Quick question. MNK- Shura Togi/Osode

[Taku]

What exactly makes you think that the Togi is better. I'm going to exclude the sushi eating Mnk from my evaluation just because.

Why? ;_;

The dmg from togi is .1 dmg better per hit, and that leads you to believe it's better?

How about the roughly 6 damager per crit that is higher with osode, or the higher % acc with Osode, or the higher crit % with osode, or the higher counter dmg with Osode, or the higher counter % with Osode, or the higher Asuran dmg with Osode?

The average damage in the first box is including both crit and non crit all averaged together.... Asuran is tricky, because he might have had incomplete asurans when killing a mob that would throw off the average. Notice the Sushi MNK had higher Asurans with Togi than with Osode. Likewise, the counter rate and damage is per counter is hard to test because it was based out of only about 200 hits taken. The main thing the parse tests was the damage per hit and accuracy, which is out of around 1000 punches per MNK. Accuracy is also harder to test with the length blind is left on etc. Looking at both mnks together, Togi seems *slightly* better to me, but they're really about the same.

The higher average damage taken i can only conclude is the result from tanking the majority of the fight since the other mnk gimped himself with food and couldn't keep up. But do notice that his dmg taken was reduced significantly from the togi to the Osode.

No, to be honest, the sushi mnk did about 500 more total damage(out of like 200k each total). Obviously, this isn't a very good indication which food is better because they're different players, but one thing for sure is he wasn't gimping the PT. Also, that shouldn't change the average damage taken by taking more hits than the other mnk.

In reality, i dissagree with this parse as much as i do with aurik's on the o.kote and alky's (no i don't care to re-hash that so stick it). You were in KRT, you did not control for the variable that you were testing for therefore it is not a true experiment. As you yourself said you can't account for the randomness. But, with your numbers, the Osode beats out the shit out of the Togi fairly clearly in all area's except that... tenth of a dmg per hit that apparently means more to you than the other data you collected.

Sorry, I don't understand this, can you explain a bit more? For my conclusion, I was looking at both mnks. Also, realize that the damage per hit has the most damage collected(1000 swings vs. 100 asurans), and therefore can be assumed to have the lowest error margin.

Even the gimp food mnks numbers improved overall with the Osode.

He had lower damage per hit(which includes the average of crit's and non crit's), Accuracy and WS... I don't think it resulted better.

Edit: On a side note, i did a 2 brd, 2 mnk, rdm whm Mnk pt the other night and i am in <3. Minuet x 2 and march x2 on two mnks totally beats the shit out of a 3 mnk KRT pt. Even un-banished ghosts didn't stop chains.

Never tried the dual BRD in KRT, but I had a dual BRD PT in U.range, and it was awesome... if only for the thrill of swinging so fast.

[NynJa]

LAWL @ STR WHORES

I use osode only because I'd rather spend the 15 mil that would go towards a Shura Togi on currency for my relic weapon.

[ps2user]

LAWL @ STR WHORES

LAWL@ Blind people who dont read post.

I use osode only because I'd rather spend the 15 mil that would go towards a Shura Togi on currency for my relic weapon.

same thing, i use osode only because id rather spend the 15mil on something that is truely useful for me.

[NynJa]

LAWL @ STR WHORES

LAWL@ Blind people who dont read post.

I use osode only because I'd rather spend the 15 mil that would go towards a Shura Togi on currency for my relic weapon.

same thing, i use osode only because id rather spend the 15mil on something that is truely useful for me.

ok there ps2user


Thats why I see people boasting their "STR80+70, I GOT MAX STR MERITS, IM THE SHIT" running around with 500 attack after popping red curry and getting double minuet.

[aurik]

Sell your osode for 40m and buy a togi and put the extra 25m towards your spider's knife

[NynJa]

Sell your osode for 40m and buy a togi and put the extra 25m towards your spider's knife

its not "my" osode, property of LS.

[aurik]

Ah ok so you have neither, but you can borrow osode from your LS.

[ps2user]

Sell your osode for 40m and buy a togi and put the extra 25m towards your spider's knife

togi is only a merit gear, while osode is like an all in one gear.

[aurik]

There's really 5 main functions mnk does:

solo/tank -- SH+1 > osode > togi
merit -- togi/osode (unclear) > SH+1
DD alliance -- togi > osode > SH+1 [this differs from merit; generally you don't have a brd and are subbing nin / using coeurl foods so your attack rating is low]
chi -- osode > anything > togi
SATA WS -- osode > togi > SH+1

Question is, which of these do you do most often?

As a nomadic crafter, I don't have access to a LS Osode to borrow; if I were to get either armor I would be paying full price for it, and thereafter it would be mine and only mine. I wouldn't be using the osode for chi or SATA WS at all. On the other hand, I play DD in alliance settings often, primarily limbus, though many monks DD in dynamis too, and I merit occasionally, and I solo/tank a lot.

Now it just so happens that the price of togi and SH+1 combined is a bit less than 1 osode. So which is best for me? Obviously, togi. I just have to get the abjuration.

[ps2user]

solo/tank, osode >SH+1.
higher def, +10VIT+10INT+10MND +10AGI> 7evasion

solo as a nin, i dont even use SH . osode offers more.


limbus/dynamis, Osode> togi

died from mijin gakure? no thanks
one shoted by EES? no thanks
raped by hunderd fists? no thanks


melee DD against HNM, togi = osode

only on uber hard shit, Togi > osode. but i dont see many LS use mnk melee on them anyway

BALLISTA osode >>>>>>> togi


what do you do most often endgme?

and aurik, you dont have osode, what you said doesnt count. sorry

[NynJa]

solo/tank, osode >SH+1.
higher def, +10VIT+10INT+10MND +10AGI> 7evasion

solo as a nin, i dont even use SH . osode offers more.

If you're soloing or tanking, you're subbing nin. In that case you are working on evasion, and evasion alone. 10 AGI wont do shit for evasion compared to what a SH does.

limbus/dynamis, Osode> togi

died from mijin gakure? no thanks
one shoted by EES? no thanks
raped by hunderd fists? no thanks

How the fuck is osode gonna save you from Mijin Gakure ?? INT/MND+10 isnt going to offset that much damage, but considering monks can get up to like 1900hp anyways, if you're fighting something with mijin, you should consider popping up HP gear (which SH has), or pop on Melee Cyclas for HP+5%, a lot more than Osode and SH offers.

EES ?? Same thing. EES is going to 1shot you whether you're wearing SH or Osode. 10 VIT and 8 DEF isnt going to offset EES dmg to the point where you'll survive. Allthough, with SH, you are more likely to luck out and evade it.

Hundred Fists...wow lol. I'm curious how Osode is going to save you from Hundred Fists.

BALLISTA osode >>>>>>> togi

Ballista is for faggots.

[aurik]

solo/tank, osode >SH+1.
higher def, +10VIT+10INT+10MND +10AGI> 7evasion

solo as a nin, i dont even use SH . osode offers more.


limbus/dynamis, Osode> togi

died from mijin gakure? no thanks
one shoted by EES? no thanks
raped by hunderd fists? no thanks


melee DD against HNM, togi = osode

only on uber hard shit, Togi > osode. but i dont see many LS use mnk melee on them anyway

BALLISTA osode >>>>>>> togi


what do you do most often endgme?

and aurik, you dont have osode, what you said doesnt count. sorry

I had an osode for a while. I didn't like it for the purposes I used it. So I got rid of it. I suppose I could borrow it off friends if there was any dire need for it.

Soloing as a mnk, SH+1 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> osode. Period. No question. You solo as a ninja, that's completely different: you have stun katanas if you need them, you have an extra shadow, you have higher natural evasion, you have 3 enfeeble jutsu to employ.

As a monk, higher defense is completely useless because of counterstance. The vit is nearly useless, because typically it won't change the number of hits required to drop you. 5 hp here or there doesn't make a damn bit of difference. The mnd is completely useless because you will never ever resist anything. The agi is mostly useless, since it only affects guard activation, and guard is pretty much useless.

The small benefits you do get from osode when soloing pales in comparison to 7 desperately needed eva, and harness+1 comes with 7 extra acc that allows you to forego acc gear in other slots.

As for DD alliance, the -50hp on togi is completely irrelevant. Wearing shura stuff I would have ~1500 hp, that is plenty.

[ps2user]

solo/tank, osode >SH+1.
higher def, +10VIT+10INT+10MND +10AGI> 7evasion

solo as a nin, i dont even use SH . osode offers more.

If you're soloing or tanking, you're subbing nin. In that case you are working on evasion, and evasion alone. 10 AGI wont do shit for evasion compared to what a SH does.

solo with /nin doesnt mean you never get hit.

limbus/dynamis, Osode> togi

died from mijin gakure? no thanks
one shoted by EES? no thanks
raped by hunderd fists? no thanks

How the fuck is osode gonna save you from Mijin Gakure ?? INT/MND+10 isnt going to offset that much damage, but considering monks can get up to like 1900hp anyways, if you're fighting something with mijin, you should consider popping up HP gear (which SH has), or pop on Melee Cyclas for HP+5%, a lot more than Osode and SH offers.

EES ?? Same thing. EES is going to 1shot you whether you're wearing SH or Osode. 10 VIT and 8 DEF isnt going to offset EES dmg to the point where you'll survive. Allthough, with SH, you are more likely to luck out and evade it.

Hundred Fists...wow lol. I'm curious how Osode is going to save you from Hundred Fists.

you dont have full hp all the time in dynamis. and mnk tend to eat EES most of the time, though EES cant one shot full hp mnk.

yea, the def,VIT,AGI, on osode wont save you from hunderd fist. but its still better than togi.
you dont even mention togi in this part, so point proved, osode > togi in dynamis.

BALLISTA osode >>>>>>> togi

Ballista is for faggots.

ballista is for skilled player, player vs player is the most fun in MMORPG.

[NynJa]

solo with /nin doesnt mean you never get hit.

You probably get hit because you play evasion tank in lolosode.

you dont have full hp all the time in dynamis. and mnk tend to eat EES most of the time, though EES cant one shot full hp mnk.

yea, the def,VIT,AGI, on osode wont save you from hunderd fist. but its still better than togi.
you dont even mention togi in this part, so point proved, osode > togi in dynamis.

You probably eat "EES all the time" because you save TP for rangers and go "HAY WATS GOING ON ASURAN TO YO FACE NIGGA" then eat EES with orange HP. You dont play smart, you deserve to die.
I didnt comment on togi to hundred fists because that was so fkn absurd for you to say.

ballista is for skilled player, player vs player is the most fun in MMORPG.

Oh yeah, skilled players...
right...

Thats why the ppl I know who do ballista all the time bitch about how people cheat all the time (fleetool / some hack that lets you 2hr over and over). SO SKIRRED !!!

[ps2user]

You probably get hit because you play evasion tank in lolosode.

lololol
why i cant play evasion tank in osode? if you cant dodge without 7 more evasion, you cant dodge with it, 7 evasion wont do jackshit if the system wants you to get hit.
never solo limbus? i always do it as nin with osode, and i normally dont get a single hit.

You probably eat "EES all the time" because you save TP for rangers and go "HAY WATS GOING ON ASURAN TO YO FACE NIGGA" then eat EES with orange HP. You dont play smart, you deserve to die.
I didnt comment on togi to hundred fists because that was so fkn absurd for you to say.

or you probably are just a sucky dumb shitty mnk who never pull hate by normal hit in dynamis.

Oh yeah, skilled players...
right...

Thats why the ppl I know who do ballista all the time bitch about how people cheat all the time (fleetool / some hack that lets you 2hr over and over). SO SKIRRED !!!

OMFG, why i never meet people using fleetool in ballista? or you just suck
at ballista? or you dont know when to throw your petras?

[genome]

I mentioned this before but since we're sort of repeating some of these points I will too :wink:

For my personal experience, osode gives a lot more than the evasion while soloing. CritTaken-, guard+,counter+ (you can see that even in taku's test), critChance+ (and therefore higher interrupts on things like -aga3 spells etc), are all lifesavers. Especially in between casting shadows, where I don't want to be interrupted (counter and guard+ help here too).

Now this might be because of my setup, I already have lots of evasion skill and evasion (boxer's mantle, ethereal earring, af1+ etc), and generally agi seems to help me more (e.g., seiryu AGI+15 vs mst.cst.mitts eva.skill+10).

The extra 7 evasion of SH+1 or the extra 3 of a 90k crow jupon don't really compare in my experience.

I also resist magic damage on occasions, the same spell can do quite a range of dmg on me (e.g., I solo the mammets 75 BC on a regular basis, and the same aga3 spells like stonega3 damage varies between 150 and 550, I assume because of resistance) :wink:

In limbus alliances etc I often end up tanking some/lots, so again I still rather have the rounded boosts of osode on, etc.

[NynJa]

OMFG, why i never meet people using fleetool in ballista? or you just suck
at ballista? or you dont know when to throw your petras?

I know how ballista works you retard. blm/whm cant exactly sprint up, then sprint off.



And I have a thief, I use that in dynamis, because my DLS cares more about getting drops than going "OMG WE CLEARED TEH AREA IN 10 MIN BUT WE GOT 3 SHELLS YAY".

[nivlakian]

You probably get hit because you play evasion tank in lolosode.

lololol
why i cant play evasion tank in osode? if you cant dodge without 7 more evasion, you cant dodge with it, 7 evasion wont do jackshit if the system wants you to get hit.
never solo limbus? i always do it as nin with osode, and i normally dont get a single hit.

Are you a NIN or both MNK and NIN? I can't really tell from your posts. A NIN using an Osode while solo'ing whatever is quite different from a MNK doing it.

[NynJa]

For my personal experience, osode gives a lot more than the evasion while soloing. CritTaken-, guard+,counter+ (you can see that even in taku's test), critChance+ (and therefore higher interrupts on things like -aga3 spells etc), are all lifesavers. Especially in between casting shadows, where I don't want to be interrupted (counter and guard+ help here too).

CritTaken is moot when you have utsu up
Guard is moot since you cant guard with utsu up
Counter is hardly moot, since counterstance makes you counter like 85% of attacks done to you. You do /nin solo with counterstance up, right ?

[genome]

For my personal experience, osode gives a lot more than the evasion while soloing. CritTaken-, guard+,counter+ (you can see that even in taku's test), critChance+ (and therefore higher interrupts on things like -aga3 spells etc), are all lifesavers. Especially in between casting shadows, where I don't want to be interrupted (counter and guard+ help here too).

CritTaken is moot when you have utsu up
Guard is moot since you cant guard with utsu up
Counter is hardly moot, since counterstance makes you counter like 85% of attacks done to you. You do /nin solo with counterstance up, right ?

It depends on mob, my HP, whether my focus is also up etc. Some mobs have moves that can't be countered and need defense.

Counter is the same as guard however, you can't counter with shadows or while evading. You evade first before the check for counter, and then if both fail you guard.

CritTaken is not moot even when utsu is up, some moves go through shadows, and in between shadows, especially if you have counterstance up, any crit- or damage reduction is welcome.

If you are tanking anything hard enough, and possibly with double attacks or aoe moves and spells that can take up all your 3 shadows, you can't rely on utsu2 alone, and while casting utsu1 you will get attacked while casting. If you fail to evade and counter, which is going to happen again if you are fighting something hard enough, guard reduces dmg and also gives you a higher chance of not being interrupted.