COR Slug Shot damage?

[Genosync]

All rolls are percentage based, meaning as you level higher, they're going to do more and more, unlike Bard songs.

A lucky roll would probably, like other rolls of its same nature, add 11-12% to your subtle blow, aka not enough to go crazy about.

[aurik]

All rolls are percentage based, meaning as you level higher, they're going to do more and more, unlike Bard songs.

A lucky roll would probably, like other rolls of its same nature, add 11-12% to your subtle blow, aka not enough to go crazy about.

The conceptual problem with "all rolls are percentage based" is, other jobs get zero subtle blow naturally, just like other jobs get zero double attack. Yet does War roll on a drk/thf give them double attack? I think that's the case...

I'd like to test how much subtle blow+ it actually gives. On a lucky roll, with mnk in party, is +15 unreasonable? I mean, by itself +15 is pretty crappy. But +15 on top of +45 is pretty hot, especially if you're the only person giving the mob TP...

[Genosync]

All rolls are percentage based, meaning as you level higher, they're going to do more and more, unlike Bard songs.

A lucky roll would probably, like other rolls of its same nature, add 11-12% to your subtle blow, aka not enough to go crazy about.

The conceptual problem with "all rolls are percentage based" is, other jobs get zero subtle blow naturally, just like other jobs get zero double attack. Yet does War roll on a drk/thf give them double attack? I think that's the case...

I'd like to test how much subtle blow+ it actually gives. On a lucky roll, with mnk in party, is +15 unreasonable? I mean, by itself +15 is pretty crappy. But +15 on top of +45 is pretty hot, especially if you're the only person giving the mob TP...

People with none of the trait probably get shit for it. I tried fighter's roll once, and got lucky roll, and didn't double attack but one time that whole 5 minute span. In which I meleed like old school RNG and was loving it, but angry that double attack didn't proc.

Moral of the Story: They're percentage based, or worth nothing at all if you don't have the stat in your job.

[aurik]

All rolls are percentage based, meaning as you level higher, they're going to do more and more, unlike Bard songs.

A lucky roll would probably, like other rolls of its same nature, add 11-12% to your subtle blow, aka not enough to go crazy about.

The conceptual problem with "all rolls are percentage based" is, other jobs get zero subtle blow naturally, just like other jobs get zero double attack. Yet does War roll on a drk/thf give them double attack? I think that's the case...

I'd like to test how much subtle blow+ it actually gives. On a lucky roll, with mnk in party, is +15 unreasonable? I mean, by itself +15 is pretty crappy. But +15 on top of +45 is pretty hot, especially if you're the only person giving the mob TP...

People with none of the trait probably get shit for it. I tried fighter's roll once, and got lucky roll, and didn't double attack but one time that whole 5 minute span. In which I meleed like old school RNG and was loving it, but angry that double attack didn't proc.

Moral of the Story: They're percentage based, or worth nothing at all if you don't have the stat in your job.

Wow, that's absolute trash if true...

[Nagamaki]

For Monk's Roll to really be useful, it'll need to have a pretty high value, something like 25 ish doesn't seem that unreasonable considering that's the base amount a 75 MNK gets (naked). Subtle Blow is great for soloing hard stuff, but for something like a melee PT in a Fafnir ally, it'll need to be really potent to be worth using over attack up, crit up and so on.

Subtle Blow is actually extremely easy to test for direct numeric value, guess I'll ask one of the people in my LS levelling COR to go out and test it with me as MNK and then with me as THF.

*edit* afkd before posting, guess that info on Fighter's Roll is more incentive to go test it out, then I can compare the effect on MNK with Subtle Blow 25 to 50 and on THF without any or with gear/sj effects.

[Lordwafik]

they proc ok if you dont have the stat in your job, aslong as you have that person in your party. I got double attacks a few times while I was in a pt with a war, but, even though I dont have "enhanced crits" on my thief, everyone in the pt's crit hit rate was great. Sometimes it felt like mighty strikes.

[Machazareel]

Does the effect carry over to weaponskills? I can't help but think it could be pretty nice for crit-type weaponskills like Rampage and Jin.

[aurik]

Base Subtle on 75mnk is +20 btw. That may affect your testing.

Edit:
While this isn't conclusive, I think rogues roll does carry over to WS crit rate. Our war during my pt with a Cor at 63 busted out a whole boatload of 1000+ rampages. Seriously sick damage.

[Russta]

I'd like to test how much subtle blow+ it actually gives. On a lucky roll, with mnk in party, is +15 unreasonable? I mean, by itself +15 is pretty crappy. But +15 on top of +45 is pretty hot, especially if you're the only person giving the mob TP...

I don't have numbers to give you but Monk's Roll is so good with a Monk in the party that I always keep it on. The difference in how much fewer TP moves the mob does with a NIN, MNK, COR and a BLU hitting it is immense. I first started doing it when we were fighting Goblins outside Ifrits. We were dual boxing a 75 Bard for that party and basically had what I listed above and another BLU whaling on it. In desperation to keep the amount of TP moves down I used it and haven't looked back.

I'm really eager to try MNK, MNK, MNK, COR, RDM, BRD in KRT at 75 keeping Subtle Blow and EXP Bonus up all the time.

People with none of the trait probably get shit for it. I tried fighter's roll once, and got lucky roll, and didn't double attack but one time that whole 5 minute span. In which I meleed like old school RNG and was loving it, but angry that double attack didn't proc.

Moral of the Story: They're percentage based, or worth nothing at all if you don't have the stat in your job.

I don't think that's entirely true. Again, no numbers, but my experience of Double Attack procing as I'm doubling-up or running in or out to do rolls has seemed pretty impressive and we've never had a WAR with us. Add to that rolling XI on Samurai's Roll is Store TP+35 without a SAM and.... yeah.

[aurik]

I'd like to test how much subtle blow+ it actually gives. On a lucky roll, with mnk in party, is +15 unreasonable? I mean, by itself +15 is pretty crappy. But +15 on top of +45 is pretty hot, especially if you're the only person giving the mob TP...

I don't have numbers to give you but Monk's Roll is so good with a Monk in the party that I always keep it on. The difference in how much fewer TP moves the mob does with a NIN, MNK, COR and a BLU hitting it is immense. I first started doing it when we were fighting Goblins outside Ifrits. We were dual boxing a 75 Bard for that party and basically had what I listed above and another BLU whaling on it. In desperation to keep the amount of TP moves down I used it and haven't looked back.

I'm really eager to try MNK, MNK, MNK, COR, RDM, BRD in KRT at 75 keeping Subtle Blow and EXP Bonus up all the time.

People with none of the trait probably get shit for it. I tried fighter's roll once, and got lucky roll, and didn't double attack but one time that whole 5 minute span. In which I meleed like old school RNG and was loving it, but angry that double attack didn't proc.

Moral of the Story: They're percentage based, or worth nothing at all if you don't have the stat in your job.

I don't think that's entirely true. Again, no numbers, but my experience of Double Attack procing as I'm doubling-up or running in or out to do rolls has seemed pretty impressive and we've never had a WAR with us. Add to that rolling XI on Samurai's Roll is Store TP+35 without a SAM and.... yeah.

STP+35...that's hot!
Think Samurais in SB builds will be getting 25% TP per swing?

I wonder what the cap is on Subtle Blow, because if I can get an additional +35 (bringing me up to +80), I'll be giving the mob only 1.5 TP per hit.

[Nagamaki]

I did some quick testing with COR friend and looks like the SB is pretty potent. I checked my numbers (was getting the 25 from an old thread) and yeah MNK base is 20, probably messed it up then because of Rajas dual effect.

I used Tundra Tigers as test subjects and did some comparisons. Using Kirin's Pole, mob base TP gain per hit is 13.25 (tested as WHM without any SB). As MNK/BST without SB gear, that amount was 10.6 (80% of the base amount, so 20 SB). Still as MNK/BST but wearing +25SB (BB, AFII head hands legs, rajas) TP per hit was 7.3 (55% of base amount so numbers still add up).

The COR in this case was lv48, with me on MNK75. A roll of 8 (not the lucky roll) resulted in 8 TP per hit naked (40SB), and with +25 SB gear it was 6.6 (50SB). That made it pretty clear there is a cap of 50 on Subtle Blow, since the SB number without gear went from 20 to 40 and with gear it went from 45 to 50 only. Second roll test got an 11, which made the cap even more obvious. Naked MNK with the roll TP per hit was 6.6 and still 6.6 with gear, meaning a roll of 11 with a MNK in party is at least +30 SB and possibly more.

I didn't have time to test with rolls as THF or WHM to see the effect without a MNK in PT or on jobs without natural SB. I did the tests pretty fast so I can't rule out the possibility that some numbers were off, but they seem to add up.

So in practice, this roll allows MNK to hit 50% SB without having to wear much of any SB gear, or with no SB gear at all on a good roll (even for a MNK without Black Belt or Rajas). With a MNK in PT it'll cap out a NIN's SB too. The effectiveness of the roll for jobs without any SB or without a MNK in PT remains unknown though, I'll have to test it later, I just snuck this test in between post maintenance stuff.

[Tape]

Just hit 65.

Pic sucks cuz its night time and all drabby... but atleast the gun looks cool.

http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/464/hexagun4pn.jpg

[Russta]

Hey, your Slug Shot missed.

[Tape]

Hey, your Slug Shot missed.

LOL... yeah... with Sharpshot on... and my first one too.

Isn't that how it always works though. You get something new and the first time you use it you miss.

Lordwafik uses Mercy Stroke.
Lordwafik misses the Tim Tom Tat.

[Genosync]

I was going to get 65 today, until some fag decided to go to Dynamis.

Oh well. At least I know it looks cool now.

[Tape]

Not impressed at all.

What's the point of a gun with 6 barrels if you only shoot on of one everytime. Even my Quick Draw is doing less damage. Not sure if its more potent though.

[Eckskalibur]

Was just reading through the thread and noticed a few things.

Rogue's Roll does affect Weapon Skills. ( Crit hit rate ) Every Warrior I have partied with especially.. Comments on their Rampage damage being noticeably higher.

I had a static for a few levels.. Was something like BRD COR BLU NIN MNK RDM. Without a Warrior.. everyone commented that the Double Attack bonus was about the equivalent of a Brutal Earring. Which isn't shabby.. And lately I've been partying with a bunch of Ridill WARs that really love the double attack and the critical hit rate bonus. It's a pretty significant increase.

As far as not having Double Attack.. and actually getting it. I'm pretty sure when I was leveling in Kuftal that our THF was getting some nice double attacks.. and he was THF/NIN. So I don't think Rolls just enhance abilities that you have. I think they give it to you as well. So I think that negates that all Rolls are completely % based. Rolls like Hunter's/Chaos will obviously be % based. But I'm not sure about Fighter's Roll.

I haven't played with the Subtle Blow roll much. Maybe sometime in the next day or so I will get some monks together and go visit KRT.

I'm looking forward to testing a lot of the other Rolls in end game situations. i.e. Magic Accuracy/Magic Attk. Bonus for BLM. Magic Defense for Tank Party. etc.

[Tape]

gatdamn thing made me double post.

[Septimus]

It would be interesting to see how the MNK and SAM rolls will influence how HNMs are fought. Make a party of MNK, SAM, BRD, COR with two other heavy DDs and let them go to town. Throw in some BLUs in the alliance for Lowing, feather tickle, and light of penance and you are cooking with gas.

[Priran]

Lordwafik uses Mercy Stroke.
Lordwafik misses the Aht Urhgan Attercop.

fixed