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  1. #1
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    PLD and NIN (this is going to get ugly, but anyway...)

    I've been leveling ninja recently (46), and it's horrifying how powerful ninja is. I enjoy the job a lot so far, and intend to hit 75 over the summer, but there's just one thing that bothers me...

    Ninja in full arhat's+1, jelly ring, earth staff, etc. has -40% physical damage. I've been watching a NIN in our LS and he takes the damn near same damage as me, something I've heard that is true with full arhat's but I didn't really wanna believe it. At times the ninja seemed to take even less than me, the only thing different was that I had more HP and MP to keep myself alive. But...the ninja has utsu: ni and ichi and haste+15 or 20%...so it makes me wonder, should I have all that gear (arhat's+1), would that render my PLD useless in some situations?

    I was thinking that maybe during Fafnir I might be using PLD, or during a King Behemoth chance since all that matters for KB is hate, but Ninja can easily tank Fafnir/Nidhogg. But I think the issue is that it might be better to have 2 PLDs bouncing Fafnir/Nidhogg, since it's easier to bounce hate with 2 PLDs than it is to bounce hate with 1 PLD and 1 NIN. But NIN's pretty potent at holding hate too apparently, and they get more enmity than us and all that ninjitsu, so maybe they could even outpull us on hate if we didn't have any job abilities up...I dunno, I guess I'm just worried that my first job I've ever leveled and done so many things with won't be as useful anymore.

    Just want to have a more broader input as to where people would rather have a PLD at something.

    And yes, I do realize that my ninja is far off from HNM tanking, but I grinded PLD really hard to 75 and I'm pretty sure I could get ninja far in the summer, especially with the rate of invites I seem to be snatching and the gil I have on-hand already.

  2. #2
    Physicist
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    We use PLD for Faf/Nid tanking. I'm not sure if NIN has the HP to tank one of these. I would think being terrorized would suck as a Ninja, but maybe you'd still survive. I've never seen a NIN tank one, although I've seen JP's use WAR/WHM with SMN's using shadows on them.

    Also some things like Byakko are very tough to use Ninja for, but it's possible. Unfortunately it's kind of a joke in our LS that PLD's are useless because Ninja is better in almost every way except for those few scenarios. We hold "pity XP" parties for the WHM's and PLD's that delevel from dragons, etc but obviously NIN is better for xp/meriting endgame.

  3. #3
    Black Belt
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    as a tarutaru nin, i have over 1500 HP :3

  4. #4
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    We use PLD for Faf/Nid tanking. I'm not sure if NIN has the HP to tank one of these. I would think being terrorized would suck as a Ninja, but maybe you'd still survive. I've never seen a NIN tank one, although I've seen JP's use WAR/WHM with SMN's using shadows on them.
    But keep in mind with all that -% gear that they take identical damage to Paladin, so it wouldn't make much difference. The same as PLD not being able to flash or Cure IV. Kinda...sorta...

    btw we use PLD too for this, but we know the ninja I'm refering to can tank Fafnir/Nidhogg, but she usually goes to the camps as RDM for ES + Sleep II.

    Yeah I know ninja can have insane HP, I'm just saying we have a little step up on it.

  5. #5
    Black Belt
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    either will work, it just depends on how your LS strategises around the jobs that are available.

    people are going to like the jobs they like and they will play the jobs they want to play.

  6. #6
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    NIN and PLD can both work perfect.

    I never was impressed with NIN cause they could never keep up in hate with me, that was until Twolves joined our LS. He's by far the most talented NIN I've ever seen.

    If properly equipped and most importantly, properly skilled - PLD and NIN can both be equally as great.

  7. #7

    Quote Originally Posted by Zigma
    as a tarutaru nin, i have over 1500 HP :3
    holy ballz how? I'm hume and just push 1200.

    I did hold Byakko for awhile with Arhats+1 Body, Arhat headgear, Terra staff, jelly ring + taco, think he hit me for 150's.

  8. #8
    Yoshi P
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    Genbu Bucket is part of it. ;3

  9. #9

    Quote Originally Posted by Raineer
    Also some things like Byakko are very tough to use Ninja for, but it's possible.
    We've always found double march/Haste on a couple WAR/NINs or NIN/WARs to be less hassle and easier overall than using two PLDs and rotating Aerial/Earthen for Byakko. Your mileage may vary I guess but I've tanked Byakko tons as WAR/NIN and I think he's the second easiest god after Genbu. None of them are particularly hard but Seiryu/Suzaku at least make you pay attention with their 2 hrs.

    Any of the three tanks are fine endgame, and on some stuff MNK is as good as/better than any, it's more dependent on your gear, skill, and support than what job you are. The game is not as rigid as some make it out to be. Iff you have an LS that will let you play whatever you like, any tank job works.

    The nice thing about NIN is in EXP at 75 it's one of the top DDs with god set/shura pieces/dual wield 87 or whatever they get, and a lot of options open up for boredom like running around seeing what you can solo/duo (everything).

  10. #10
    Sea Torques
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    blood bead ring+bq ring + pigeon+1earring + cassie earring + gigant mantle aswell D;

  11. #11
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    JP LSes tank faf/nidhogg with just 2 NINs sometimes spamming hojo and jubaku...the same thing stayed paralyzed the whole fight. Easily taken. I'd have to agree that NIN is good at tanking almost everything towards end game, it just depends upon the jobs that are abundant in the LS and the strategies they use...

    For the 3 wyrms though....leave it to a PLD :wink:

  12. #12
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    I don't doubt that NIN's and /NIN's can work on Byakko, I guess it's just lack of experience with it on my part. Our LS has the best NA Ninja on the server, but unfortunately he's our only Ninja that is on usually. He's also the best NA PLD on the server (only one with M.Bd also), so I've never gotten to see good dual NIN's in action on something like Byakko.

    All in all, I would prefer self-blinkers to PLD's, and letting Summoners spam away with BP70's instead of Aerial Armors. The post above is correct though, it's all about your LS setups. The variety in Dynamis and Kirin strats easily displays that.

  13. #13
    Relic Shield
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    For the 3 wyrms though....leave it to a PLD
    I bet a NIN with full Arhats+1 and all - DMG gear(for when flying) could easily out tank a PLD/NIN.

  14. #14
    Sea Torques
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amarao
    For the 3 wyrms though....leave it to a PLD :wink:
    Dunno about that heh, we used nin's before and they do a really good job.

  15. #15
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    I think Twolves solo tanks Tiamat from 100% to like 1% (ninja).

    btw about the aerial armor thing, usually when this is used the summoners themselves do not use it, everyone in the pld party is subbing summoner and just spams it.

    Example:
    brd/smn
    whm/smn
    rdm/smn

    blah blah blah

  16. #16
    Sea Torques
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    a NIN cant solo tank a mob with 28450830593053 ACC, double attacks...and does terrorize.

  17. #17

    Mcbee, NIN on Bismarck, has solo tanked Fafnir and Nidhogg. We've used 2x NIN and 2x WAR on everything to equal effect, we honestly prefer 2x blinkers over 2x PLD because it's just less support needed. You just dump all the haste you can on NIN or WAR and they support themselves. Intelligent stuns here and there and it's gravy. This is just our experience, some LSes like PLDs more, some blinkers more, neither is wrong. I've solo tanked Charybdis and Byakko on WAR, I wouldn't always recommend it as any tank can get unrucky but it's doable. I'm not making any points here except any tank works, we've tanked Suzaku and Charybdis with MNK for fun, we use MNK as main Dynamis tank (insofar as there is a tank at all), I think a long time ago Lunarians let Fira tank gods with SATA for hate on THF for fun? Lots of stuff works.

    People who say one is better than another are just going off their own experience, obviously many LSes have succeeded with many different setups. The only commentary I have is 2x the same tank works best because you want the hate to flip easily. 1x PLD and 1x NIN can be sorta iffy if the PLD isn't kind of holding back or the NIN isn't crazy good, for example. When Fafhogg does Hurricane Wing and then criticals you want him to turn to the other tank. :3 2x PLD or 2x WAR or 2x NIN with similar setups and tons of stuff just gets really easy, sure any hard mob in the game can dish out 1k+ damage nearly instantly but then they just turn to the other tank, first guy eats a Cure V or two, and you're golden.

  18. #18

    a good NIN makes PLD obsolete IMO. problem is theres only maybe 2 GOOD nins on every server

  19. #19

    Quote Originally Posted by Bikwin
    a NIN cant solo tank a mob with 28450830593053 ACC, double attacks...and does terrorize.
    ever hear of tiamat =o

  20. #20
    Sea Torques
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luminaire
    Mcbee, NIN on Bismarck, has solo tanked Fafnir and Nidhogg....
    ahhhh Mcbee and Isshin, 2 of the best blinkers on bismarck, too bad Isshin sold his acct ;/...I'd put Kasai up there too :D...these 3 can tank anything =-= lol...too bad cronos broke up ;/ Best LS on bismarck imo~ kill anything HQ in like 10 mins cause they have a bajillion rangers ;/ lol

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