Windower Patch @ Aprox. 10 PM Tonight

[YetNever]

The Timestamp plugin does work, however it sends it to the server. Just check your temp files, the timestamps are still there.

[Raineer]

The Timestamp plugin does work, however it sends it to the server. Just check your temp files, the timestamps are still there.

Well, "sends to the server" I think is inaccurate. t's readable by the server, but then they'd have to have a reason for looking.

Minor correction.

[Khamsin]

scan it yourself slut

http://virusscan.jotti.org/

Since when are a few lines of code that can report keyboard entries and sent to a URL noticable?

That online shit doesnt really work for programs like these.

Not to mention that the good ffxi trojans don't log keystrokes..

Your password is stored 4 places plain text in polcore.dll..

Nope.

I bet you're soo stupid.... you got some hex editor or something and found the actual polcore.dll on your hard drive and searched that file for your password.

Of course you didn't find it! I must be wrong.. I must be such a moron!

Fucking eurotrash.

I haven't looked myself, but you did say it was stored in plain text. If he couldn't find his password with a simple hex editor (or even notepad, in among the gibberish), then its not stored in plain text. Maybe its still unencrypted and easy to find (stored as binary rather than ascii, for example), but not "plain text".

Unless you consider plain text to be anything that anyone can make a 30 second program to read through the file and locate your password and present it in plain text without decryption.

[Sonomaa]

dont post a link to timestamp, its shown to be too naughty and gets the ban on, so just leave it alone

[dave]

whether they look at their server data, or poll each online user, it sounds like a very easy way to do something about windower users when that time comes.

i was thinking back to the good 'ole days when everyone had tp macros for skillchains. was windower non-existant back then?

while i wouldn't necessarily call the tp readouts and other stat data cheating, they're little things that add up. the timestamp options goes a little over the line as a ToD tool, imo. eventually a new "feature" will be the straw that breaks the camel's back.

i've tried windower, and had phone conversations with people at SE about it. as a long-time programmer, i understand why they never plan to release an official version... tech support would be practically impossible. they would need to start compiling massive lists of known compatibility issues with gazillions of other programs the user might be using. there's a lot more, but basically instead of dealing with their program, they'd have to start dealing with how their program functions with every other known program in the world.

i'm getting used to the washed out screens, it's really not that terrible. the game also runs a tiny bit faster.

[Khamsin]

i've tried windower, and had phone conversations with people at SE about it. as a long-time programmer, i understand why they never plan to release an official version... tech support would be practically impossible. they would need to start compiling massive lists of known compatibility issues with gazillions of other programs the user might be using. there's a lot more, but basically instead of dealing with their program, they'd have to start dealing with how their program functions with every other known program in the world.

All the more reason to praise Cliff; a single man being able to tackle something that all of SE couldn't. It is remarkable that he single-handedly was able to make Windower work with every other known program in the world, compile the massive lists of known compatibility isues with gazillions of other programs the user might be running, and handle the practically impossible tech support issues.

SE should just fire their dev team and tech support staff, and just hire Cliff. It'd save them a lot of money, since Cliff can do it all for free.

[Cephius]

i've tried windower, and had phone conversations with people at SE about it. as a long-time programmer, i understand why they never plan to release an official version... tech support would be practically impossible. they would need to start compiling massive lists of known compatibility issues with gazillions of other programs the user might be using. there's a lot more, but basically instead of dealing with their program, they'd have to start dealing with how their program functions with every other known program in the world.

Just tell them to pay blizzard to tell them how to do it >_>

[Faranim]

There's a big difference between someone like Cliff creating a windower, and SE doing it. If SE released a windowed mode for FFXI, it would have to be covered by the EULA. Which means that they would have to provide support and documentation for it. It's just not worth the cost to them.

But a 3rd party releasing it as "use at your own risk" software has no frills attached. If it breaks, it breaks. Everyone should be incredibly thankful that the windower Devs continue to support their software.

[ircgeek]

You know, it's my understanding that Cliff's not the only one working on Windower... The temp. link he had up last night was a link to my LS, and from what I understand, my buddy there was working on fixing the bugs from this update.

Not to disrespect what Cliff has done (or is doing), but it certainly seems like this isn't a one-man project anymore.

[Xavier]

There's a big difference between someone like Cliff creating a windower, and SE doing it. If SE released a windowed mode for FFXI, it would have to be covered by the EULA. Which means that they would have to provide support and documentation for it. It's just not worth the cost to them.

But a 3rd party releasing it as "use at your own risk" software has no frills attached. If it breaks, it breaks. Everyone should be incredibly thankful that the windower Devs continue to support their software.

Sounds to me like the logical conclusion of that would be for Square to endorse the windower but not support it. That is to say, offically unoffically support Cliff w/ it, not promising to work with it but simply ceasing to make threats over it.

Then people get to use a feature that every game should already include, without Square having to do anything.

Its really lame for Square to keep making threats about something that every other game for the PC supports.

[RanDom_ErrOr]

[quote=Khamsin]

http://virusscan.jotti.org/[/url]

Since when are a few lines of code that can report keyboard entries and sent to a URL noticable?

That online shit doesnt really work for programs like these.

Not to mention that the good ffxi trojans don't log keystrokes..

Your password is stored 4 places plain text in polcore.dll..

Nope.

I bet you're soo stupid.... you got some hex editor or something and found the actual polcore.dll on your hard drive and searched that file for your password.

Of course you didn't find it! I must be wrong.. I must be such a moron!

Fucking eurotrash.

I haven't looked myself, but you did say it was stored in plain text. If he couldn't find his password with a simple hex editor (or even notepad, in among the gibberish), then its not stored in plain text. Maybe its still unencrypted and easy to find (stored as binary rather than ascii, for example), but not "plain text".

Unless you consider plain text to be anything that anyone can make a 30 second program to read through the file and locate your password and present it in plain text without decryption.[/quote:a29ea]

what he means by plain text is that you can search through the memory spaces which polcore.dll reserves and find your password. Ollydbg or even the registered version of Artmoney can find this very simply.

In all honesty, i could whip up some code that I could attach to POS or Argus or Fleetool or even something more beneign like Mapmon or ACTools or FFAssist or the recast timers to just scan those memory locations, pick out the passwords, grab your POL ID as well and have them sent to a webserver or even an email to a forwarder account...

Dont believe me? grab Ollydbg and try it yourself.

[Cephius]

There's a big difference between someone like Cliff creating a windower, and SE doing it. If SE released a windowed mode for FFXI, it would have to be covered by the EULA. Which means that they would have to provide support and documentation for it. It's just not worth the cost to them.

But a 3rd party releasing it as "use at your own risk" software has no frills attached. If it breaks, it breaks. Everyone should be incredibly thankful that the windower Devs continue to support their software.

Sounds to me like the logical conclusion of that would be for Square to endorse the windower but not support it. That is to say, offically unoffically support Cliff w/ it, not promising to work with it but simply ceasing to make threats over it.

Then people get to use a feature that every game should already include, without Square having to do anything.

Its really lame for Square to keep making threats about something that every other game for the PC supports.

It's more than likely to cover their own asses on their shitty job of programming it. I don't think they're after windower persay, but after the 3rd party tools like POS and mrargus that plague the game these days. They've tried unsuccessfully via namechanger and the dat checker to kill off programs besides windower. They know defeating windower would solve all the other problems. As the poor analogy goes, why keep cutting off heads that grow back when you can focus on one head that will kill the rest? I'm sure they would in fact endorse cliff or make their own windower if it wasn't a gateway to every other 3rd party program.

[RanDom_ErrOr]

There's a big difference between someone like Cliff creating a windower, and SE doing it. If SE released a windowed mode for FFXI, it would have to be covered by the EULA. Which means that they would have to provide support and documentation for it. It's just not worth the cost to them.

But a 3rd party releasing it as "use at your own risk" software has no frills attached. If it breaks, it breaks. Everyone should be incredibly thankful that the windower Devs continue to support their software.

Sounds to me like the logical conclusion of that would be for Square to endorse the windower but not support it. That is to say, offically unoffically support Cliff w/ it, not promising to work with it but simply ceasing to make threats over it.

Then people get to use a feature that every game should already include, without Square having to do anything.

Its really lame for Square to keep making threats about something that every other game for the PC supports.

It's more than likely to cover their own asses on their shitty job of programming it. I don't think they're after windower persay, but after the 3rd party tools like POS and mrargus that plague the game these days. They've tried unsuccessfully via namechanger and the dat checker to kill off programs besides windower. They know defeating windower would solve all the other problems. As the poor analogy goes, why keep cutting off heads that grow back when you can focus on one head that will kill the rest? I'm sure they would in fact endorse cliff or make their own windower if it wasn't a gateway to every other 3rd party program.

Third party programs can still run without windower. you just have to be creative in the way you control / write them.

[Cephius]

There's a big difference between someone like Cliff creating a windower, and SE doing it. If SE released a windowed mode for FFXI, it would have to be covered by the EULA. Which means that they would have to provide support and documentation for it. It's just not worth the cost to them.

But a 3rd party releasing it as "use at your own risk" software has no frills attached. If it breaks, it breaks. Everyone should be incredibly thankful that the windower Devs continue to support their software.

Sounds to me like the logical conclusion of that would be for Square to endorse the windower but not support it. That is to say, offically unoffically support Cliff w/ it, not promising to work with it but simply ceasing to make threats over it.

Then people get to use a feature that every game should already include, without Square having to do anything.

Its really lame for Square to keep making threats about something that every other game for the PC supports.

It's more than likely to cover their own asses on their shitty job of programming it. I don't think they're after windower persay, but after the 3rd party tools like POS and mrargus that plague the game these days. They've tried unsuccessfully via namechanger and the dat checker to kill off programs besides windower. They know defeating windower would solve all the other problems. As the poor analogy goes, why keep cutting off heads that grow back when you can focus on one head that will kill the rest? I'm sure they would in fact endorse cliff or make their own windower if it wasn't a gateway to every other 3rd party program.

Third party programs can still run without windower. you just have to be creative in the way you control / write them.

You can run cars without gasoline also, but its ineffective many times over, and (keeping with the analogy) its going to take a long time, if ever, before everyone converts their cars over to a new form of fuel.

[Matricide]

that's a bad analogy, it's easy to write software that you can execute with hotkeys and run as a background process.

[Cephius]

I realize there are ways around every fix but honestly, how many people do you think would use 3rd party programs if windower didn't exist?

[Septimus]

There's a big difference between someone like Cliff creating a windower, and SE doing it. If SE released a windowed mode for FFXI, it would have to be covered by the EULA. Which means that they would have to provide support and documentation for it. It's just not worth the cost to them.

But a 3rd party releasing it as "use at your own risk" software has no frills attached. If it breaks, it breaks. Everyone should be incredibly thankful that the windower Devs continue to support their software.

Sounds to me like the logical conclusion of that would be for Square to endorse the windower but not support it. That is to say, offically unoffically support Cliff w/ it, not promising to work with it but simply ceasing to make threats over it.

Then people get to use a feature that every game should already include, without Square having to do anything.

Its really lame for Square to keep making threats about something that every other game for the PC supports.

It's more than likely to cover their own asses on their shitty job of programming it. I don't think they're after windower persay, but after the 3rd party tools like POS and mrargus that plague the game these days. They've tried unsuccessfully via namechanger and the dat checker to kill off programs besides windower. They know defeating windower would solve all the other problems. As the poor analogy goes, why keep cutting off heads that grow back when you can focus on one head that will kill the rest? I'm sure they would in fact endorse cliff or make their own windower if it wasn't a gateway to every other 3rd party program.

No, just no. Some NAs were using bots long before NAs even heard about such a thing as a windower. Please try again.

[Demosthenes]

that's a bad analogy, it's easy to write software that you can execute with hotkeys and run as a background process.

And if it gets complicated draw a map <_< ffxi had a map.

[Celeras]

I dont really care about any of this. I just dont wanna have to reinstall, even if its bullshit.

I downloaded my version from their IRC link pretty early last night, it didnt contain the timestamp plugin. Im 'safe', yeah? I skimmed through the thread pretty quick, but from what I gather the supposed 'bullshit issue' only comes from using timestamp?

[Xavier]

Nobody uses bots though, everyone plays on ps2...