COR Slug Shot damage?

[1postwonder]

I'm pulling Wajoam Tigers right now with RNG sub and I take, at max, two hits getting back to camp. If I think they're too far out I simply call my tank to run out a bit and grab it as it catches up. I don't think Ranger sub is gimp at all, it's just not as efficient for pulling fast running mobs which happens how often through the course of 1-75? I'll take my enhanced Rapid Shot, Range Acc+3 and Marksmenship Skill+5 over the ability to save my White Mage a little curing (ie: his job) and an extra Hawkers Knife.

I'm completely with Aurik though about leveling in ToAU zones. So many of these mobs seem to have lower defence or lower HP compared to their original counterparts. Add onto that the 15% exp bonus for doing nothing but collecting IS and I'm not leaving. I've even been scouting and discussing exp zones with Wafik over AIM just so I don't have to. After just two parties I'm already 25% of the way to my Walahra Turban and I haven't earned a single merit out here with the other billion people at imps.

Ever notice how COR can't use hawker's knifes 8)

[aurik]

I'm pulling Wajoam Tigers right now with RNG sub and I take, at max, two hits getting back to camp. If I think they're too far out I simply call my tank to run out a bit and grab it as it catches up. I don't think Ranger sub is gimp at all, it's just not as efficient for pulling fast running mobs which happens how often through the course of 1-75? I'll take my enhanced Rapid Shot, Range Acc+3 and Marksmenship Skill+5 over the ability to save my White Mage a little curing (ie: his job) and an extra Hawkers Knife.

I'm completely with Aurik though about leveling in ToAU zones. So many of these mobs seem to have lower defence or lower HP compared to their original counterparts. Add onto that the 15% exp bonus for doing nothing but collecting IS and I'm not leaving. I've even been scouting and discussing exp zones with Wafik over AIM just so I don't have to. After just two parties I'm already 25% of the way to my Walahra Turban and I haven't earned a single merit out here with the other billion people at imps.

Ever notice how COR can't use hawker's knifes 8)

Thank you for your one post. s/hawker/archer/g; doesn't make a difference.

[Dein]

If COR is going to be a substitute for BRD in 4 melee merit PTs you sure as hell are going to have to start subbing WHM or else your RDM is going to need a four minute convert timer or your melees are going to need Raise 1.

Corsair is never, ever, ever, ever going to replace Bard in anything.

Crit roll + Double attack roll seems like it could stand toe to toe with double minuets. Are the rolls really that weak?

Russta said that because Bard gets 2 things Corsair doesn't, sleep spells and dispel. Rolls tend to be situational, fighter's roll makes a big difference with a war and rogue's roll makes a big difference with a thf. The only roll I'd call weak is Chaos Roll.

[Eternus]

If COR is going to be a substitute for BRD in 4 melee merit PTs you sure as hell are going to have to start subbing WHM or else your RDM is going to need a four minute convert timer or your melees are going to need Raise 1.

Corsair is never, ever, ever, ever going to replace Bard in anything.

Crit roll + Double attack roll seems like it could stand toe to toe with double minuets. Are the rolls really that weak?

Russta said that because Bard gets 2 things Corsair doesn't, sleep spells and dispel. Rolls tend to be situational, fighter's roll makes a big difference with a war and rogue's roll makes a big difference with a thf.

Nah pretty sure his case was for Carnage Elegy lol. COR has no debuffs like that. COR will take up a DD slot... it can't crowd control like BRD at all. Can do decent DD and give some nice buffs though.

[Lordwafik]

If COR is going to be a substitute for BRD in 4 melee merit PTs you sure as hell are going to have to start subbing WHM or else your RDM is going to need a four minute convert timer or your melees are going to need Raise 1.

Corsair is never, ever, ever, ever going to replace Bard in anything.

Crit roll + Double attack roll seems like it could stand toe to toe with double minuets. Are the rolls really that weak?

Never think of the cor as BRD, think of them as a support DD, someone to fill a DD spot, while buffing people. Cor/whm in a exp pt = useless crap.

[Demetrios]

If COR is going to be a substitute for BRD in 4 melee merit PTs you sure as hell are going to have to start subbing WHM or else your RDM is going to need a four minute convert timer or your melees are going to need Raise 1.

Corsair is never, ever, ever, ever going to replace Bard in anything.

Crit roll + Double attack roll seems like it could stand toe to toe with double minuets. Are the rolls really that weak?

Never think of the cor as BRD, think of them as a support DD, someone to fill a DD spot, while buffing people. Cor/whm in a exp pt = useless crap.

Earth shot with Hojo: Ni would be just as strong as Carnage elegy or no? The only thing a COR can't do is sleep if earth shot and two offensive melee rolls aren't as weak people are making them out to be.

I wonder how much damage I could put out on BRD if I subbed WAR and used Joyuse. My guess is I could probably put out similar numbers to COR =/. Maybe COR can do RNG damage, but the highest damage ammo they can use is iron (55 base damage vs 81 on silver.)

[aurik]

If COR is going to be a substitute for BRD in 4 melee merit PTs you sure as hell are going to have to start subbing WHM or else your RDM is going to need a four minute convert timer or your melees are going to need Raise 1.

Corsair is never, ever, ever, ever going to replace Bard in anything.

Crit roll + Double attack roll seems like it could stand toe to toe with double minuets. Are the rolls really that weak?

Never think of the cor as BRD, think of them as a support DD, someone to fill a DD spot, while buffing people. Cor/whm in a exp pt = useless crap.

Earth shot with Hojo: Ni would be just as strong as Carnage elegy or no? The only thing a COR can't do is sleep if earth shot and two offensive melee rolls aren't as weak people are making them out to be.

I wonder how much damage I could put out on BRD if I subbed WAR and used Joyuse. My guess is I could probably put out similar numbers to COR =/. Maybe COR can do RNG damage, but the highest damage ammo they can use is iron (55 base damage vs 81 on silver.)

You'd lose a ton of damage while singing long songs. Cor rolls are very fast, allowing them to deal decent damage while buffing the melee and enhancing xp. But Cor can't sleep, can't elegy, and their refreshga is weak unless they get lucky or have a smn in party.

[Lordwafik]

You wont be doing corsair damage, because bard simply wasnt built like that. Bard was built for buffing/magery, corsair was built for buffing/damage. Look at the gear selection. Notice how bard's gear selection stops being more melee and there's much more mage options @ 75? And find for me some corsair mage gear ;p there's isnt unless it's one of those "Set" job lists, or a "all jobs" item.

Corsair was built to damage. It doesnt cast spells, all the things it does are job abilities. They have frigging guns dunno how much more you can get.

Im guessing the only reason you think this is because you havent seen COR in action, but when you start getting corsairs in your parties, you'll see how they are a DD slot and not a mage slot.

[Demetrios]

[quote=aurik]

If COR is going to be a substitute for BRD in 4 melee merit PTs you sure as hell are going to have to start subbing WHM or else your RDM is going to need a four minute convert timer or your melees are going to need Raise 1.

Corsair is never, ever, ever, ever going to replace Bard in anything.

Crit roll + Double attack roll seems like it could stand toe to toe with double minuets. Are the rolls really that weak?

Never think of the cor as BRD, think of them as a support DD, someone to fill a DD spot, while buffing people. Cor/whm in a exp pt = useless crap.

Earth shot with Hojo: Ni would be just as strong as Carnage elegy or no? The only thing a COR can't do is sleep if earth shot and two offensive melee rolls aren't as weak people are making them out to be.

I wonder how much damage I could put out on BRD if I subbed WAR and used Joyuse. My guess is I could probably put out similar numbers to COR =/. Maybe COR can do RNG damage, but the highest damage ammo they can use is iron (55 base damage vs 81 on silver.)

You'd lose a ton of damage while singing long songs. Cor rolls are very fast, allowing them to deal decent damage while buffing the melee and enhancing xp. But Cor can't sleep, can't elegy, and their refreshga is weak unless they get lucky or have a smn in party.[/quote:da085]

From my experience in a 4 melee merit PT the RDM doesn't need ballad, especially if he has Dalmatica + AF2 hat. You can't elegy, but earth shot adds 50%? potency to slow, which seems to give the same result as a BRD. You're only missing sleep, which isn't all that important when mobs die in 30 seconds.

You wont be doing corsair damage, because bard simply wasnt built like that. Bard was built for buffing/magery, corsair was built for buffing/damage. Look at the gear selection. Notice how bard's gear selection stops being more melee and there's much more mage options @ 75? And find for me some corsair mage gear ;p there's isnt unless it's one of those "Set" job lists, or a "all jobs" item.

Corsair was built to damage. It doesnt cast spells, all the things it does are job abilities. They have frigging guns dunno how much more you can get.

Im guessing the only reason you think this is because you havent seen COR in action, but when you start getting corsairs in your parties, you'll see how they are a DD slot and not a mage slot.

If we want to go by gear deciding what BRD can do, I contend that BRD was ment to be a tank. Umbra cape, D ring, Jelly ring, Earth staff and most EXP mobs will hit me for 80ish damage. Fafnir will hit me for 100-150.

BRD can wear full god armor and hecatomb. BRD can wear Alky, sea gorgets, suppa, brutal earring, dusk, speed belt, warwolf, snipers, flame rings, rajas, etc... all of the shit my NIN uses. I really do think BRD/WAR could put out good damage Vorpals lol. However I still sub WHM for Curaga II =/.

[Lordwafik]

If we want to go by gear deciding what BRD can do, I contend that BRD was ment to be a tank. Umbra cape, D ring, Jelly ring, Earth staff and most EXP mobs will hit me for 80ish damage. Fafnir will hit me for 100-150.

BRD can wear full god armor. BRD can wear Alky, sea gorgets, suppa, brutal earring, dusk, speed belt, warwolf, snipers, flame rings, rajas, etc... all of the shit my NIN uses. I really do think BRD/WAR could put out good damage Vorpals lol. However I still sub WHM for Curaga II =/.

So can a RDM, but do you see them meleeing? no.

What im saying is corsairs gear is ONLY melee, there's not mage gear unless it's jobsets(like crimson) or "all jobs"(like rings).

[Raineer]

Corsair should be the 4th melee in a 4 melee party, or the 2nd shooter on the grassy knoll.

[Septimus]

From my experience in a 4 melee merit PT the RDM doesn't need ballad, especially if he has Dalmatica + AF2 hat. You can't elegy, but earth shot adds 50%? potency to slow, which seems to give the same result as a BRD. You're only missing sleep, which isn't all that important when mobs die in 30 seconds.

How many Red Mages have both Dalmatica and Duelist's Chapeau though? Maybe I am used to people who have trouble keeping shadows up, but I really wouldn't want to do a burn as the only person who can cast cure without some extra ballad/refresh love.

[Nagamaki]

Quick Draw is a 3minute, can't exactly use it every mob in a merit PT, and I don't know how you pull for merits if sleep "isn't all that important".

The main issues with COR as DD comes at endgame, not mid-level. Weapon skill levels remain pretty close even between A and E until you get past the 60s, and then the B skill combined with lack of stacked acc bonuses (you get 2 /RNG, but RNG main gets a lot more) and lack of some key gear will really start to show, given the fact that Slug Shot isn't exactly the most accurate WS ever. What they do with AF could help offset these things, but its just not there right now.

I still very much look forward to seeing COR's role in merit endgame and HNM type situations, people just have to be aware that something working in the 50-60s doesn't mean it'll necessarily work at 75.

[Demetrios]

If we want to go by gear deciding what BRD can do, I contend that BRD was ment to be a tank. Umbra cape, D ring, Jelly ring, Earth staff and most EXP mobs will hit me for 80ish damage. Fafnir will hit me for 100-150.

BRD can wear full god armor. BRD can wear Alky, sea gorgets, suppa, brutal earring, dusk, speed belt, warwolf, snipers, flame rings, rajas, etc... all of the shit my NIN uses. I really do think BRD/WAR could put out good damage Vorpals lol. However I still sub WHM for Curaga II =/.

So can a RDM, but do you see them meleeing? no.

What im saying is corsairs gear is ONLY melee, there's not mage gear unless it's jobsets(like crimson) or "all jobs"(like rings).

I guess we'll see once more are 75 and we're able to merit with them. As it stands you need two rather rare jobs to have an ideal merit PT, complmententing BRD rather than replacing it makes it makes the ideal epeen WS PT require 3 rare jobs D: .

[aurik]

If we want to go by gear deciding what BRD can do, I contend that BRD was ment to be a tank. Umbra cape, D ring, Jelly ring, Earth staff and most EXP mobs will hit me for 80ish damage. Fafnir will hit me for 100-150.

BRD can wear full god armor. BRD can wear Alky, sea gorgets, suppa, brutal earring, dusk, speed belt, warwolf, snipers, flame rings, rajas, etc... all of the shit my NIN uses. I really do think BRD/WAR could put out good damage Vorpals lol. However I still sub WHM for Curaga II =/.

So can a RDM, but do you see them meleeing? no.

What im saying is corsairs gear is ONLY melee, there's not mage gear unless it's jobsets(like crimson) or "all jobs"(like rings).

I guess we'll see once more are 75 and we're able to merit with them. As it stands you need two rather rare jobs to have an ideal merit PT, complmententing BRD rather than replacing it makes it makes the ideal epeen WS PT require 3 rare jobs D: .

Thats why you dangle leet itamz as a carrot to your corsairs just like people do with bards, and thus force them to xp with you.

[Norelco]

Perhaps the full scope of the COR job will be revealed when SE releases to us various Hexaguns.

[Lordwafik]

from what i've noticed, corsairs make other jobs worthy of invites.

Need heals but dont have a 2nd/backup healer, but there's a smn seeking? Stick evoker's roll on.

Inviting thief + cor = critical hits up for everyone. BLM = Magic attack bonus, etc etc

also a lot of the "useless" rolls that arent used in exp, will make them more viable for HNM. Hitting for 0 on that high defence NM? Invite a DRK + COR for chaos roll. Dont wanna feed that NM too much TP? Invite a monk + cor for Something roll , forgot the name but it's +Subtle Blow for all. Shitty tanks for fafnir who cant cast between hits? Invite BRD + COR for -spellcast interrupt. Etc etc, the uses are endless, and it makes every job worthy of an invite.

[Genosync]

I want to sub RNG, but Razz won't let me ;; However, taking that extra damage takes MP out of the pt and risks death when you have long pulls, and therefore is unjustified to me. Meh.

2x Corsair, PLD, BLU, BLM, RDM after LV54-57(Whatever your cor gets slug at) is a force to be reckoned with. Try it, and you'll be amazed at how you can adjust to almost any camp and put up insane numbers.

Corsair replaces Bard, but only if there's two in the PT and it's after LV55~.

[Dank]

I think Wafik hit it on the head there. I was thinking the same way, but I think alot of people were too dense to put together the thing they said at the conference where they released ToAU with COR's abilities. SE said they were wanting to make all jobs more welcome in exp, and make normal party setups more inviting than just doing burn parties

[aurik]

Seeing how much crit+ rogue added to my crit rate, I'm very interested in seeing how strong the subtle blow+ roll is.

I already have +45 subtle blow at peak, and even when soloing T-VT mobs, things rarely get more than 2-3 WS. If I could get that to +60-70 subtle blow...wow...