The Failing News Media (Fox News bukkake hour)

[AidenCarby]

thx for the train tracks i guess

fucking crying

[Salodin]

I might be off base on this but someone tried to explain to me once that racism is defined as a deep rooted systematic oppression of a group of people that is ingrained in the system. Other stuff considered "racist" is being bigoted or xenophobic. I have no idea how widespread that opinion is. This was also used as a reason as to why black people can be bigoted or hateful towards white people but it isn't racism. (There is no such thing as reverse racism in this model.)

Oh hey thanks for this. You also answered Day for him.

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[Day]

I clearly know all about this new definition of racism, I referenced it several times.

[dasva]

We call them xenophobic, not racist. No, I don't know why we differentiate.

It's largely differentiated because of how homogeneous they are it really is more about fear of outsiders than a specific race it's just pretty obvious anyone that don't look like them is probably an outsider. Doesn't make it better but makes it a bit more understandable than the guy who hates people and thinks obviously wrong things that are a part of his culture and should've known growing up

[dasva]

I clearly know all about this new definition of racism, I referenced it several times.

Is it really a new definition yet or just the way some people are trying to use it?

I know I'm splitting hairs here as meanings of words are based on usage but at what point does it go from people just misusing the word or in this case actively trying to change how it is used to being a real new definition.

And for that matter at what point does it go beyond just becoming a definition and actually replace the old? I'm no linguist but from what I have studied of how words changed reading the OED for fun generally speaking new definitions are added to the word they don't replace it. At least immediately eventually way the fuck down the line some definitions fall out of usage and can occasionally stop being an official definition but that's like hundreds of years. Even if we accept this new "definition" as being a real one that doesn't invalidate the old one

[Day]

To me it's weird to go back and include the consequences of the word to be some kind of requirement for the word to then be applied and/or matter. I don't know what's wrong with the standard textbook definition and being against that.

I find most people using this "new definition" are doing it to justify their own or their allies ignorant bigotry more often than not.

[Salodin]

Or maybe you misunderstood the word from the beginning? You only recently got woke son, maybe you didn't understand this like you didn't understand the world until now.

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[Day]

What are you on about

[Salodin]

I'm saying you keep using the word, but I don't think it means what you think it means.

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[dasva]

That might make sense if he wasn't using a very real definition that is easily findable in every dictionary every made. Whether you think there is another definition is a totally different matter

[NynJa]

Dictionaries are wrong, language is what we make it to be.

[Salodin]

Well just like how racism has evolved over the decades to manifest in different ways, then maybe how we define racism should change with the definitions as well. Unless the definition of the word is immutable, even as those crackers have found many clever ways to not be overtly racist.

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[Darus Grey]

Dictionaries are wrong, language is what we make it to be.

Dictionaries are just a description of language at a point in time from a certain perspective. It's not "wrong" it's just not always accurate because they change slowly to reflect reality at a point in time in the past, not in the present. If you want a dictionary that focuses specifically on the present, Urban Dictionary is a legit resource for this need, it reflects word usage as it changes in a very real way, with the risk that some usages that emerge don't end up taking hold and "die off" before they reach the lexicographers making the traditional dictionaries.


That said, on the topic of the additional usage of racism, from my perspective it actually seems like a deliberate poisoning of the well. The traditional usage of the word racism carries very strong connotations in our society, it is very bad to be a racist as seen by polite society(whether we privately believe otherwise, it's bad to publicly be a racist).

This usage(racism = power + prejudice) seems to piggy back on the first primary definition, and purposefully be used in a way in which you can apply the much broader second form, but get the "results" of the first form; because it allows you to innotate that someone with power is "mostly" or "1/2" racist, and because racism(under the 1st definition) is a very bad thing, you conflate the two to extend it to simply "people with power are inherently racist(because we all have prejudices at birth), aka original sin.

If we take it at face value, an accusation of racism(2nd) is simply an accusation of possessing power, which is not inherently racist(1st), but 2nd is rarely used in a way that does not conflate it with 1st; which seems by design.

Not that appeals to authority matter much, but as a degreed linguist I see the 2nd definition as a constructed weaponized form of the word, rather than a useful semantically productive word, at least until such a day as the general public understands both definitions, understands that they're different, and understands that 2nd does not imply 1st.

[Anoat]

I'm of the thought that anyone with a southern accent can't possibly have a brain in their head. luckily that doesn't matter since I cannot meaningfully impact their life in any way shape or form. Sort of like a black person saying "fuck white people" on the internet. There really is nothing funnier than white people getting bent out of shape about "reverse racism"

I wish I could be southern mad at you but I feel the same whenever I hear a strong Queens/Staten Island accent and I realize that makes me a hypocrite, so thanks for showing me the man in the mirror.

[dasva]

Language does indeed change and evolve. And maybe this word should and either way it might very well do so. But what something is and what something should be (or at least what you think it should be) are wholly different conversations and should not be conflated as they are being done. However I don't really see it making a full replacement since then what would you call race based prejudice minus power? And well who determines said power?

[Zealot]

White privilege is getting to argue over what is and is not racism by definition.

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[Salodin]

White privilege is getting to argue over what is and is not racism by definition.

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thank you!

[NynJa]

And yet the entire argument is "can you be racist to white people". Such priviledge.

[Day]

White privilege is getting to argue over what is and is not racism by definition.

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PoC aren't allowed to have this conversation? Just spewing buzzwords dude, doesn't even make sense.

[Gadritan]

What in the actual fuck is happening in this thread? Make a new one to spam this shit. Back to the topic?

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