/PLD

[Lordwafik]

I beleive you're the only person who's complained about it. I dont get it, you're a healer yourself arent you? I love the fact that PLD are going to take less damage, and have auto refresh, it means I dont have to blow chunks of MP just on him, and the MP can be kept for emergency or to keep the chains going longer.

You'll still want NIN tank in XP. They do more damage and take less. These changes did absolutly nothing for that. For a PLD to up their damage, guess what, they LOSE THEIR SHIELD. So adding more shield abilities was fucking brilliant... It'll help them in the only situation they already shine in HNM. They should have given a defender ability that doesn't completley gimp damage output so they can work in XP parties better. At least the TP gain is something, not that anyone chains with a sword anyway.

No, YOU'LL still want a NIN so you can keep living in the past, I'll take a PLD now. I always loved PLD, burn parties get boring (i now hate monk burn, ulegard only, fuck weapons). And I dont mind a nice SC party. When the PLD has a clue, he doesnt take too much damage, now with this update the shield rate goes way high, and he wont take as much damage, also autorefresh helps the whole party, not himself. But all you could say is "waawaaa they're improving a job I have to heal waaaaaaa".

FFXI has changed, it's more demanding and fast paced than it was before. The jobs follow suit.

I fail to see how making jobs more powerful, but in stupid ways, being more demanding. It's less. More power = less demanding. And we're talking about paladins to begin with, whats demanding, provoke, auto-attack, get a cup of coffee, read the paper, wait for the puller's <call> for the next mob and repeat.

Paladins getting a mage ability that mages cry for and would even sub the gimp ass SMN job for is FUCKING RETARDED. Paladins should not get a signature mage job ability. They're not a mage job. They should not get an ability that will boost their healing abilities. How about instead paladins get an ability that increases healing done to them by 10%? That took 3 seconds to pull out my ass and is better than SE's idea.

Fuck, not that it's going to matter. Fafnir/Nidhogg which PLD have been tanking easily for 3 years STILL drop the best fucking loot in the game. So much for the game getting demanding. Only demanding part is beating the bots on claim.

[/quote]

How is getting autorefresh stupid? Stop thinking of it as a SMN ability, think of it as an ability total. Are you saying the hercules ring is stupid? How about we remove their MP completly? How about we dont let them party with anyone who can give refresh! Even better!

You're idea is fucking stupid, about getting 10% more heal onto them. Why should a PLD get a bigger heal than anyone? What's the point of that? So the other people can generate more hate while curing them? This way, a pld SLOWLY gets refreshed (1MP / tic isnt ground breaking), and can now give himself that extra cure or flash in the party, letting that rdm or whm heal 1 more tic while resting.

---

And blms who constantly die are a liability -_- the ones who are like "hay guyz lewk at my MB LOLZ" and then die, then beg to get R3'd, then die when they get up , then demand another R3, etc. Unless you bring your own RR hairpin, you're a waste.

[aurik]

Now then, Lets give a quick BLM/RDM checklist.

1) Are we fighting things that cause status effects that NEED Erase or certain -na spells?

2) Are in a party setup that Absolutly Requires the BLM to have Divine Seal or Divine magic?


If no, Then why not /RDM for Fastcast and a little more INT? [and +1hMP earring]

Now also, I totally agree that there are situations where /WHM is better, more efficient, and every BLM should have WHM leveled. But to say that /RDM is unusable or to mock people for using it in situations where it'd be fine? That's just shortsighted.

The problem being many blms almost desperately try to answer "no" to (1) when they really should be answering "yes". And then they go as blm/rdm and stand around with mp to burn because if they nuke anymore they'll get killed. GFJ, way to make use of that fast cast.

PS. you don't have to sign every post you write, just make a signature. That and your name to the left of your post is plenty instead of adding a stupid 4-line gap which makes blockquotes look dumb without editing them by hand



~Aurik

[cassiraa]

yeah, the manual sig is more habit than anything, I'll make a FFXI sig tonight.

And I'm not defending bad BLMs, But I agree with Kuno, /RDM is my favorite sub, And although it's not always the best choice, I'd hate for people to look down on BLM/RDM because they feel /whm is superior.

/WHM is more versatile. But if you don't need veratility, and you just want a BLM who can output the most raw damage, or for Zerg battles where you want a BLM to output in the fastest amount of time, /RDM is more than viable. \('-')/

[Stilgar]

Going with Aurik here. 99% of BLMs are overnuking retards who learned all they know about the job (what little it is) in manaburns 50-75. BLM ought to sub whm for mixed group activities to lend a helping hand via -na or Erase if needed, and even RR/R1 because we all know there's going to be that one or two people (minimum) who didn't bring a rr hairpin, or died a 2nd time w/o putting rr up. The raise issue is more relevant to manaburns but yeah.

Fast Cast is nothing special, and having ~3 extra int to put out < 10 dmg on nukes that are already doing like 1300 means absolute dick.

[Not Kuno]

Wow what died up your ass?

To be honest subbing /whm does not give the super awesome ability to stay alive. Theres no secret -50 enmity when subbing it. Dying or living is entirely dependant on what the fuck you do (and how much your tanks suck). I don't see how a discussion about overnuking leaked over to a /rdm vs /whm debate.

OH NOES HE CAN CAST FASTER HE MUST BE CASTING EVERY SINGLE SPELL AS SOON AS ITS AVAILIBLE!

[Xfaustx]

lol i go to work and come back and the whole thread is about /rdm vs /whm i like how you guys get so off topic.

you cant compare /rdm to /whm theyre not meant for the same things, so saying one is better than the other is just stupid. and that also goes for the /pld thing i was talking about earlier. which is why this whole thread started, was about the benefits of /pld. i never said it was the best damn sub for BLM so stop trying to flame me haha. im just stating the reasons someone would use it, or how it could be used. so those trying to flame obviously dont know how to read. cuz i already stated 100 times WHM is a way better sub. but whatever i cant help the illiterate kids

[Maxxthepenguin]

And blms who constantly die are a liability -_- the ones who are like "hay guyz lewk at my MB LOLZ" and then die, then beg to get R3'd, then die when they get up , then demand another R3, etc. Unless you bring your own RR hairpin, you're a waste.

I almost agree, but its just as bad when they DON'T bring one. They become nearly useless for 5 minutes PLUS most mobs have some sort of AoE that loves to chomp those glass cannons, killing multiple BLMs with one's stupid mistake. God, idiot BLMs piss me off.

[Xfaustx]

mos def agree with you though maxx and Lordwaf. BLM who overnuke really do need to watch what theyre doing. theyre wasting the alliances time and MP if they are continuously dying and all that.

[MikedeeFenrir]

99% of BLMs are overnuking retards

Retarded comment.

BLM ought to sub whm for mixed group activities to lend a helping hand via -na or Erase

If Erase is going to be a HUGE deal, than have the RDM sub WHM, or maybe the BRD should cast it.

and even RR/R1 because we all know there's going to be that one or two people (minimum) who didn't bring a rr hairpin

You eat R1 XP loss at 75, and RR Hairpin isn't Rare/Ex last I checked, you can share you know.

[quote="Stilgar"] Fast Cast is nothing special, and having ~3 extra int to put out < 10 dmg on nukes that are already doing like 1300 means absolute dick.[quote]

It's 6 INT Differnce vs WHM

O and 60-75 Tier IV nukes.

That's a fully merited BLM TT talking btw ;3

[aurik]

Wow what died up your ass?

To be honest subbing /whm does not give the super awesome ability to stay alive. Theres no secret -50 enmity when subbing it. Dying or living is entirely dependant on what the fuck you do (and how much your tanks suck). I don't see how a discussion about overnuking leaked over to a /rdm vs /whm debate.

OH NOES HE CAN CAST FASTER HE MUST BE CASTING EVERY SINGLE SPELL AS SOON AS ITS AVAILIBLE!

The thing is, in a situation where you're standing around waiting for the enmity gap to widen so you can safely nuke, fast cast isn't really helping you much. You might as well have subbed whm so you can toss status heals when your main healers can't. And we already discussed how the additional int is inconsequential, except for epenis.

[MikedeeFenrir]

Wow what died up your ass?

To be honest subbing /whm does not give the super awesome ability to stay alive. Theres no secret -50 enmity when subbing it. Dying or living is entirely dependant on what the fuck you do (and how much your tanks suck). I don't see how a discussion about overnuking leaked over to a /rdm vs /whm debate.

OH NOES HE CAN CAST FASTER HE MUST BE CASTING EVERY SINGLE SPELL AS SOON AS ITS AVAILIBLE!

The thing is, in a situation where you're standing around waiting for the enmity gap to widen so you can safely nuke, fast cast isn't really helping you much. You might as well have subbed whm so you can toss status heals when your main healers can't. And we already discussed how the additional int is inconsequential, except for epenis.

and Erase is a non-hate spell? Please tell me I must know...

[Lordwafik]

i'll take an honest and non biased look at the /pld sub for BLM

/pld :

Auto-refresh at 35sj, and shield mastery. Some defence bonus, and more HP im guessing than other jobs. MP count is irrelivent, BLM dont have MP problems at 75.

For soloing : no sneak/invis, nothing to back you up aside from stun/flash, no stoneskin or blink, no gravity. However it gives you one thing other jobs cannot give, which is Cures AND autorefresh at the same time.

For partying : This has opened up a ton of new possibilities as BLM support healer. Now the blm is a healer with autorefresh, refresh from cloak/dalm , and also from a spell, which makes him like a RDM, in terms of MP being restored. Also highest clear mind. Also he can throw a flash AND a stun whenever it's needed, is better than any other job, the only other job who can do this is PLD/DRK or DRK/PLD, but they dont have the MP to waste on things like that (well maybe drk).

for HNM that spam AOE's like faf : Burden.
for HNM that you kite and are easily able to do so like KB : it's quite ok.

Now on the subject of /rdm on HNM, all depends which fight. Jorm i'd /whm because of the extreme amount of times im paralyzed in that fight, tiamat, well i'd /whm too, because I could be hit by a freak wing and i'd rather be able to viruna myself.

Other ones, KB i'd rather /rdm, alot of the times me moves out of my cast range even with fast cast, let alone as /whm.
On fafnir i like to /rdm, Phalanx + Shell2 + Stoneskin = unbreakable stoneskin on wing, after wing I just cancel and reapply my stoneskin.
On aspid, either is fine really, the int loss between /rdm and /whm is so minimal.


Now that's me, considering the party now :

On KB I like to cure alot of the melees who arent getting heals from whm (it happens) so I like to heal them. Also I like to barthundara my whole party instead of self target, so that's another reason i'd occasionally /whm

On fafnir, it's his blind that eats melee, but even still, im not going to be casting blindna instead of taking care of my stoneskin/buffs.

On turtle, who the hell takes damage.

[aurik]

Wow what died up your ass?

To be honest subbing /whm does not give the super awesome ability to stay alive. Theres no secret -50 enmity when subbing it. Dying or living is entirely dependant on what the fuck you do (and how much your tanks suck). I don't see how a discussion about overnuking leaked over to a /rdm vs /whm debate.

OH NOES HE CAN CAST FASTER HE MUST BE CASTING EVERY SINGLE SPELL AS SOON AS ITS AVAILIBLE!

The thing is, in a situation where you're standing around waiting for the enmity gap to widen so you can safely nuke, fast cast isn't really helping you much. You might as well have subbed whm so you can toss status heals when your main healers can't. And we already discussed how the additional int is inconsequential, except for epenis.

and Erase is a non-hate spell? Please tell me I must know...

Erase doesn't generate that much hate, but more likely you'll be using blindna/paralyna on outside PT because you're in the blm PT. Those status heals generate extremely minor hate compared to T4 spells / flash / voke / ninjutsus. Probably less hate than resting a tick.

[Xfaustx]

And we already discussed how the additional int is inconsequential, except for epenis.

i totally agree with this, RDMs extra INT and loss of MP makes it really only for soloing and e-penis. it shouldnt be brought to a HNM event cuz of lack of many spells that are needed. you lose all -na and erase spells which is huge. Mikedee said for RDM to sub /whm instead, but sometimes RDM need to be subbing other things more beneficial to a fight. whether it be /drk or /blm to make sure their enfeebs land. subbing /rdm at a HNM fight just doesnt make up for the losses

and to LordWafs recent post. yah thats kinda what i was getting at with /PLD but people were to busy flaming to realise what i was saying. and holy sheet with that new Yagit armor. i think that stuff looks tight. not sure if this is true but i heard the MP refresh with whole set is +2... so with PLD sub its constant 3 MP refresh, again opening up a self refreshing BLM for extra cures and such

[aurik]

rdm/blm for the extra eseal is nice, but if not I prefer whm sub there.

There's a time and a place for blm/rdm; KB is an excellent example, as is Kirin: both fights are pretty low on key status ailments, both fights are kited which makes cast time an issue.

However, in general I think the sub is way over-used.

[MikedeeFenrir]

rdm/blm for the extra eseal is nice, but if not I prefer whm sub there.

There's a time and a place for blm/rdm; KB is an excellent example, as is Kirin: both fights are pretty low on key status ailments, both fights are kited which makes cast time an issue.

However, in general I think the sub is way over-used.

I'm guessing ur a 75 BLM.

And when I ask this I'm being serious to god, can you sub RDM as BLM?

I'm guessing no, which leaves you little room to speak about it.

[Not Kuno]

aurik I'm going to make a list of what I feel is acceptable for /whm and /rdm. Feel free to comment.

/rdm:
Every Dynamis except Xarca
Behe/KB
Adamant/Aspid
Sky Gods
Kirin
Tiamat (adds)
Jorm (adds)
Vrtra (adds)
Limbus
Proto-Omega
Proto-Ultima


/whm:
Ouryu


Debatable:
Fafnir/Nidhogg (I personally go /rdm; not enough melee and too many whm or /whm to fix the few melee we have)
Dynamis-Xarca (I go /whm sometimes, slow WS blows ass)


I might be missing some events.

[cassiraa]

I'm guessing ur a 75 BLM.
And when I ask this I'm being serious to god, can you sub RDM as BLM?
I'm guessing no, which leaves you little room to speak about it.

-RDM75-THF 68-

In all fairness, I'm wondering what your BLM is at too.


Not Kuno Wins the Internet, IMHO, although I'd rather have /WHM in some Limbus areas, and Faf.

[whm_mahler]

you could use /whm for everything. Whenever I fought KB or Kirin them running out of range wasnt that big of a deal, not enough for me to change to /rdm. Personally i like /whm and don't really care if another blm uses /rdm.

[jiang]

I think BLM/RDM is unnecessary for dynamis, I think it's rather selfish as well. no curaga for sleepga, no status heals if someone gets one... Chances are if you go to a public dynamis, not all the BLMs sub RDM... so if you do synchronized nukes, you can go ahead of someone and mess it up. Also, I just don't see the point of showing off your damage in dynamis because all it'll do is get you killed