Blue Mage: Best thread ever

[Meian]

Hey guys - I've updated my Cannonball quick chart and equip build - enjoy. (attached)

EDIT: seems like the attachment changes the jpg - here's the link to the original one:
http://gnu.univ.gda.pl/~huckster/ff11/cannonball.jpg

Nice just bothersome the "noob" part considering not everyone does sea jailers >>

[eva00r]

lol @ wivre mask +1 > dusk mask +1 ... you trade 10++ raw def, 3 vit for 3 str and call that uber !?

[Kaslo]

well seeing as Wivre has a 75% chance of going up the next fSTR it's not a bad assumption to make considering 10DEF isn't that much of a difference.

[eva00r]

10DEF and 3VIT is a BIG chunk of difference, this value will be multiplied into ~20DEF with cocoon and food. Assuming CB's def replaces normal WS's atk, increase the value by 20 is always greater than pushin fSTR by 1.

[Kaslo]

unless you can reach the diminishing returns point of DEF without it

[huckster]

http://images.wikia.com/ffxi/images/...ask_plus_1.jpg

VS

http://images.wikia.com/ffxi/images/...ask_plus_1.jpg

Yeah - there's 11 points difference in defence between those two - and Dusk Mask +1 has extra +3 VIT. However after many tests and experiments (Kaslo also did a ton) it was proven that STR > VIT > Def in Cannonball.

I guess the best way to check it is to make 50+ Cannonballs with WM+1 and DM+1 and compare the results.

BTW:
http://gnu.univ.gda.pl/~huckster/ff11/ixion_can.jpg

[eva00r]

STR > VIT > DEF

This statement is not true. You should say 1 STR > 1 VIT > 1 DEF, which is correct.

11 DEF + 3 VIT is always greater than 3 STR, when you fight lv 85+ HNM, not merit mobs. (Its roughly 20 DEF difference with food and cocoon)

Atk/Def ratio is capped at 2, using Cannonball to any lv 85+ HNM will always need more and more def - Even 800 def is sometimes not capped this ratio out. Try do CB with minne, which push your def over 850 barrier, and you'll know the differences yourself.

[huckster]

This statement is not true. You should say 1 STR > 1 VIT > 1 DEF, which is correct.

11 DEF + 3 VIT is always greater than 3 STR, when you fight lv 85+ HNM, not merit mobs. (Its roughly 20 DEF difference with food and cocoon)

Atk/Def ratio is capped at 2, using Cannonball to any lv 85+ HNM will always need more and more def - Even 800 def is sometimes not capped this ratio out. Try do CB with minne, which push your def over 850 barrier, and you'll know the differences yourself.

Thx eva00r for your input. Yeah - double Minne helps a lot, but it's a matter of balance what to max out - STR or VIT or Def?

I can swap Dusk Mask +1 with Wivre Mask +1 - no problem. My goal is to give the best possible Cannonball setup in the chart. Any other thoughts?

[Kaslo]

This statement is not true. You should say 1 STR > 1 VIT > 1 DEF, which is correct.

11 DEF + 3 VIT is always greater than 3 STR, when you fight lv 85+ HNM, not merit mobs. (Its roughly 20 DEF difference with food and cocoon)

Atk/Def ratio is capped at 2, using Cannonball to any lv 85+ HNM will always need more and more def - Even 800 def is sometimes not capped this ratio out. Try do CB with minne, which push your def over 850 barrier, and you'll know the differences yourself.

It's not really worth fighting over. And yeah Minne is the song of choice but mainly I see it because it's such a bigger amount in ratio to stat songs that is outweighs them. But to be fair you are going to need a good amount of STR and a good amount of DEF for HNMs.

[[Vax]]

You really think the +3str on Voyager Sallet would outdo the +23 DEF on Keffiyeh? Especially in a not-so-pimped-out cannonball setup?

[VZX]

I personally don't think that the defense in cannonball build is treated the same way the system treated atk vs def. I'm not saying there's a coefficient to modify the growth of the defense "attack", but more to "target defense is independent to cannonball pDIF"

[Forsakengod]

imo should swap 1000 needles for blastbomb and magnetic cloud. +1str +2vit > +3vit

[eva00r]

iirc 1k needles give def bonus job trait.

[huckster]

imo should swap 1000 needles for blastbomb and magnetic cloud. +1str +2vit > +3vit

Yeah - this is better! ANd no - 1000 needles is not needed for Def Bonus trait. Saline Coat and Vertical Cleave take care of that (VIT+3 total). Thx!

[eva00r]

ic

[huckster]

At the following time, I've performed a version update of CANNONBALL BUILD.

[Time & Date]
Jul. 7, 2008 at 20:00 (PDT)

[Affected Jobs]
Blue Mage

[Important Update Details]
- Dusk Mask +1 was promoted as the best head for Cannonball (Wivre Mask +1 - second choice)
- Removed "1000 Needles" (VIT+3) from the setup - "Magnetite Cloud" and "Blastbomb" was added instead (VIT+2, STR+1)
- Changed the order of spells from alphabetical to auto-sort order - so it's easier and faster to pick them from the list (no skipping up and down)

http://gnu.univ.gda.pl/~huckster/ff11/cannonball.jpg

[Hwang]

Has anyone done any solid testing on AF body vs morrigan's?

[Kaslo]

I haven't but the math says AF Body

[Hwang]

How so?

[astura]

well outside cannonball testing i did using af vr morrigans on vertical cleave showed better none ca results with morrigans and better results with af during ca. After seeing this lots of times i just now normally use af on ca only spells and morrigans or homam body (multi hit spell) on every other spell outside ca. Though is it me or does it seem like cannonball got ninja modded (or omega) i used to always pull 1-1.2k 0tp saca on omega and was going form 600-850 casa (and 800 sa roughly) last time i fought him. (used the same gears merits etc but had a minne boost to last time i fought him vrs none before that) did get a 2.2k azcasa on the same omega so something seems to be up.
Anyways for morrigans vrs af. af on ca otherwise the autorefresh and str boost on morrigans are better for everything else. (need to do more testing to confirm this but im on blu so little these days and nothing relly worthwhile to use as a test subject)