New Vrtra complication

[Hakamaru]

Everyone seems to be touching on the fact that your Summoners in the main alliance are probably claiming the skeleton helpers.

Ask any Summoner about avatar auto-attack and you'll probably understand why this happens. If an avatar is summoned and not given a "/pet assault <t>" command, it will auto-attack one (of possibly many) mob that is targetting the Summoner.

Now if your SMNs are smart, they aren't using assault commands to DD Vrtra. Which means that avatars will auto-attack a skeleton even if they only target the summoner for a split second. Throw in hate-reset moves that Vrtra inevitably does, and it's probable that a SMN is going to get targetted by a skeleton during the fight. It's no one's fault, you just have to learn to deal with it. Have the SMN that claimed do a "/pcmd leave" then engage and disengage the claimed skeleton and that should undo the claim.

[further]

Necro bump I know, but I was curious if these issues still exist, or has there been an adjustment since then. These posts were made right after the claim adjustments iirc.

So do these problems still exist?

[Devek]

These problems existed from day 1

When we used to farm Vrtra we always "pulled" the summons with stun, which protected the kiters long enough for blm nukes to do their thing.

The only thing I don't know for certain is if <bt> macros work on a white mob.

[Aodh]

If anyone still uses <bt> they should be shot. <stpc>/<stnpc> make sure you get the right mob/player and not mess up cause you're too lazy to target.

On another note, make sure that everyone in the main alliance isn't wearing and Physical Damage: *** Spikes Effect. There's not too much gear that does, but if you do any damage to it you register claim.

IF the main alliance gets claim tho, best is to have an avatar assaulted on the add, then the summoner /pcmd leave and CFH on it. Just don't CFH on Vrtra in the process.

[Priran]

These problems existed from day 1

When we used to farm Vrtra we always "pulled" the summons with stun, which protected the kiters long enough for blm nukes to do their thing.

The only thing I don't know for certain is if <bt> macros work on a white mob.

<bt> works like <t> if your party doesn't have a claimed mob.

[Kaeko]

The new claim system has some pretty funny rules to it. A couple weeks ago, my LS got darters right on a Nidhogg window and I immediately sleepga'd them (same situation as the guy who posted previously) - my sleepga was the first thing to hit Nidhogg as it popped, but because I did not actually target it, it did not claim, but I still got on its hate list. A bunch of people started spamming moments later and everything from every single alliance went through and it stayed yellow; a PLD from another LS finally 2hred to seal the hate and it turned purple.

From what I can tell, the Claim Delay means you cannot target the mob right as it pops; however, you can still hit it immediately with a -ga spell. I do this all the time in Dynamis on DRG mobs, casting sleepga on the DRG right before the pet pops. The spell should land right as the pet pops if timed correctly.

I think anyone could pretty much reenact what happened that day for me at the Aery by holding a darter, having a bunch of people casting sleepga right on the window. A sleepga will most likely hit Fafhogg before anyone can claim it because a real claim can only occur after the Claim Delay but sleepgas don't have to. Once sleepga hits, Fafhogg goes into that yellow mode where everyone gets to target it - then have a PLD ready to provoke and Invincible and it's yours. It's a pretty interesting way to claim if other LSs don't realize what's going on since the claim now depends on who seals hate first, not who targets it first.

[Khamsin]

These problems existed from day 1

When we used to farm Vrtra we always "pulled" the summons with stun, which protected the kiters long enough for blm nukes to do their thing.

The only thing I don't know for certain is if <bt> macros work on a white mob.

<bt> works like <t> if your party doesn't have a claimed mob.

I never use <bt> directly in my spell macros. I have a macro to /ta <bt>, then the rest of my macros are all <stnpc>. Hopefully your macros (especially sleep/bind/grav) aren't <bt> or else you're screwed if you ever get adds while your party is busy fighting something else.

[Aribeth]

We used to do the kiting strategy but ran into similar complications as the OP described. Some nice kiting suggestions here though.

However, now we straight tank and have 2 PTs of BLMs in a second alliance just continually use Elemental-AGA spells to take them out. It really simplifies things.

Because all the hate is linked. Just have the bards for each BLM pt horde lullaby and then let the BLMs do their thing. Hate was still on us PLDs and NINs.

Best thing with straight tanking is that people can position themselves at various distances so that recovery from Vrtra's Wing is relatively quick.

[further]

I never use <bt> directly in my spell macros. I have a macro to /ta <bt>, then the rest of my macros are all <stnpc>. Hopefully your macros (especially sleep/bind/grav) aren't <bt> or else you're screwed if you ever get adds while your party is busy fighting something else.

I actually do the same thing, it is nice to have a /ta <bt> macro when you don't have adds and need to pick out your target quickly in a group of PC/mobs, etc. Other than that though, I try to avoid <bt>.

[Jawas]

We use to kill Vrtra via kiting, but after the changes to the claim rules, we have to straight tank Vrtra now. The we had was, summons with less than 50% life still running after the kiter with hate on Vrtra, when in the past pre-patch that summon would be runn for the BLM who nuked it down.

Its a different fight now than it was a year ago.

[neophytal]

We use to kill Vrtra via kiting, but after the changes to the claim rules, we have to straight tank Vrtra now. The we had was, summons with less than 50% life still running after the kiter with hate on Vrtra, when in the past pre-patch that summon would be runn for the BLM who nuked it down.

Its a different fight now than it was a year ago.

*shrugs* we havent had a fight with vrtra in almost a year-- we engaged on saturday and used the same kiting strategy as last year and it worked beautifully...

it actually went smoother than any of the last 3 fights.

[Khamsin]

We use to kill Vrtra via kiting, but after the changes to the claim rules, we have to straight tank Vrtra now. The we had was, summons with less than 50% life still running after the kiter with hate on Vrtra, when in the past pre-patch that summon would be runn for the BLM who nuked it down.

Its a different fight now than it was a year ago.

How do you avoid flails while straight tanking?

[Raineer]

We use to kill Vrtra via kiting, but after the changes to the claim rules, we have to straight tank Vrtra now. The we had was, summons with less than 50% life still running after the kiter with hate on Vrtra, when in the past pre-patch that summon would be runn for the BLM who nuked it down.

Its a different fight now than it was a year ago.

How do you avoid flails while straight tanking?

Pretty sure a straight-tanked Vrtra flails alot, you just stun it.

[Khamsin]

We use to kill Vrtra via kiting, but after the changes to the claim rules, we have to straight tank Vrtra now. The we had was, summons with less than 50% life still running after the kiter with hate on Vrtra, when in the past pre-patch that summon would be runn for the BLM who nuked it down.

Its a different fight now than it was a year ago.

How do you avoid flails while straight tanking?

Pretty sure a straight-tanked Vrtra flails alot, you just stun it.

A missed spike flail > a missed GoH

I hope they have good stunners.

[Robert]

ffxiapp has an integrated stunbot

[Sylvana]

We killed Vrtra again yesterday, 1st time in in years. We kited and had 2 flails from killer WS but our plds are leet and never die! <AHEM> ^^) Didnt have any claim problems or anything of that sort. As far as str8 tanking ugh... way back when, we used to full tank it with ninjas in a corner. Its too much of a pain in the ass, one summon or pop tickles his dingaling and he turns and flails.

[Jawas]

Well the problem we had with Kiting, was we use to keep our BLMs out of the main alliance. When an add popped, it was pretty easy for them to nuke hate. Under the new rules, we had adds at 40-50% still beating on the kiters.


With straight tanking we only seemed to have fail issues at 2-3%. We failed 2 times with heavy fails at that mark, which if I remember right, since being a tank you dont see much, it was due to WS damage + Roars = Fail. We normally keep our smn's in a position where if they take hate it doesnt flip the Wrym.


mainly with the straight tanking, it gave our BLMs a more accurate target to -ga down. When kiting, we had issues with hate, and add's getting out the range of spells.

[aurik]

Well the problem we had with Kiting, was we use to keep our BLMs out of the main alliance. When an add popped, it was pretty easy for them to nuke hate. Under the new rules, we had adds at 40-50% still beating on the kiters.


With straight tanking we only seemed to have fail issues at 2-3%. We failed 2 times with heavy fails at that mark, which if I remember right, since being a tank you dont see much, it was due to WS damage + Roars = Fail. We normally keep our smn's in a position where if they take hate it doesnt flip the Wrym.


mainly with the straight tanking, it gave our BLMs a more accurate target to -ga down. When kiting, we had issues with hate, and add's getting out the range of spells.

Lullaby.

[Jawas]

Well the problem we had with Kiting, was we use to keep our BLMs out of the main alliance. When an add popped, it was pretty easy for them to nuke hate. Under the new rules, we had adds at 40-50% still beating on the kiters.


With straight tanking we only seemed to have fail issues at 2-3%. We failed 2 times with heavy fails at that mark, which if I remember right, since being a tank you dont see much, it was due to WS damage + Roars = Fail. We normally keep our smn's in a position where if they take hate it doesnt flip the Wrym.


mainly with the straight tanking, it gave our BLMs a more accurate target to -ga down. When kiting, we had issues with hate, and add's getting out the range of spells.

Lullaby.

Well we had Tredvolt with the BLMs doing that and we still had issues. We just feel straight tanking is the way to go now. The main issue is just the new claim system is a pain in the ass with this fight. Really the fun of the fight is only reason we have any interest in this HNM.

[neophytal]

i dont see how kiting was a problem. the fight we had last week, didnt have any claim issues, hate issues, or any strange issues that you guys keep speaking of. the only problem we had was a tank r0'ing sometimes.

do you guys take any outside alliances or anything? maybe it has to deal with the setup and alliance.