Quick question. MNK- Shura Togi/Osode

[Hirronimus]

Bani, have you posted you MNK White Box goodness on KI yet?

[Tyche]

73MNK w/ togi. Plan on using it forever and ever.

Quick question number 2. Should i use Faith Bags on dynamis lord? Seem like they'd be better for a short zerg fight where you'd pop HF and go at it. Sat will be only my 2nd DL on MNK.

[aurik]

The main question in the thread has been answered i think, but to comment on some of aurik's points:

SH+1 only for soloing please.

SH+1 is really not that good for mnk soloing. 7 extra evasion and accuracy on body piece but you lose so much. Same for crow and raven, they are ok at lvl 50 or for the emnity- for crow in special situations but otherwise not very good. Monk has a great evasion rate and even better evasion and evasion skill gear. There are much better places to put evasion or evasion skill on than body, af1+ boots for dodge+10 more evasion, boxer's mantle for 10 more eva, opti hat, eva torque etc.
AGI seems to help me more than evasion alone, and when I use counterstance and shadows I want to avoid criticals (VIT), counter (or evade) while I recast utsusemi, and increase critical hits for interrupting spells and more dmg the rest of the time.

Extra vit won't do shit when you're counterstancing...
Extra mnd is worthless because you basically never, ever resist.
Extra agi is worthless because you have basically minimum evasion rate anyway, until you start stacking eva gears and then why aren't you using sh/+1.
Extra int and str and dex are nice though.

I think we all agree dex str and int are nice.
AGI is pretty awesome soloing imo. I swap in evasion skill+10 gloves or seiryu's +15 agi and seiryu's seem to be better at keeping me alive in a pinch. Evasion rate for monk is really high, like 3rd best in the game, and we have enough equip to go over thf's base evasion skill by 30 points or so. What we have really low is AGI, which is why I think +10 AGI is really good.
VIT on counterstance is basically the only defensive stat you have left, enemy str - your VIT gets multiplied a couple times in the damage equations so I wouldn't discount it and critical hits are really a killer on counterstance and in general.

It's good to know you can do good dmg meleeing as /war with berserk and atk food on proto-ultima. I was using it as an example (you can take other similar ones, limbus aspi, bahamut etc as well), and I was /nin with a more safe/defensive setup (it helped too, I got hit and drawn in a lot). And yes it's nice to have brds songs on and a PT/alliance setup where you can just sub war and still be safe but you can't always set it up that way.

About cassie or intruder etc. there are situations where you actually want to wear them, for example when you are fighting weakened, which on big hard battles can happen a lot. In those situations all the mnk hp% gear is not all that great and if you want to have a safe 700-800 hp then fixed hp and mp->hp gear can help you more.

To counter your point, I think evasion is incredibly important when soloing. I think it's the most important stat set (evaskill/eva/agi) you can increase. Anything where evasion isn't so critically important, all that Osode does is help you kill it 1 punch sooner.

Monk soloing, in my mind, is all about survival, because we do great damage on anything we can solo by virtue of the high dmg/delay ratio of mnk h2h. We don't get Evasion Bonus IV or whatever thfs have, nor do we get A+ evasion, or Kurayami/Blind Bolts, or other enfeebles. When I solo, I pack on the evasion in every single slot I can.

My current evasion setup, in a nutshell:
Destroyers/Ccounters (I have Mighty Patas too, but they rarely see use)
Ohat / Temple Crown macro
SH+1
Foragers/Nomad+1 (Saving for Boxer)
Evasion Torque
Mst.Cst.Mitts / Melee Gloves / Rst.Tekko
Black Belt
Evasion Earring
Brutal Earring / Dodge Earring (Should really be that new atk+eva earring)
Rajas Ring / Sniper Ring +1
Sniper Ring +1 / Jelly Ring
Melee Hose / Shura Haidate (I wish I had Byakko)
Temple Gaiters +1 / Melee Gaiters macro / Dune Boots / Fuma Kyahan

So yes, AGI is nice, but since we aren't boosting parry/shield, all it helps is guard, and to me guard is just a failed counter; guarded hits will interrupt utsusemi. Yes, it helps criticals against, but would you rather guard/not-get-criticalled (which only kicks in after shadows and counter), or would you rather evade the swing altogether (which kicks in before shadows and counter)?

Evasion/evasion skill reigns supreme. Yes, AGI supposedly translates to evasion on a 2:1 ratio, but honestly, I'd rather have the 7 extra evasion, and if it takes 1-2 extra hits to kill an enemy because of that, so be it.

BTW I did similar damage to Bahamut1 as I did to Temenos boss, but I was /nin for his sweeping flail thingy. Seems like they're setting the defense of these new bosses to somewhere like 900-1000, which is "zomgtoohigh" for the sushi generation, but a properly tweaked meat mnk should have no problems piercing it.

[NynJa]

Hundred Fists and Faith Bagh are not meant to be merged.

I did it on Maat, and its just not worth it.

[genome]

Aurik I agree with a lot of your points. My evasion set is similar to yours, I also have and have used mst.cst.mitts and rst.tekko, but again you should try swapping in seiryu's gloves for a while, I thought mst.cst.mitts would be much better (obviously in a place not owned by bastok, but that's easy) but still often saw not much difference or seiryu's actually seemed a bit better, although it's hard to tell for sure.
I use ethereal and brutal earrings when soloing (for the eva+5 atk+5 and double atk.), black belt, byakko for haste and extra stats etc and usually melee gaiters for counterstance, fenrir's stone, and boxer for evasion skill.
(here is my max eva skill of 301 using only cheap/rare-ex gear)

Aside from AGI, I just find that DEX in Osode also helps me a lot defensively too, not just by killing mob faster but because I interrupt mob's spells often.
Faith B. can also be very good for that but they need to let me bundle virtue stones, plus it depends on mob level, on lower lvl mobs they are almost same dmg per punch as destroyers, just twice the attacks.

And about the guard being a failed counter, yes that's true i much rather counter than guard, but I also noticed that if i guard i also have a decent chance of not being interrupted, even if i got hit at 50% or so of my casting, which is an added bonus.

I understand the points people make about going all out on atk in KRT and having brd just cast 1 atk and 1 haste song, and then going all out in offensive gear. I agree it can make dmg output higher, but in a good xp pt (again speaking only KRT, other xp setups are different i agree), it can just shifts the % damage a bit between 1 monk or another, if you're well equipped and in a good xp pt I don't think it can make a difference in xp/hr, since mobs don't repop all that fast. And at that point the extra AGI can help you get more out of your xp pt by helping guard skillup and maybe saving some mp by interrupting aga spells with a critical hit or evading/guarding/countering.

[Kurp]

If they parse so similar in KRT, then why not go with the body that'll help you out the most for everything else. That is if you can only have one ever which the question was.

Osode just seems so much more handy for MNK than a Togi outside of XP parties.

[Eternus]

As a BRD with Osode I feel it is more versatile and therefore the better choice if you are planning on leveling other jobs. Shura Togi is great in xp and really destroys Osode in every respect. We have parsed MNKs with Osode only and with Togi.. and Togi ALWAYS comes out on top.. and not by a small margin. Osode though is hot as shit for certain HNMs for big WS numbers... but for pure DoT Togi wins hands down. Anyone who argues otherwise is arguing with almost all the MNKs in my LS... who are insane lol. I freely pass my Osode around inside of LS if anyone asks (most have one). Togi gives more consitent Asuran numbers than Osode does... that and it provides MUCH better DPS. Well since accuracy is the main reason why a 8 hit WS would provide more consistency in DMG.

Even as a BRD.. if I was meleeing... sadly my AF2 body owns the living shit out of Osode (plz don't cry).... I pull in xp with Osode.. but if a LS MNK (or any DD/tank) asks I will gladly let them wear it. Damn me for choosing Suppa earring lol.. I need to level a job that uses NIN subjob and can wear Osode.. guess what job that is LOL.

[Sefier]

i remember when af1 body...was acceptable :/ sigh...the good'ol days ; ;

[Eternus]

i remember when af1 body...was acceptable :/ sigh...the good'ol days ; ;

Honestly some of the higher chain parties I have had are with MNKs with AF body.. at least we don't run out of mobs in KRT and have to wait for repops.. that fucking pisses me off. Yes I do all the pulling routes.. ending at chain 42-45 at Vrtra is fun, but endless chains in the loops are usually better xp/hr wise.

[Skyylya]

Yay i'm out of work!

For once i actually agree with aurik.

For soloing on Mnk/Nin, eva is primo. You're ability to solo is directly linked to your ability to evade attacks and stay alive. I'm not quite as rich as him so i don't have eva earring or SH+1, but i have all the other same stuff for evasion and haste inc. black belt.


As for HNM/LS stuff, Mnk/Thf with an Osode and Dragon kick will do just about as well as any other job except the occasional good hit from a drk/thf with ground strike or w/e or a war same deal. I regularly was doing 1150-1395(max) against Tiamat until i finished lvling rdm and became a rfrsh whore that is. I know drk's and warriors can do like 1500-1700, but it is a lot less consistent (at least from what i've seen). A mnk who knows what he's doing is a much more consistent DD.


As for the Osode/Togi thing, meh i've already said my piece. On mnk i hit fast and hard and rarely get out dmg'd. Whether that means i'm a good mnk or the others just suck, i don't care you decide it doesn't matter to me. But i've never been told by a non-noob that i suck. And unfortunately since i have lvl'd Rdm i rarely get to play Mnk(was my first love ) anymore anyway, so i'm mucho happy with my Osode.

[Tom Chambers]

This Osode-is-the-best-piece-of-armor-ever-look-at-all-the-stats-it-boosts trip is getting old. It's the best for RNGs, for everyone else it's just a situational e-peen item. The MNKs that love Osode for meriting are the same dipshits who love STR and sushi.

[Zarathustra]

In summary:

Mild mannered Bard by day, Super heroesque Monk by night!

AMEN!

[zek]

This Osode-is-the-best-piece-of-armor-ever-look-at-all-the-stats-it-boosts trip is getting old. It's the best for RNGs, for everyone else it's just a situational e-peen item. The MNKs that love Osode for meriting are the same dipshits who love STR and sushi.

Made an account just to quote this post.

[XxSlusherxx]

Hundred Fists and Faith Bagh are not meant to be merged.

I did it on Maat, and its just not worth it.

lol Promathia 10% > 0% in about 5 seconds literally, this combo on a non super def mob rivals kraken souleater.

[Onizuka]

I would pay to see genome and aurik in a exp pt... Now that i think about it..fuck that i would pay to see them in Ballista lol! Mnk Vs Mnk mono e mono Osode vs Togi lol

Learned quite a bit from you two in 2min lol. MNK gets al hell lot of gear... with drk it was Hauberk set SH or Vampaire cloak for me and SH is worthless for drk i just had it for nin, So 1 armor set and 2 body armors 1 being only for farming/solo well then again drk only has 2 abilitys aswell-.-'

Anyway back to mnk, How much acc do you have when you use atk food? What kind of acc gear do you guys wear when you exp pt?

[Raineer]

Anyway back to mnk, How much acc do you have when you use atk food? What kind of acc gear do you guys wear when you exp pt?

I think it's fair to say that a MNK with capped H2H merits can use meat and still get 92-93% acc in KRT. The problem lies in folks that are multi 75 that wouldn't merit H2H, that's where you get into sushi and attack builds.

[ps2user]

I would pay to see genome and aurik in a exp pt... Now that i think about it..fuck that i would pay to see them in Ballista lol! Mnk Vs Mnk mono e mono Osode vs Togi lol

osode mnk owns togi mnk on the face in ballista

[Futrid]

I can't help but lol every time i hear someone say they consistantly get higher asurans in KRT with osode than with togi.

Ballista/solo/chi osode, XP/DPS/whatever else togi.

I've been mnk main only since NA launch, and have both, and theres no way in hell osode does more dmg in KRT from my personal experiences, and the proven valid parses I've seen.

[genome]

Yeah I have capped merits in h2h (I am pretty much capped in all merits now), and I don't really use much acc gear even using atk food, optical hat and DEX+ gear like byakko etc.
I have 90%+ accuracy np in KRT if I am in a good pt with mages that blindna or if I bring eye drops, otherwise I think with atk food and just those for acc gear plus bad mages I can go as low as 80% (especially if i am paralyzed most of the time and lose focus and chakra left and right too).

However I kinda like to keep all my gear rare-ex if possible basically just for fun. Plus for looks on random things like helping out people or on mission cutscenes I make sure I don't wear optical hat because it's incredibly ugly-looking.

I have not done ballista too much, when it's 1 against 10 I am as bad as a mob getting voked around but so far I won every 1 on 1 challenge/request I got :wink: (lots of rdm/nins who said they could engage and still win thanks to stoneskin and shadows, a war with ridill/joyeuse who thought he could circle around me to avoid counters, etc)
Against another monk it would be tough and interesting though, I imagine best counter, evasion, tp speed, criticals would win, probably skills in timing ws chakra and utsusemi recasts assuming /nin would be important too. With other subjobs like /sam it might just end too quickly, and there extra hp might be more important to be able to take a 1200 ws and still have around 50% hp. Who knows, I guess I need to try mnk vs mnk sometime.

[Cursed]

osode > togi
now stfu