Time for FFXI "Classic"?

[Rhyis.]

The few players who were exceptions to norms meant nothing for the overall game. How many RDMs were really soloing something like Seiryu or Byakko? Were things like Fenrir, Faust, Steam Cleaner, Scitalis, or even Charybdis really all that special or difficult?
Today, I can stomp Golden Kist easily on BLU, but most players wanting to fight it seemingly can't even mount a successfully party attempt at what is roughly the modern equivalent of T1/2 Zeni NMs. Players overall are not measurably more or less competent today than they were when RDM was soloing the lesser important half of endgame content.

Running around a pillar with Bio III and Poison II for hours or waiting for Genbu to die is not a special solo. Nor would running circles around a slow Lil' Apkallu with Quick Draw for 20+ minutes be. A large portion of solos were based off of just kiting and pinning, and that is no longer so much the case for soloing now.

My point wasn't to flex, because who gives a fuck 15 years later lol, but to shut Greds next e-peen novel down before it even started.

The second half of your sentence disagrees with the first.

They are clearly different statements.

Exclusivity from said activities is quite clearly my point to start with. So if you want to bring up exclusivity as your point, thanks for backing my point while trying to detract from it at the same time I guess?

Debuffs were great in parties but were largely resisted or barely proc'd on anything even with BiS gear.

Negative.

Let's also not forget that there was really only one healer in FFXI: WHM

Also Negative.

[Spicyryan]

My point wasn't to flex, because who gives a fuck 15 years later lol, but to shut Greds next e-peen novel down before it even started.

I didn't see it as any earnest flexing, and was just chiming in on the topic. You know, about those "good old days" and such.

Gred is too busy with his next table top game to finish every novel that comes into his head.

[D44kpunk]

the return of spicyryan to the thread, you were sorely missed

[SephYuyX]

Ah man, I miss these XI BG discussions.

[Draylo]

It's too bad BG is dead for XI. Too many people were hating on XI when XIV relaunched and it caused a push to other XI platforms. That and the convenience of XIAH made it easier to post there.

[D44kpunk]

True, poor ffxi players

[Spicyryan]

the return of spicyryan to the thread, you were sorely missed

Comical, coming from the one banned for a week over the thread, and not the other way around.

It's too bad BG is dead for XI. Too many people were hating on XI when XIV relaunched and it caused a push to other XI platforms. That and the convenience of XIAH made it easier to post there.

AH.com has a drastically better UI and the site is more useful overall. BG forums could never hold on to their market share in the face of that site. Same story with Zam, KI, etc. The only real thing that keeps the BG forums going are all the oldies still hanging around it, and perhaps the wiki. Dopes drooling over XIV probably didn't matter much in the scheme of things.

[Isiolia]

It's too bad BG is dead for XI. Too many people were hating on XI when XIV relaunched and it caused a push to other XI platforms. That and the convenience of XIAH made it easier to post there.

To be fair, from what I've seen, forum use in general is down, except for maybe Reddit. Not just for FFXI related stuff either, as I've seen similar trends on other gaming sites. Even FFXIAH is a lot slower than it once was. It's more common for basic questions or random discussion to happen on Discord now, for instance. Or for folks to put together a video guide than some massive forum post.

[Kalmado]

To be fair, from what I've seen, forum use in general is down, except for maybe Reddit. Not just for FFXI related stuff either, as I've seen similar trends on other gaming sites. Even FFXIAH is a lot slower than it once was. It's more common for basic questions or random discussion to happen on Discord now, for instance. Or for folks to put together a video guide than some massive forum post.

Ashita's forum isn't used anymore and instead Discord is favored. At first I was annoyed, but then again I am not a heavy discord user. I found out quickly that if you had a question it was quick to get answered thru their discord.

[Kalmado]

double.

[Draylo]

The old granpas favoring forums over discord. Isnt it just odd to join random peoples discords? They even announce you, feels like a weird chat room. Whats happening these days!

[Dotsudoku]

won't someone please think of the grandpas

[arus2001]

ngl, prefer forums to discord for more lengthy convos and info. Reddit was always ass.

[Gredival]

I'm just gonna help all yall out and tell you that ffxi was flawed from the get go 'cause of the magic system. This very simple flaw fucked the whole game up.

Because thunder was flat out more powerful than every other element in the game, regardless of elemental weaknesses, it made it so the light skillchain was the only relevant skillchain to perform, and because of that only a couple of weaponskills were actually useful, and because of that only those specific job classes that could use those very specific weaponskills were actually useful. The magic system dictated each melee classes relevancy before you even got to job abilities.

If each element had the same base strength you would have seen different melee classes having more relevancy to each fight based on what each specific monster had a weakness to. One group of melee would more powerful against monster x, but another group of melee would be more powerful against monster z. That is how the game should have been designed, and it's such a simple change.

people enjoyed the endgame though. nobody enjoyed not being able to play melee class x to an endgame activity because you're flat out useless

More often then not dinky melee weapons were brought to the dragon fights in ffxi. That's not even what I was talking about. My point was to illustrate how only specific dinky melee weapons were chosen to go to endgame events because of how the magic system was designed around only a select few skillchains and magic bursts. If earth would do 10 damage to a neutral monster, thunder would do 60 damage to a neutral monster. That's just how the game was designed.

Aspid and KB both resisted Thunder...

Take notice how all of the damage dealing jobs listed here were only jobs that could perform the light skillchain. If earth, water, fire, wind, ice, and thunder all did equal damage polearm/hand-to-hand/dagger to great axe/scythe skillchains would absolutely have become a thing against specific monsters while light skillchains would have continued to be a thing against the other monsters. All of which would have made more dinky melee weapons relevant by doing the simple task of stabilizing elemental damage across the board just like how every other RPG goes about magic damage in video games.

And this is the problem with every game where disproportionate amount of people want to be physical DPS vs. the slots that are optimally allocated to physical DPS. At least XI let you multi-class vs. say WoW where if guilds didn't need your class you were stuck. Everyone could level WHM or BRD and gear up to join an HNMLS.

If you include the quested WS, only GAxe and Scythe were locked to Dark (and DRK had access to GS which was on Light).

Dagger: Shark Bite Light and Evisceration Dark (also opens Frag)
H2H: Dragon Kick Light and Asuran Fists Dark (also opens Frag)
lolDRG: Wheeling Thrust Light and Impulse Drive Dark (also opens Frag)

[Gredival]

Gred is too busy with his next table top game to finish every novel that comes into his head.

Is it that controversial that classes whose powers are predicated on bending the bounds of reality probably should do more damage than a moron swinging a sword?

[NynJa]

Aspid and KB both resisted Thunder...

Neither of which were melee friendly

[Gredival]

Neither of which were melee friendly

Most of End Game in general was not meele friendly. Meeles feed TP and have higher heal upkeep.

[Spicyryan]

Is it that controversial that classes whose powers are predicated on bending the bounds of reality probably should do more damage than a moron swinging a sword?

Is this really the FFXI section of the forums? Asking for a friend.

[NynJa]

Most of End Game in general was not meele friendly. Meeles feed TP and have higher heal upkeep.

I mean no one was meleeing Aspid or KB.
Why have a melee in the pt for Aspid whos gonna do single digit damage when you can have a blm spam ice? Why have a melee auto-follow KB just to WS and lose their TP due to out of range? Youre not doin skillchains on KB.

[urat]

They dont even have the resources to merge servers together or properly fix jobs.

FFXI is only running because chances are, the cost to tear it down and dispose of it is actually more expensive than just letting it run and do its thing and make a tiny bit of extra cash flow.

This game is running on a skeleton crew that is scraping by with very bare bones, mostly weakly informed job balances and minor bug fixes.

There would be a HUGE price tag attached to setting up a classic server.

Also.

Ya'll are assuming SE has kept around source code to their like, 10~13 year old version of FFXI.

Lets be real.

That code/data just doesnt exist anymore. Its gone. FFXI Classic just doesnt exist at SE, I very very strongly doubt that stuff is kept around anywhere.

Most likely got cleaned out and deleted years ago.

And lets be real here.

There's a strong chance even if they had the money and resources to remake FFXI classic then...

There's a very strong chance they wouldn't have the actual info needed to properly duplicate it, and it'd be a fuzzy attempt at recreating FFXI Classic, which means a lot of stuff might not quite be the same.

They have changed numbers and formulas and mins and maxes and caps and numbers and timers and cooldowns and abilities and spell lists dozens of times over the year.

Do you really think they actually fully documented all that stuff?

Doubt it. Im gonna guess a solid 50% minimum of that info is dust in the wind and no one knows exactly how pdif, crit rate, healing, etc etc etc, was actually calculated 10 years ago.

So the other option then is we get a psuedo FFXI classic.

Its just CoP/RoZ era content.

But with all the 2020 modern niceties and job balance changes, with levels capped to 75.

If thats what you want, just join a 75 cap LS, cause its going to be the exact same results.

Only difference is several high demand HNMs are popped instead of time spawned, thats the big difference I can think of.

I guess you also get the exp bonuses and stuff from KIs, and the supply/demand of items on the AH is vastly different from what they would be on a truly 75 capped server.

Are those handful of differences enough for people that just playing current FFXI in a 75 cap ls is not good enough, and SE dumping thousands and thousands of dollars into a 75 capped glass box for your to go play in is necessary?

I doubt SE thinks its worth it.