Adjustments to Beseiged - 7/10/2006

[Tymon]

OMG a spelling mistake. 20 pages, GO!

Fixed because you're so stupid and made a run-on sentence.

+10 pages

[Xanthu]

The explanation is simple: Square wrote "overwhelms the processing power of many clients" when they meant to write "overwhelms the programming of the client".

That is definetly part of it, FFXI is obviously very innefficient on PCs. But what they're also saying is that because they have capped network bandwidth so low your computer doesn't GET the information to properly process anything either. They're rearranging deck chairs on the fucking titanic, patch the fucking whole in the side retards.

How dare you, that is a, terrible metaphor. This game isn't sinking, this game is soaring! If anything, they're rearranging the deck chairs on the Hindenburg!

Thanks Colbert

[shihei]

stfu you crybabies. i think besieged will be fucking hawt if its harder, it is way too easy as it is for good servers

i'm thinking.... who wants to start up a besieged onry LS on bahamut? we can call it "Yawn"! Lvl 75 only kthx

one thing i hate about besieged is there is no strategy...<3 the people who fight skeletons right next to everyone else who is fighting the easy stuff first like lamia's/merrow. . . dot dot fucking dot . . .

[Darm]

This sounds like a lot of fun, but as others have already said it's fairly difficult to coordinate strategy with 300 plus people and omnipresent lag. Here's hoping that they'll make invading beastmen lairs more rewarding, since as it is very few care enough to free prisoners/the astral candescene.

[niwaar]

Beseiged would be more fun if they upped the cap on IP or maybe made a MVP System

An MVP system where at the end of the week/month certain players were given Lieutenant status would be sick. Give them abilities to pump up everyone fighting around them, improve their JAs/spells to full aoe, or give them some nice "In besieged" latent crap. It'd make them the way the generals should have been, strong rallying points for the fight.

Also, yeah kicking out everyone below 60, or booting afk players would be nice :wink: I hate running over to help the stupid melee blm general and seeing a gang of afkers lounging at the spawn point.

Nah this would be too cool and that other "evil" competitor already has something like it.

You would think that they would implement something like this, to make participating routinely and doing well have a reward.

Someone mentioned removing all players below 50 to eliminate lag... Honestly, I believe they should add a 5 minute warning to "... are marching on Al Zahbi meet them in Wajaom". Give us the marching warning, then at 3-5 minutes from them entering give another warning, and clear the entire zone. They want people of all levels to "cooperate" and defend the city together. They wont put a minimum level to besieged, but they sure as hell can kick everyone out to whitegate and only those who wish to participate will reenter so you dont have 700 people in the zone with 400 of them afk.

[LD]

"Meh"

I just voiced my own opinion while summarizing this thread.

Catch the nuance.

[Russta]

Wow, as if 400-700 people are capable of cooperating and utilizing strategy...

This is exactly what I thought when reading it.

I don't get it, didn't we read that they know how laggy besieged is a few days on that 1up interview? If they've clearly acknowledged this how can they expect us to form strategy when everything is warping all over the place...

[Dustybrown]

Wow, as if 400-700 people are capable of cooperating and utilizing strategy...

I don't get it, didn't we read that they know how laggy besieged is a few days on that 1up interview? If they've clearly acknowledged this how can they expect us to form strategy when everything is warping all over the place...

By going out and buying better PC's/PS2's apparently. It's so simple, when you think about it.

[Khamsin]

It's not so much the warping around, its the timing that I'm worried about.

If the strategy is, say, an NM that has special traits or barriers or modes where you have to do different things to it at different times (e.g. wyrms that fly and land and can't be fought from behind, or like the mammets that can asbsorb physical or magical damage at different times, or something with a massive aoe like Gates of Hades that must be diligently stunned with an improvised stun order among all 100 BLMs there, etc.) then it'll be difficult because of the lag.

By the time you notice, say, that it put up physical damage absorption mode, and shout it to everyone, and people stop meleeing, it'll have switched modes again. Or you see this dragon on the ground, and do a WS that says "too far away" because its really in the air, you just didn't notice yet. Or someone accidentally spike flails it because on their screen, the dragon was still looking at them, when it really had already turned to someone else. Or it'll do a huge aoe and wipe people because the stun was 30 seconds behind.

That's why they need to fix lag before they worry about strategy and NMs.

[genome]

I think they added NMs just to make people that kept shouting "Mega Boss Where?" happy...
One nice change would have been to take away the points from anybody who Yawns or /randoms at the end, and redistribute those points.

My server hasn't lost yet, but I think the main problem for the ones that do is the lack of interest and the number of people afk. They should ask people if they want to partecipate in it when they zone in or when it starts, and push them to whitegate if they don't reply.

But mostly I hear when people lose they don't have 700 people in, so aside for maybe the extra lag, the problem is not as much the afk people or the low levels preventing higher levels from entering.

I have been stuck in Besiege as a low level before (warp after a PT, and my HP is in Al zabi), and had to make the best of it (you can exit going all around, but with fomors etc it can be dangerous).

A level 40 meleeing is not really leeching, because trust me he won't get any points by just missing. However, a level 40 or less curing, provoking etc can get full 700 points and be very valuable. Generals and players need cures all the times, and voking monsters away from generals rather than leaving them unclaimed or turned toward a general for a one-shot move (radiant breath etc) is very important.
Higher levels can get points by doing damage, lower levels can't, they have to use provoke, JAs that benefit the whole PT (e.g., low level COR rolls), and spam cures.

[rahskala]

Speculation: Maybe they could make the concept of leaving town and intercepting the forces in the field more viable?

BTW, George Foreman grills make awesome grilled cheese sandwiches.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...geForeman1.jpg

Discuss.

[ircgeek]

My server hasn't lost yet, but I think the main problem for the ones that do is the lack of interest and the number of people afk. They should ask people if they want to partecipate in it when they zone in or when it starts, and push them to whitegate if they don't reply.

We had 250 last week or so for Trolls, and last night/this morning we only had about 400, which is weird since the JP usually swarm the thing. Not sure if you were there, but it was Mamool Ja, and we lost two generals at once. I watched Zazarg attacking a Sapper, waiting for Mijin to kill him - it missed, but killed most everyone else.

Anyways, almost a loss for diabolos, but we ended up winning, but I wanted to say that low levels are actually doing more for Besieged than high levels. I love the constant whining about low levels leeching because I'm seeing way too many 300-400ish runs. Only time I see 700 now is during JP primetime, and generally only during the weekend.

Intercepting the forces outside Al Zahbi has two hitches: exp. loss and no real reward. They'd need to fix that before people would consider popping out there.

They also ought to make some of the forces stay back by the moat and such. Everyone waits for them to breach that first gate before attacking, and spreading people out to the moat area would help a little bit. Perhaps make the NMs stationary out there?

[Not Kuno]

A level 40 meleeing is not really leeching, because trust me he won't get any points by just missing.

Yes they will, they'll get max points. Ive been trapped in besieged before on my blu and I got 700 by just missing/doing some spells. Which is pretty funny cause on blm or smn I rarely ever get 700 points,

[Khamsin]

Intercepting the forces outside Al Zahbi has two hitches: exp. loss and no real reward. They'd need to fix that before people would consider popping out there.

The way I remember it, people did go out to intercept the forces during the first Besieged, and killed them all forcing a retreat before the official Besieged even began. They got bitched out for it, so they let them come to town so we can actually have a besieged.

People were already willing to go out there in the first place. Though I can imagine people might still get pissed off if they go out and force a retreat before Besieged begins, again, like they did when Besieged was first introduced.

[ircgeek]

Intercepting the forces outside Al Zahbi has two hitches: exp. loss and no real reward. They'd need to fix that before people would consider popping out there.

The way I remember it, people did go out to intercept the forces during the first Besieged, and killed them all forcing a retreat before the official Besieged even began. They got bitched out for it, so they let them come to town so we can actually have a besieged.

People were already willing to go out there in the first place. Though I can imagine people might still get pissed off if they go out and force a retreat before Besieged begins, again, like they did when Besieged was first introduced.

Yeah, but that was back when a slight breeze would knock over Besieged mobs. I can't even imagine trying to pull one mob out of that huge crowd of super mobs nowadays.

BTW, using magic does give you points, and so do popping random job abilities (I was getting 20 exp. per Corsair Roll). However, melees without a large amount of MP or Job Abilities to pop can only rely on hitting a mob for exp, which yes, is impossible in low levels. but for BUMs, they have plenty of spells to buff themselves/others, so they don't need to rely on damage to get exp. - not really fair to lump them in with other DDs in that argument.

[Sylvrdragon]

So they wanna make Besieged harder huh? I know why too... its because of the fucking level 40 PUPs and DRGs shouting "Yawn" after a fucking besieged when they didn't do a goddamned thing in the first place.

This shit pisses me off... once again, SE listens to the n00bs that don't know wtf they are talking about.

[BRP]

level 40 PUPs

This is myth.

[ircgeek]

I think it's too soon to assume it'll be horribly tougher. It seems like it'll be similar to the current system where eliminating the enemy general sginificantly increases the chance of retreat - perhaps defeating the NMs lowers the rest of the mobs' evasion, or causes them to be intimidated, or forces every afk player to HP.

I think there's plenty of ways this could help balance things out, and not necessarily make it tougher.

[Sixtail]

Besieged needs EXP loss and greater gains. The exp loss will make the under level 65 players run for the hills and punish anon/afk people for leeching/lagging while rewarding those who actively fight and force people to do more then stand around and spam Cure 1 on people for easy IP. Before you burn me at the stake, the exp loss would be much more heavy for those under level 65. Say..3-8k lost even WITH R2-R3. The above level 65 players would lose normal exp and those who are 70+ would have a chance to earn more exp and IP.

I'm serious, as long as they make it easy AND rewarding for people on low level jobs to show up and leech, people will keep doing so. You can make Besieged so hard that every 3rd mob is a KB and mobs are mini AV's but as there's no risk for those who can't do anything useful (No, spamming Cure 1-2 does not count) other then no or less IP, it will always remain laggy.

To those low levels who are nashing their teeth and even now pounding out on their keyboards "Omg u hi level eliest, stfu." remember, this is SE and you have nothing to worry about. If this was a SOE game, however...muahahaha.

[ircgeek]

Until Besieged attendance blows through the roof again, you can leave the underlevelled people alone. They're the ones keeping your generals alive and your Sanction bonus kicked in while the high levels trot off to their daily dose of windows for HNMs most of them will never claim.