AV on Titan (OFN)

[CaladbolgSiren]

There's really not much for whm to lot in sea. His blm isn't high, but he's working on it, and that's a great motivational piece. We didn't ask his motives, he's a really nice guy and we put faith in him being able to put his earring to use.

There is only one good piece of gear for blm's to lot on in sky though. I am sure you ls has done sky enough to know this already. But, there is pleanty for Whm's to get in sky. Imo, this is blm onry. I cant knock your system though. In theory its very good. And its also bad ass that he lets your Blm's use it too. I think its pretty damn cool really. Congrats to you and your ls on the kill and drops.

Sorry if someone said this already but I didnt want to read 26 pages of posts ^^/

[Vinen]

There's really not much for whm to lot in sea. His blm isn't high, but he's working on it, and that's a great motivational piece. We didn't ask his motives, he's a really nice guy and we put faith in him being able to put his earring to use.

There is only one good piece of gear for blm's to lot on in sky though. I am sure you ls has done sky enough to know this already. But, there is pleanty for Whm's to get in sky. Imo, this is blm onry. I cant knock your system though. In theory its very good. And its also bad ass that he lets your Blm's use it too. I think its pretty damn cool really. Congrats to you and your ls on the kill and drops.

Sorry if someone said this already but I didnt want to read 26 pages of posts ^^/

As you said you didn't read the thread.

Now do your homework; read the thread then post again.




























Map's LS is SEA ONLY

[Hirronimus]

Progression has nothing to do with being able to kill harder monsters. Progression in this game is killing the same mobs faster with fewer people. Having people with the gear to do Fafnir at 5am with a single party, etc.

After reading all the responces, this one seemed to be stuck in my head like a thorn. What exactly the afore mentioned people who are geared up from the NM would be doing killing same NM that has dropped all the gear they are wearing? That's not progressing, that's greed imho.

[copgary]

Not really, fafnir with 5 people at an early time is harder than fafnir at peak hours with 25people. yeah?

not greedy, just superior

[Hirronimus]

Not really, fafnir with 5 people at an early time is harder than fafnir at peak hours with 25people. yeah?

not greedy, just superior

Not superior, just no lifer.

[Jiyo]

Seriously wow... I "casually" mentioned that one of our whm's got novio as an example to try and defend map getting sash, not because it was still bugging me or anything like that. Apparently, it was a bad example >_> So yeah, didn't mean to stir up this crap, I was just pointing out that we had an item go to a person who's job "didn't benefit the most" already, and that it might happen again, because this is how we do things on our shell.

Sorry I pulled all this up jeese, again I didn't think it was that bad to think someone who worked hard should get a reward or anything....

In last defense against the whm:
He was in the shell maybe...1-2 more months before me. Thats about 16 points max. 16 points because you can only get 2 per week, since we only do two sea runs a week. So me being behind by 4 points meant 2 weeks of points not like 2 days. I was behind even after he spent points on other items, so that shows how much more he attended and how much more he put into the shell than I have.
This is basically one of two items he had any interest on, the other being prudence torque for just playing around with solo (which we've only gotten one). Saying "no you cant lot because you aren't blm or rdm" would mean he would be sitting on his points, not being able to spend it on anything basically. Thats not really fair...
He put in the hours and dedication, he is one of our shells "veteran" players. In all honesty I would be mad if the earring went to one of our lower point holding blms, since they get such a great item, when not putting even half the time into it as the whm did.
Ya ya you can call him a lootwhore or whatever, but like I said I'm only one in the shell that put up the "resistance" against him getting earring and I got over it because I thought it out. I use it a lot during sea because he lets me borrow it, and im sure his dyna buddies get a kick out of it too.
Mainly, I'm not mad because theres a chance another will drop, but there are Items I rather get off AV since i know we can kill + get his drops now lol. Its' just a game, and btw, im reallly confused as to why so many people from other servers and some people not even with access to sea, are trying to put up arguements. You guys just don't know every detail like we do, gota believe us on what we say, we've discussed tons already and when something like this happens to you, you can either remember this or discuss like we did and make you're decision.

[jerkbox]

Sell it and split the loot by points.

[rahvin]

Progression has nothing to do with being able to kill harder monsters. Progression in this game is killing the same mobs faster with fewer people. Having people with the gear to do Fafnir at 5am with a single party, etc.

After reading all the responces, this one seemed to be stuck in my head like a thorn. What exactly the afore mentioned people who are geared up from the NM would be doing killing same NM that has dropped all the gear they are wearing? That's not progressing, that's greed imho.

i think he meant that the players have the gear from other NM's to beable to beat a faffy at 5 am, not that they have faffy's gear and are being greedy.

[Hirronimus]

Progression has nothing to do with being able to kill harder monsters. Progression in this game is killing the same mobs faster with fewer people. Having people with the gear to do Fafnir at 5am with a single party, etc.

After reading all the responces, this one seemed to be stuck in my head like a thorn. What exactly the afore mentioned people who are geared up from the NM would be doing killing same NM that has dropped all the gear they are wearing? That's not progressing, that's greed imho.

i think he meant that the players have the gear from other NM's to beable to beat a faffy at 5 am, not that they have faffy's gear and are being greedy.

Hmmm, let's see...

Progression has nothing to do with being able to kill harder monsters. Progression in this game is killing the same mobs faster with fewer people.

I dunno about you, but to me it sounds like he's talking about killing same thing with the gear that thing has /already/ been dropped for those people. Hmmm....

[layoneil]

I dunno about you, but to me it sounds like he's talking about killing same thing with the gear that thing has /already/ been dropped for those people. Hmmm....

obviously, you live in a world where every Fafnir drops Ridill and every Nidhogg drops 3 Body Abjurations.

i still don't have A Feet, granted i pass for everyone else that wants it but that means there are still people who want it and it's just A Feet.

the only Fafnir/Nidhogg item BG is really maxed on is Aegishjalmr and no, you're not getting the next one we get.

Maybe you think that it played absolutely no role in BG's fall from the top, but I'd say that's pretty naive.

it didn't.

[Hirronimus]

I dunno about you, but to me it sounds like he's talking about killing same thing with the gear that thing has /already/ been dropped for those people. Hmmm....

obviously, you live in a world where every Fafnir drops Ridill and every Nidhogg drops 3 Body Abjurations.

i still don't have A Feet, granted i pass for everyone else that wants it but that means there are still people who want it and it's just A Feet.

the only Fafnir/Nidhogg item BG is really maxed on is Aegishjalmr and no, you're not getting the next one we get.

Obviously, but maybe you should read closer what Xav thinks of progresssion. Was I refering to BG? No. Was I elaborating on his idea of progression? Yes.

You don't have A.Feet? That's to bad, but it's respectable thing on your part to do or stupid, to pass to someone who've been in LS less time than you have. It's none of my business, so whatever. I hope you keep getting Assjamers, you seem to take pride in that.

You can take a linkshell of people wearing nothing but AF and kill Fafnir with 18 people in an hour. You can take a linkshell that has all the gear from Fafnir/Nidhogg/KB etc and kill Fafnir with 6 people in the same amount of time.

Progression has nothing to do with being able to kill harder monsters. Progression in this game is killing the same mobs faster with fewer people. Having people with the gear to do Fafnir at 5am with a single party, etc.

Just to clarify what I was talking about because you seem to have missed it. :wink:

[layoneil]

but maybe you should read closer what Xav thinks of progresssion. Was I refering to BG? No. Was I elaborating on his idea of progression? Yes.

i know what he thinks of progression and i agree with him. most gear doesn't help you kill stuff since most stuff can be killed with AF1 if you have enough people. good gear lets you go with less people.

you're elaborating to the point where it applies to no NAs on the server and quite possibly no NAs on any server, which makes your elaboration useless.

i'll tell you exactly what's wrong with you "elaboration"

After reading all the responces, this one seemed to be stuck in my head like a thorn. What exactly the afore mentioned people who are geared up from the NM would be doing killing same NM that has dropped all the gear they are wearing? That's not progressing, that's greed imho.

no one has "all the gear", some people have some of the gear. and even "all the gear" for some jobs doesn't mean "all the gear" for all their jobs.

yeah, if some people have "all the gear", they should stop. that's why some people complain about JPs and a lot of JPs (Sekaix, PG, Way) have stopped.

[NynJa]

Someone could be fucking off for 2 weeks on a point system, come back with a surplus, and lot the best item in the game. That was what we wanted to avoid.

Does this mean that work you put in up to the time 2 weeks ago when you went on vacation or w/e loses it's value? That doesn't seem right.

Depends why they were gone.

If they were on vacation (aka: you dont see them on msg boards, you dont see them ingame...leading to an actual out of town vacation), yes.
If they were just boycotting whatever event (aka: when you're up in sea farming, they're xping because "sea is boring"), then no. You keep their points, but you go "sorry man, we aint heard from you in 2 weeks while you were out xping. We have your points on record, but you need to attend to cash them in."

[layoneil]

for the points thing.

it can be good and bad, you can do points and still regulate but keeping track is a pain, i'd say that's the primary reason why it's not done.

and being extremely "job-ist" is bad. for rare drop items, attendance > job. if the item is so rare you can level up a suitable job faster than it's realistically expected to drop again (Ridill, Defending Ring, AV items, etc).

but either way, if you have influential greedy bastards at the top, any system will get abused.

[Septimus]

Y O U R . I M A G E . F A I L S

Judging by your post count you fail and a having a social life troll now

http://home.comcast.net/~dmottern/arnold.jpg
and the you fail shit was so 2005 nerd!

I know, I know. You have a party life. You go out and "has much sacks with all teh hawt chix."

(Anyone else catch that he said that I fail, then he said that saying that something fails is so 2005? Just thought that was amusing.)

[Hirronimus]

Nugget is a faggit. No offence to gay people on these forums.

[rahvin]

Progression has nothing to do with being able to kill harder monsters. Progression in this game is killing the same mobs faster with fewer people. Having people with the gear to do Fafnir at 5am with a single party, etc.

After reading all the responces, this one seemed to be stuck in my head like a thorn. What exactly the afore mentioned people who are geared up from the NM would be doing killing same NM that has dropped all the gear they are wearing? That's not progressing, that's greed imho.

i think he meant that the players have the gear from other NM's to beable to beat a faffy at 5 am, not that they have faffy's gear and are being greedy.

Hmmm, let's see...

Progression has nothing to do with being able to kill harder monsters. Progression in this game is killing the same mobs faster with fewer people.

I dunno about you, but to me it sounds like he's talking about killing same thing with the gear that thing has /already/ been dropped for those people. Hmmm....

because out of a ls with 40 some odd ppl in it, the same exact 5 ppl are going to show up to every kill let alone account for those ppl getting gear for a second job they are currently playing (and no im not talking about a whm who might one day lvl blm to make use of an earring).

[Septimus]

All I know is that I am 13k XP away from caring about Fafnir. (It is sad that I will never get to live my dream of having a Ridill before I ding 70...)

[Hirronimus]

(It is sad that I will never get to live my dream of having a Ridill before I ding 70...)

Stop leveling it. :wink:

[Xavier]

I dunno about you, but to me it sounds like he's talking about killing same thing with the gear that thing has /already/ been dropped for those people. Hmmm....

I don't know about you, but I can count on one hand the number of NMs worth killing for endgame HNM gear, that are 21-24hr pops that always have competition.

If not killing the same mobs, what am I killing? Killing time in Jeuno?

And yeah, you'll almost never have the exact same people at an event, and you'll almost never max any one player out on gear from every major HNM in the game. And even then, when hes maxed out, would you call him more greedy if he came to camp NMs that dropped nothing for him for the linkshell, or if he afked in Jeuno because they dropped nothing for him. Greed is relative to everyone having the gear already.

Is it greedy of me to camp Fafnir, because I already have every single drop from him when people in the LS don't? Should I not enter the zone because I already have his gear?