Putin in Russia (II): Spicy Island Liberation Front

[carlweathers]

I get being critical of US capitalist hegemony....but that doesn't mean you need to support a capitalist imperialist power, especially one who uses a mercenary force and created by a Neonazi and literally named after a Nazi.

but thats just me.

[Demosthenes]

It is always important to be critical of western states, for example, the US. It's equally important to refrain from whataboutism, or blaming other nation states for a specific one starting a war, and or commiting war crimes.

[Spicyryan]

It is always important to be critical of western states, for example, the US. It's equally important to refrain from whataboutism, or blaming other nation states for a specific one starting a war, and or commiting war crimes.

The posts are all over the place, but I think yours is one of the better ones so I will just respond to it.

First, everyone here isn't even operating in the same reality. Not just with the fact that no one here has condoned Russia. There is an issue with the US supporting far right elements in the country or simply that they have a problem with neo-Nazi groups or a troubled past of Nazi collaboration. That doesn't mean they should be invaded by a state that doesn't particularly care about fighting fascism. For fucks sake I can't even post and make such a basic point of conversation without everyone losing their shit.

Further, just about no one here is critical of the West. No one here seems to accept when I correctly ascribe Israel as an apartheid state. Seemingly couldn't care less as well about the embargo of Cuba that every country except the US and Israel vote to continue. Don't dare mention that China through self-determination took back it's country and the US intervened to create the ongoing conflict over Taiwan. As they turn it into some stupid narrative to discredit it ever being their territory because absolutely everything is to discredit China or say "BUT AT WHAT COST?!". Shit, iirc awhile back even the dropping of the atomic bomb wasn't a needless war crime for chunk of you. No, the most critical you guys will be of the West is along the lines or "Well, I didn't support the Iraq war!" Or even better, "Muh tax dollars to the Ukraines!"

The baseline propaganda that forms the narrative of what people react to makes it a shit fest to even touch. Like any mention of China is this PTSD flashback of a guy with groceries not being run over by a tank that keeps trying to drive around them instead. Like it is nightmarish brutality of the state or something cuz that is what happens if you aren't some enlightened centrist. Enlightened centrists would never have things get out of control like that!

[Zealot]

Israel is an apartheid state, almost everyone here agrees with that as far as I'm aware.

Lol "took back its country through self-determination," ok there comrade, finger Xi's butthole a little more so long as he's stuck in Rabbit's doorway.

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[Demosthenes]

The posts are all over the place, but I think yours is one of the better ones so I will just respond to it.

First, everyone here isn't even operating in the same reality. Not just with the fact that no one here has condoned Russia. There is an issue with the US supporting far right elements in the country or simply that they have a problem with neo-Nazi groups or a troubled past of Nazi collaboration. That doesn't mean they should be invaded by a state that doesn't particularly care about fighting fascism. For fucks sake I can't even post and make such a basic point of conversation without everyone losing their shit.

Further, just about no one here is critical of the West. No one here seems to accept when I correctly ascribe Israel as an apartheid state. Seemingly couldn't care less as well about the embargo of Cuba that every country except the US and Israel vote to continue. Don't dare mention that China through self-determination took back it's country and the US intervened to create the ongoing conflict over Taiwan. As they turn it into some stupid narrative to discredit it ever being their territory because absolutely everything is to discredit China or say "BUT AT WHAT COST?!". Shit, iirc awhile back even the dropping of the atomic bomb wasn't a needless war crime for chunk of you. No, the most critical you guys will be of the West is along the lines or "Well, I didn't support the Iraq war!" Or even better, "Muh tax dollars to the Ukraines!"

The baseline propaganda that forms the narrative of what people react to makes it a shit fest to even touch. Like any mention of China is this PTSD flashback of a guy with groceries not being run over by a tank that keeps trying to drive around them instead. Like it is nightmarish brutality of the state or something cuz that is what happens if you aren't some enlightened centrist. Enlightened centrists would never have things get out of control like that!

I won't read it, because I realized (for the most part) that I don't respect your opinions. I also firmly believe it is a waste of my time to give you competent attention.

[Demosthenes]

Israel is an apartheid state, almost everyone here agrees with that as far as I'm aware.

Lol "took back its country through self-determination," ok there comrade, finger Xi's butthole a little more so long as he's stuck in Rabbit's doorway.

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Israel is definitely an apartheid state, and there's also no shortage of atrocities committed by the state.

[NynJa]

This guy actually wrote a four paragraph Gredival type post expecting us to read it lol

[Andalusian girls]

gredival is taking everything i worked for

[NynJa]

Abyssea wasnt the downfall of FFXI.

[Byrthnoth]

Also, Kings were bad game design.

[Tymon]

I like the subtle last minute inclusion of the atomic bombing just to see if anyone will jump in on that one.

[Spicyryan]

This guy actually wrote a four paragraph Gredival type post expecting us to read it lol

Still somehow better than anything you write. So I can live with that.

I like the subtle last minute inclusion of the atomic bombing just to see if anyone will jump in on that one.

It's come up before is why. It's not like I care to get into it. Especially not in this thread.

[Spicyryan]

That "complicated" history of Nazi collaboration.
https://www.politico.com/news/2023/0...visit-00117857

Yaroslav Hunka stood and appeared to salute from the public gallery when he was recognized by House Speaker Anthony Rota, who introduced Hunka as a Canadian-Ukrainian war hero from his political district.

“We have here in the chamber today a Ukrainian-Canadian veteran from the Second World War who fought for Ukrainian independence against the Russians and continues to support the troops today, even at his age of 98,” Rota said Friday, followed by a lengthy round of applause and a wave by Zelenskyy. “He’s a Ukrainian hero, a Canadian hero, and we thank him for all his service. Thank you.”

Jewish advocacy groups the Friends of Simon Wiesenthal Center and B’nai Brith Canada condemned his honoring as disturbing and “beyond outrageous” because he fought with the First Ukrainian Division — also known as the 14th Waffen Grenadier Division, which served under command of the Nazis

[Koyangi]

One mans tyranny is another mans salvation.

[Spicyryan]

One mans tyranny is another mans salvation.

Yes, the right choice was to fight for Nazi control of Ukraine cuz Stalin bad. What a hero. Imagine if Operation Ukrainey Freedom was a success and they liberated 'em! Could have avoided the whole Cold War!

[NynJa]

I saw that yesterday, but all the talking points were from right wing nutjobs and I couldnt find a more neutral source validating that persons history with the Nazis.

[archibaldcrane]

I have a hard time getting worked up about somebody who lived through the Holodomor (the Soviet-caused famine that starved 3.5-5 million Ukrainians to death in the 1930s) fighting against the Soviets even if they joined literal Nazis to do it.

But also Ukrainian Nazis skipped right past the camps and just murdered in the fields every Jew they came across starting in '41.

So yeah, not good options at hand

[NynJa]

I'm not gonna fault the guy for picking self-preservation above anything else. But hailing the guy as a hero and giving him a huge standing ovation is a fucking terrible look.

[Spicyryan]

I'm not gonna fault the guy for picking self-preservation above anything else. But hailing the guy as a hero and giving him a huge standing ovation is a fucking terrible look.

So is Nazi-apologia, and that didn't stop old Archi there.

Calling it self-preservation is really just dishonest at best. The deliberate rewriting of history post-war.

[archibaldcrane]

Calling it self-preservation is really just dishonest at best. The deliberate rewriting of history post-war.

I didn't say it was "self preservation", I said the Soviets were brutally evil to the Ukrainians and I have a hard time faulting any Ukrainian at that time who would join an army to oppose them.

If this guy was doing Jew murders that's it's own issue.

(and yes it's an odd choice to celebrate any Ukrainian former Nazi in 2023)