FFXI: An Examination

[rahskala]

I'm trying to provide some constructive feedback, so don't take this too personally, but that last paragraph is pretty hostile and doesn't help affirm the points you're trying to make at all. Also, your assertion in the second-to-last paragraph is (IMO) unfounded, not only because SE has never said that they can't do what you suggest because of PS2 limitations, but also because none of us really know how the game is coded and there very well could be reasons they can't do everything.

[AriaEminence]

http://www.devmaster.net/articles/mmorp ... /part5.php

As mentioned in the previous parts of this article, the players are usually unhappy with any changes, unless of course, the change simplifies things or makes things easier to do. But whenever the change requires them to change their strategies, there is widespread complaint, cries that the developers don't listen and want to ruin the game, threats to leave the game and so on. The mere announcement of future changes makes them very nervous, and they usually don't bother to read the full announcement, but rather immediately jump to [wrong] conclusions. There are, of course, some players that do like changes, and there are some players that don't care. But the bulk of the replies to any "future change announcement" is usually "Omg omg teh devs want to ruin teh game!11!!". Often times we just gave up modifying some stuff that we believed would be good for the game, but the players cried about it.

While the players usually play the game more than we do, most of them only care for their best interest. It is up to an objective 3rd-party to carefully examine the implications of any game system modification. That 3rd party is us, the developers, who unlike what some players think, want only the best for the game. It takes someone with a global vision of the entire project to decide what would make the game better for everyone.

A while ago, I was reading an article written by some web-based MMORPG developer who was dealing with similar issues. I can't find the URL to that article (I did try to google for some keywords, with no success). Basically what the author said was that after a while they just ignored the complaints and went forward with the implementation of those changes. And with time, the players actually liked those changes, despite of their initial overreaction. Reading that article was very informative and encouraging to me, so I vowed to do things in a different way from now on.

I read that a long time ago, a really good read.

[Vinen]

Nice wall-o-text from an Armchair designer.

I agree, and is that possibly a Phantasy Star 4 avatar you're using.. or am I mistaken?

Luc, bearer of the Rune of True Wind from Suikoden Series.

Playable character in 1 and 2, primary villian of 3... I just killed the story!

[Zigma]

i didn't read much of what you wrote but i'll contribute to your cause and send it.

[Airshort7]

i didn't read much of what you wrote but i'll contribute to your cause and send it.

Now you're hogging the wall-of-text too?

[Zigma]

i didn't read much of what you wrote but i'll contribute to your cause and send it.

Now you're hogging the wall-of-text too?

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owell

[Correction]

http://www.devmaster.net/articles/mmorp ... /part5.php

As mentioned in the previous parts of this article, the players are usually unhappy with any changes, unless of course, the change simplifies things or makes things easier to do. But whenever the change requires them to change their strategies, there is widespread complaint, cries that the developers don't listen and want to ruin the game, threats to leave the game and so on. The mere announcement of future changes makes them very nervous, and they usually don't bother to read the full announcement, but rather immediately jump to [wrong] conclusions. There are, of course, some players that do like changes, and there are some players that don't care. But the bulk of the replies to any "future change announcement" is usually "Omg omg teh devs want to ruin teh game!11!!". Often times we just gave up modifying some stuff that we believed would be good for the game, but the players cried about it.

While the players usually play the game more than we do, most of them only care for their best interest. It is up to an objective 3rd-party to carefully examine the implications of any game system modification. That 3rd party is us, the developers, who unlike what some players think, want only the best for the game. It takes someone with a global vision of the entire project to decide what would make the game better for everyone.

A while ago, I was reading an article written by some web-based MMORPG developer who was dealing with similar issues. I can't find the URL to that article (I did try to google for some keywords, with no success). Basically what the author said was that after a while they just ignored the complaints and went forward with the implementation of those changes. And with time, the players actually liked those changes, despite of their initial overreaction. Reading that article was very informative and encouraging to me, so I vowed to do things in a different way from now on.

The OP is about itemization, not game mechanics. Sure, we all want 2-handed weapons fixed and the emo-LOLjos want their weaponskills to be worth a damn. But I think people would be happier if item progression happened AT ALL in FFXI. Right now all FFXI is doing is giving us items that do not improve on existing items. They like it when people have to change gear in EVERY macro they use ingame. They don't understand that a player would willingly dump a kaiser cuirass if they could get better equipment from a different mob. They don't care that half the server is in dragon's aery every night for a sword, or in behemoth's dominion for a ring, or sorrow's valley for...well, for the egg I guess.

Take any job from 1-75 and look at the way their equipment gets upgraded (lol leaping boots). Now take that job into endgame activity and do the subtractions of what actual upgrades exist. FFXI has ZERO concept of 'the higher your level, the better your gear' and is on record as having been 'surprised at the unexpected influence of level 75 jobs on the game balance.' Rather, they follow the 'The more money you pay into monthly subscriptions, the more chances you have at maybe claming that mob again.'

I hate to bring it up because I know it'll go downhill from here, but WoW's itemization is 10x more rational than FFXI. Instance A's drops makes Instance B's drops easier to get, and when you've got both of those instances on farm status, Instance C's loot replaces all your current gear and makes you even more powerful. THAT is correct itemization, not 'oh boy another piece of macro gear' that turns anybody with more than 1 level 75 job into a fucking packrat in this game (sup elemental staves).

FFXI is quickly becoming Ragnarok Online, where so far the only items people seem to ENJOY and HAVE FUN acquiring are cute hats. Everything else is a nerve-wracking chore full of cheating and RMT.

[FFXIFlux]

Your conclusion of paragraph 3 about RMT is just blatently wrong. Every major MMORPG has RMT. Go check IGN.

The main problem with FFXI is obvious, they do not add content quickly enough. Lack of content means they have to make drops frustratingly rare. That doesn't generate RMTers however, what generates RMTers is an in-game economy working better than the US/China economy.

[Correction]

Your conclusion of paragraph 3 about RMT is just blatently wrong. Every major MMORPG has RMT. Go check IGN.

The main problem with FFXI is obvious, they do not add content quickly enough. Lack of content means they have to make drops frustratingly rare. That doesn't generate RMTers however, what generates RMTers is an in-game economy working better than the US/China economy.

The difference being that RMT can't cockblock you on other MMORPGs the way they can in FFXI. Been to sky lately? So how's that alternative to haidate working out for you? If the game hadn't stopped item progression there the problem wouldn't exist. Put items in the game that obsolete old ones and the RMT monopoly ends. That's the point.

[AriaEminence]

Well they had the perfect place to add better itemization.. it had difficult missions, required a ton of time, and required really good team work. Then they gave us weapons and torques........................................... ..........................

...............
........

[Miruka]

You say "Shinra" in reference to Byakko, Seiryu, Suzaku, and Genbu -- I believe it's "Shinjin", however.

Shijin

(well, 90% positive I remember that correctly)

[Elcura]

Nice wall-o-text from an Armchair designer.

I agree, and is that possibly a Phantasy Star 4 avatar you're using.. or am I mistaken?

Luc, bearer of the Rune of True Wind from Suikoden Series.

Playable character in 1 and 2, primary villian of 3... I just killed the story!

Luc owns, I still need to play Suikoden 3, stupid non-EU release =(

[edgarfigaro]

Well they had the perfect place to add better itemization.. it had difficult missions, required a ton of time, and required really good team work. Then they gave us weapons........................................... ..........................

...............
........

fixed

[Thalion]

Well they had the perfect place to add better itemization.. it had difficult missions, required a ton of time, and required really good team work. Then they gave us weapons and torques........................................... ..........................

...............
........

So true, Sea is such a waste.

[Epincus]

Very nice, I agree with most of the points in this piece. The only thing I disagree with is the introduction of new crafting materials to the game. That seems like something which would require careful thought and correct implementation (Two things SE excels at).

Instead, I would argue a better course of action would be to modify currently existing items. Almost everything 70+ has some form of stats on it, but almost all gear released towards the start of the game has none. The addition of stats to older equipment would be something which would surely devalue a number of NM drops such as O Kote, Leaping Boots, and Emperor's Hairpin.

[darkdeath]

LOL they already tried "devaluatng" the Boots and Emp pin, look what happened.. they ski high in price...

[Darus Grey]

I always liked FFXI's item progression over other MMOs.

This is one of the few MMOs that doesn't have huge mudflation problems after several years(like WoW will inevitably have, and EQ has had forever).

My only complaint would be that there needs to armor/weapons comparible to many of the old abjurations, only obtained elsewhere.

[Kurp]

LOL they already tried "devaluatng" the Boots and Emp pin, look what happened.. they ski high in price...

RMT stopped camping Emporer and Lizzie so anyone that isn't lazy as hell can go get them for free.

[darkdeath]

touche

[FFXIFlux]

Well they had the perfect place to add better itemization.. it had difficult missions, required a ton of time, and required really good team work. Then they gave us weapons and torques........................................... ..........................

...............
........

In the over 1 year it took for them to bring out CoP they gave us... Limbus which is 1 hour of raiding per week, some dynamis zones on the same lockout timer as existing dynamis which are never used, dragons which give 1 of the dozens of end-game linkshells a couple hours a week, and Sea which has almost no loot and popping the NMs which drop nothing worthwhile is a pain in the ass all so you can MAYBE pop AV which is borked anyway.

So... CoP gave us 1 hour of raiding per week with Limbus. Score.

A few months in and ToA has given us... well. 0 hours of end-game content. Double score!

The reason the drops on Kings and in Sea etc. are so fucked is because there is nothing else being introduced in the game for you to do once you beat them. So they gotta make shit like relics take forever to get.

People bag on Sage Sundi for lying about ToA being low level focused. How many hours per week has your end-game linkshells been spending raiding ToA? 1 or 2 linkshells per server will get Cerberus for an hour a week. Thats it, otherwise you're off leveling your low level jobs or something. Sounds like Sundi was right on the money so far. I should run my level 1 mule to Al Zabi to take part in the chocobo races.