All THF and /THF Dynamis?

[TsingTao]

Are you sure your BLMs aren't getting many killshots? In every dynamis shell I have ever been in, BLM is always one of the top kill-shot getting jobs. People didn't really seem to realize it until we had somebody record who got each kill shot on one of our Xarcbard runs. Unless you only have like 2 BLMs and no RDMs to handle sleeps, I can't imagine your BLMs not getting a lot of killshots...

We generally have 3-4 BLMs with at least that many RDMs (RDM almost always outnumbers BLM) covering the bulk of the Sleep work. The BLMs generally don't get the kill unless they're free to come back and nuke a PD or Invincibled mob. More often than not, though, the puller is off for more and the BLMs are waiting to do their thing.

I'll keep an eye out for who'd getting the kills, but we generally have a THF in every melee party. Some nights literally every party has TH2 plus some /THF. It's still a relatively young shell tho and we need to kill faster for more mobs in general.

I know it will get better...it's just a bit annoying.

[Coephoros]

One thing I have noticed though, is that when a single mob drops 4 currency, there's a THF in the PT, on the rare occasions when they drop 5 there's a THF with at least one TH+ item, and on the extremely rare occasions that they drop 6 there's a THF with both knife and gloves. I would be interested to know if others have noticed this as well. It leads me to assume there's a distinct difference between how TH and TH2 (the job traits) actually function, and that TH+ items only enhance the first one (the Lv15 trait).

I've always been oddly curious of the 4+ coin drop mobs, so I make a habit of checking which PT was the one who got the killing shot. Invariably, there's a THF in the PT who got killshot. I don't check TH2 vs TH3, but I'm quite certain that every 4+ coin drop since I've started paying attention was caused by a THF PT with kill.

[Jeryhn]

In my experience on Duke Berith, both times I saw the Chapeau drop from him (one to my friend and one to me), I had Blink-Skin-Phalanx up, ran up with my Pluto Staff as RDM/DRK, and did Weapon Bash > Souleater > Last Resort > Stun > Cure 4 on the tanking WAR pulling hate. Both times I did this, the Chapeau dropped.

Speculate away. Or not - Dynamis drops just seem to be fucktarded random. You have good days and bad.

[Raineer]

One note about "THF in the killing parties", it's been proven that Gilfinder doesn't work unless the THF actually does something to the mob. They can't just sit in the party and do nothing, they need to take action on every mob that's being killed. No reason to believe that TH is any different.

They need to do a /ra or Steal or something for TH to actually trigger, even a swing and a miss will work. It doesn't need to be a SATA for 1300 dmg. Food for thought for the folks that aren't having luck with it.

[ponskun]

I am in the same ls as hyjynx is, and usually 2box dynamis runs. My main is BLM and the second I play as THF. Always having both my characters in party, I send the THF out to RA stones and engage them for a few hits of actual damage (not hits for 0). Never seems we have a lack of currency dropping; singles/100's. AF on the other hand is utter bullshit. (No surprise there.) I have no clue what effect if any it has, but don't you just love placebos?

[Khamsin]

How exactly has moon phase been proven to affect drops, btw?

Is it:

full moon = bigger loot pool, thereby increasing the chances for everything to drop?

Or is it something like:

full moon = bigger loot pool, common items have higher chance to drop
new moon = smaller loot pool, rarer items have higher chance to drop

I wasn't able to find a link to any threads with the parsed info on it.

[Jeryhn]

I'm of the opinion that Full/New Moons are placebos for just about everything short of Fenrir's Bloodpacts.

For the record, most times I've seen good drops in my LS in Dynamis, it wasn't New or Full Moon.

[Hyjynx]

I am in the same ls as hyjynx is, and usually 2box dynamis runs. My main is BLM and the second I play as THF. Always having both my characters in party, I send the THF out to RA stones and engage them for a few hits of actual damage (not hits for 0). Never seems we have a lack of currency dropping; singles/100's. AF on the other hand is utter bullshit. (No surprise there.) I have no clue what effect if any it has, but don't you just love placebos?

Then again on my B-day Pons turned on his THF character's H4X module v.134 going all out.. and we ended up with this:



http://www.angryoaf.com/angryimages/...aycurrency.png

Dunno what he was doing in the BLM aly but he needs to keep doing it >_>

[Septimus]

Then again on my B-day Pons turned on his THF character's H4X module v.134 going all out.. and we ended up with this:



http://www.angryoaf.com/angryimages/...aycurrency.png

Dunno what he was doing in the BLM aly but he needs to keep doing it >_>

Shame those weren't coins or shells though...

[Hyjynx]

lol not really a shame since they were for me

But yea, we are doing Sandy today. We'll see if he can keep it up... else I'm gonna push for him to get kicked from the ls! lol

[Shuemue]

One note about "THF in the killing parties", it's been proven that Gilfinder doesn't work unless the THF actually does something to the mob. They can't just sit in the party and do nothing, they need to take action on every mob that's being killed. No reason to believe that TH is any different.

They need to do a /ra or Steal or something for TH to actually trigger, even a swing and a miss will work. It doesn't need to be a SATA for 1300 dmg. Food for thought for the folks that aren't having luck with it.

I concur with this also, after having yelled at thieves to 'STABZ FASTER!' when mobs are falling at their feet before they've had a chance to engage.

One idea I've had is for the thieves to sub BLM and toss out a sleepga every so often. It'll totally get resisted, but it'll get them on the hate list of more mobs when a timed Thundaga III volley goes off.

[Raineer]

One idea I've had is for the thieves to sub BLM and toss out a sleepga every so often. It'll totally get resisted, but it'll get them on the hate list of more mobs when a timed Thundaga III volley goes off.

Brilliance.

I was thinking just using lolcyclone instead of actual melee but yeah i guess that nasty side effect of waking mobs is no good :D

[Coephoros]

One idea I've had is for the thieves to sub BLM and toss out a sleepga every so often. It'll totally get resisted, but it'll get them on the hate list of more mobs when a timed Thundaga III volley goes off.

Screw that. Diaga ftw. Make things a bit more interesting.

[Shuemue]

One idea I've had is for the thieves to sub BLM and toss out a sleepga every so often. It'll totally get resisted, but it'll get them on the hate list of more mobs when a timed Thundaga III volley goes off.

Screw that. Diaga ftw. Make things a bit more interesting.

I'll start coming again if we Diaga every pull!

[Dezzimal]

In xarc on the NMs is a time when you definitely either want to get the thieves in the BLM party or actually go for theif killshots. It won't stop you from getting skunked though. For best results kill a lot of normal mobs too.

Question for wafik: how often do you go 0/15 on the Xarc NMs?

[Belladonna]

We use a shit ton of THFs and we're consistent, but probably not phenominal. We go into Northlands with 8-10 THFs (half of them TH3/4). If it's not an important run, everyone else except tanks will /thf. We put a THF in every kill party, almost always a TH4 with the BLMs. Our puller is TH4 but he usually can't be in ally.

After clearing Beauc (minus hydras and effigy), we seem to consistently get 4-6 AF. Our cities are great, anywhere from 8-20 AF, but who cares about cities. Xarc is pretty much the same, we have a hard time clearing our 6 AF ceiling. Nothing spectacular but never a disappointing run.

[chiz]

One thing I have noticed though, is that when a single mob drops 4 currency, there's a THF in the PT, on the rare occasions when they drop 5 there's a THF with at least one TH+ item, and on the extremely rare occasions that they drop 6 there's a THF with both knife and gloves. I would be interested to know if others have noticed this as well. It leads me to assume there's a distinct difference between how TH and TH2 (the job traits) actually function, and that TH+ items only enhance the first one (the Lv15 trait).

We've noticed this as well to some degree, however I think the maximum drop on Home City non-NM mobs is 4 coin + 1 af2/relic/junk synth material for a total of 5 drops. Personally I've felt for some time that TH2+1+1 doesn't just give a 2% bonus to TH2, but it actually gives you a higher flat drop % for rarer drops as well as an additional drop chance in the loot pool. For instance, Thf Knife would "unlock" the possibility for a 5th drop item, Thf knife + Ass. Armlets would open up the 6th drop item.

I know there's been tons of testing done on TH2-4 and I've found them to be somewhat conflicting. I read/heard of the thread where someone killed 1000 mobs and found drop % on w/e item to be @2% higher with TH4 vs. TH2, but I've also read tests on TH4 that indicate TH3 and TH4 unlock additional drop pool chances (ie. Rams in LaTheine and Konschtat). I guess in the end TH4 buys you peace of mind, people can down play the impact of TH all they want, but historically TH3 and now TH4 has provided our LS much better results when it comes down to rare drops.

We run our alliances the same way with 1 THF in each DD'ing PT, with the THFs with TH4 in the PTs that are most likely to get killshot (1 with the stronger BLMs, 1 with the Ridill WARs etc.) THF probably does need to be in the hate queue, and definitely has to be within "Experience Points Gained" range for TH to take effect. One of our TH4 THFs needs to leave early sometimes but stays logged in the zone, however, killshots by that PT generally suck after we're no longer in the vicinity of where the THF went afk.

Going back to the flat drop % increase for rare items, I look at it like a tiering system. With TH1 you might have a 1% chance, TH2 maybe 2%, TH3 10%, TH4 15%. Numbers are arbitrary, but reflective of the exponential benefits on rare drop items. This is much higher than the typical TH2+1% or TH2+2% many believe to be the case with T2+2, but from what I've seen the effect of TH3 and TH4 vs. TH2 on extremely rare drops seems to be much higher than just 2%.

For example, 5 of our 8 Ridills have dropped with TH4, 3 of 8 with TH3 (bulk of our Fafnir kills, at least 3:1 over TH4), 0 of 8 with TH0-TH2. The biggest thing I notice on Faf drops without any kind of TH is the absence of equipment drops. With TH2+ you're basically guaranteed one of the common r/ex items (Andvara, Hrotti, Aegis) but it really seems you only have a chance for Balmung and Ridill with TH3+.

For some items, like CoP 21 hour pop NMs, the difference seems to be even more profound. Stuff like Sirocco Kukri, Yinyang Robe, Resentment Cape, Biast's Robobard hat, etc. all seem to have near 100% drop rate with TH3 or TH4 and a much lower (maybe 10-20%?) drop chance without a THF and TH of any kind. I typically won't help camp a mob like that, but I'll surely take the 10-15 mins to port/outpost to that mob if a LS member has claim simply bc I'm confident they'll get the drop and won't have to waste any more time camping it.

[Coephoros]

Question for wafik: how often do you go 0/15 on the Xarc NMs?

Typically we get at least 1... and it's usually DRG. Last week, we got two (from the same trio of mobs). Most we've gotten from NMs is 4, if I remember correctly.

[chilicheese]

I think the first theory of "party effects drops" stems from the fact that you can only receive 6 total crystals from a mob. If the entire alliance effected drops you could see up to 18 crystals drop from a single mob, but 6 is the cap. Spread the thieves out and you should see fairly decent drops. I know when tank party somehow kills more often than not the drops suck...because no TH in that pt.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...afnirdrops.jpg

Tank PT kill. i call BS on all TH party distribution theories. I've done dynamis-xarc with 14ppl, no thieves, and gotten 4 pieces of AF2 and a 100coin. I've done it with 50 and gotten 0.

[Raineer]

I think the first theory of "party effects drops" stems from the fact that you can only receive 6 total crystals from a mob. If the entire alliance effected drops you could see up to 18 crystals drop from a single mob, but 6 is the cap. Spread the thieves out and you should see fairly decent drops. I know when tank party somehow kills more often than not the drops suck...because no TH in that pt.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...afnirdrops.jpg

Tank PT kill. i call BS on all TH party distribution theories. I've done dynamis-xarc with 14ppl, no thieves, and gotten 4 pieces of AF2 and a 100coin. I've done it with 50 and gotten 0.

because one kill proves it all, grats!