I'd assume we'll lineup as Payton / Fournier / Ibaka / Gordon / Vucevic. Payton is easily the weakest link there and it's obvious we aren't going to addresss that as we probably needed to trade to do that. Whereas we could have made an improvement in the Ibaka area via free agency. Maybe not as good as Ibaka but there's options whereas at PG there isn't. I guess there's Conley but I doubt we get him and I really don't want Rondo. After that we're looking at players at a similar calibre as what we have (Payton + Jennings who is a UFA)

Be interesting to see if Payton's second year regression was due to Skiles or himself

I would MUCH rather have Ibaka than Lowry.

I don't love the trade from the Magic perspective either, but there are very few guys that can shoot 3s and protect the rim. Ibaka is a perfect fit next to Vucevic and he has been marginalized the last year or two in OKC. He's 26 and still has upside.

[kisada]

ya crazy thing is he's 26 and he can still get better.

[Andalusian girls]

it's a big bet that Ibaka's statistical regression was due to unhappiness and lowered usage rate and not a real physical decline. an African 26 can be anything and the knee surgery may have taken something out of him. that said he's the perfect frontcourt compliment to Vucevic, even a reduced Serge is a very good rim protector who can slide around with guards on the perimeter when he switches and provides solid space at the 4 with his shooting.

ditching Oladipo is also a huge bet on Fournier and Hezonja as well as a recognition Payton can conceivably be a starting 1 but Victor cannot. personally i'm still huge on Hezonja and glad the minutes are going to be opening up for him. he looked only partially NBA-ready and Skiles's eagerness to bench him seemed to stunt his swagger, but dude picked up his game towards the end of the year and flashed an explosive above the rim attack, range extending far beyond the 3-point line, and some great court vision married to a willingness to pass. Vogel is a great developmental coach and i have a hunch Mario is going to wind up the best player out of the 3, but he needs reps and time.

Orlando's path forward is p murky though. Gordon and Payton's developmental paths forward are very similar to Hezonja's, but the Ibaka acquisition is more of a win-now move and he is probably going to start at the 4 slot Gordon excelled at and will project to longterm as long as his shooting remains poor and capped at the mid-range. and the Magic will have 30-40 million in cap space they are allegedly eager to spend in free agency, if they target someone like Batum or Parsons they stunt Hezonja's development, if they aim for Conley or Lin they likewise relegate Payton to the bench. they seem unable to decide if they actually believe in their young core to grow into all-stars or they want the veterans that'll get them into the playoffs now. ideally you'd surround the kids with veterans who don't represent positional overlap but i guess we'll see what the roster looks like after free agency ends. you can get Gordon more minutes at the 4 by going small with Ibaka at the 5 for a time, but ditching Harris and Dipo opened up minutes for their high draft picks that they now seem eager to fill with more established players.

oh and i think this move makes the Thunder a little worse, Dipo is much better than Waiters or Roberson but Durant can't play the 4 for an entire season and Kanter is an enormous defensive downgrade if he starts, but it doesn't matter as apparently Durant dug it and everything they are doing is and ought be about resigning him.

[kisada]

yeah my suspicion echos many others' in that it likely makes KD a little happier.

[Jem]

Yeah, I was going to say he's 26 in African years. Probably truly is 26 but because of how prevalent an issue it is in soccer with Africans lying about their ages, I am always skeptical when it comes to African players real age. Especially when they have a decline in stats way sooner that expected, even if Ibaka's can be explained with his changing role for OKC.

And you've hit the nail on the head about overlap with the young players. I fully expect we'll target Parsons (from the area), Batum (friends with Fournier) and Conley (just makes sense) like you said. Payton is the starter I trust the least and we absolutely need to either get someone better than him or at his level for backup so he isn't so much pressure on him / the chance of ruining him. He regressed at basically every level last year and it's hard to blame it all on Skiles. That's why I'd have preferred a top tier PG over Ibaka even though both obviously help. It's also why I wanted a star trade because with the level we can get in free agency, we're sacrificing development for something that isn't that much better than what we have. It's obviously a bit more justified by a star coming in.

Magic fans all know the reasons they are giving up on development and pushing for it now is because the GM is in his 'win or get fired' year. Hopefully it will work out but we really didn't seem that far off the playoffs last year. We might have only gotten 35 wins but we were involved in a shit ton of close games / OT games where it just got away from us in the 4th. There was every chance the team as it was could have kicked on this year but it wasn't a risk Hennigan could afford to take.

I don't know how I'll feel about it but I actually wouldn't be surprised if they still traded Vucevic.

[tyven]

lol there is no way that dude is 26

[Jem]

They have those wrist tests they can do now, they use it in all age restricted soccer tournaments now to catch overaged players (and they have caught a fucking ton). I kind of feel that at this level, that shit should be mandatory.

I mean the other red flag against Ibaka's age is that child that he had but didn't know about. He would had to have her at like 15. Obviously possible but just makes his age more questionable.