MND/HNMs and Banish Testing

[Rocl]

obviously you should use af2 boots because matk bonus affects enfeebles RITE

Black Mages enfeeble with Thundaga III.

WHAT A CRAZY WAMOURA


ps; there are people on bahamut who believe MAB is a direct factor in their enfeebles (i.e. Moldavite > Enfeebling earring for all purposes)

why godddd
whyyy did you create such chasuble wearing idiots to plague the lands with misinformation

[Kandykanez]

obviously you should use af2 boots because matk bonus affects enfeebles RITE

I'm so guilty of never swapping out af2 boots. 55/60 slots

[Rocl]

obviously you should use af2 boots because matk bonus affects enfeebles RITE

I'm so guilty of never swapping out af2 boots. 55/60 slots

dont tell anyone, but me too

if this thread begins a tiny text war i'm gonna punch a baby

[Kandykanez]

obviously you should use af2 boots because matk bonus affects enfeebles RITE

I'm so guilty of never swapping out af2 boots. 55/60 slots

dont tell anyone, but me too

if this thread begins a tiny text war i'm gonna punch a baby

it's ok, just knowing what we /should/ be wearing is enough to justify all the shit we spout
HIYOOOO

[FFXIFlux]

why godddd
whyyy did you create such chasuble wearing idiots to plague the lands with misinformation

The only truth is CHR. Everything else is just misinformation hiding what true players know. CHR determines everything, it's hate loss (and gain) it's treasure hunter, it determines if a mob crits on you and if you crit on a mob, it determines if the coffer is around the next corner, it's better than botting as the highest CHR gets the claim, it's what determines your break chance crafting and how often you HQ, the lowest priced items are held back on AH until people with high CHR bid, it decides how often conserve MP goes off and whether mobs chasing you go off on a weird path or beat on you, it makes mobs not turn around and link on you. Eeeeeeeverrrrrrrryyyyyythhhhhhiiiiing!

[solsovly]

why godddd
whyyy did you create such chasuble wearing idiots to plague the lands with misinformation

The only truth is CHR. Everything else is just misinformation hiding what true players know. CHR determines everything, it's hate loss (and gain) it's treasure hunter, it determines if a mob crits on you and if you crit on a mob, it determines if the coffer is around the next corner, it's better than botting as the highest CHR gets the claim, it's what determines your break chance crafting and how often you HQ, the lowest priced items are held back on AH until people with high CHR bid, it decides how often conserve MP goes off and whether mobs chasing you go off on a weird path or beat on you, it makes mobs not turn around and link on you. Eeeeeeeverrrrrrrryyyyyythhhhhhiiiiing!

Does... does that mean my BST is overepowered? Wait, that changes nothing my BRD has more CHR. Who knew that getting BRD to 75 permanetly locks all your other job functions and that you are forever stuck as BRD.

[phirien]

We're talking about 1 single item which will boost your mnd by +9-10

Surely you agree that +5mnd from a promise badge is better than enfeebling torque, prism cape is better than altruistic, mahatma slops are better than nashira, and communion earring is better than enfeebling earring if you are concerned about boosting potency. That's 19 more mnd!

Swapping just a few of these items, while keeping your elemental staff will give you better potency and accuracy than keeping other +skill items and swapping in a wand in for potency, which is what my whole point was when I said the staff is the last slot you should be swapping.

We both agreed that keeping a staff for hnms wasn't stupid, although I'm sure there are some people who prefer wand there too. What is the extra potency going to do for for other stuff, exp/dynamis/limbus mobs will be dead before you can even see the difference 15%->17% or 28%->30% slow makes, which is something I pointed out before and you ignored.

After tons of HNM kills I learned there is something magic that happens once you approach the +60MND and above level, you become pretty damn accurate again without the need for any skill (or staff) whatsoever...and you can imagine what paralyze potency becomes like at that level.

Doesn't apply as much to Gods but really what does?

yeah, i've noticed that the 60/70+ MND mark produces ridiculous returns.
with the addition of para/slow2, i think max Enfeebling magic merits and a staff (and either neck/earring if you dont have crimson/af2 head) will be more than enough for landing the spell.

worst case scenario-even with the enhanced MP cost of the second-tier enfeebles, i don't see the harm in having to cast paralyze or slow 2-3 times to land the spell if its going to completely fuck up the mob.


HQ stafff
Crimson Mask
enfeebling earring
Enfeebling Torque_______ +20 skill (+32 w/ merits)
communion earring
crimson/errant body
yigit hands
communion/serene ring
prism cape
penitents rope
mahamta legs
mahatma feet
mushpot_____________ +63 MND

what i typically use on HNM. Having to cast Para twice and have it proc 6-7x in a row > landing it 95% and having it proc once.

only mobs i can see where maxxing out in Enfeebling Skill might be potentially beneficial would be in sky.. but has anyone with 350+ enfeebling been able to test/consistently land anything on sky gods? (not like it matters but interesting nontheless)

afaik, only person i've seen with 353 (the max) is here: http://ffxi.ironmog.com/SMF/index.php?topic=5782.0

[Cephius]

afaik, only person i've seen with 353 (the max) is here: http://ffxi.ironmog.com/SMF/index.php?topic=5782.0

All that showed me is how lame my mog house looks in comparison

[FFXIFlux]

only mobs i can see where maxxing out in Enfeebling Skill might be potentially beneficial would be in sky.. but has anyone with 350+ enfeebling been able to test/consistently land anything on sky gods? (not like it matters but interesting nontheless)

I've tried on Kirin, with max MND gear paralyze is a 5% land, with max enfeebling it's 50%+ but will almost never go off. Max enfeebling silence is still 5% land and resisted on elemental seal.

afaik, only person i've seen with 353 (the max) is here: http://ffxi.ironmog.com/SMF/index.php?topic=5782.0

I have max enfeebling gear, for accuracy I'm missing Aeurole and for ToA areas nashira gages since my Mstr Cstr Bracelets don't work there (fuck you SE for that and 50 MP bastok medallion.) I don't have accuracy for slots that have better enfeebling (i.e. I don't have JSE dunce cap +1 because I have duelist's.)

[Raineer]

I only have 348 but doesn't matter a whole lot really, sky is still sky and totally random. The last Suzaku I did I landed Slow 5-6 with NO resists (slowed the whole fight), Silence landed 4-5 times and only resisted a few, hell I even landed Paralyze. The fight before I landed nothing the whole time.

All in all, in sky I've noticed that MND seems to help more than skill, but it's still a total crapshoot.

[Kyreth]

At least from lower-level experience, I like my high MND stuff. Yes, I'm one of the RDM's who chows down on those gobbie mushpots all the time. Seems to do good things for my Paralyze procs and the like. So I am tempted to go with as much MND as I can get along with the +Macc gear on HNM/NM runs, once I get there. I mean, I'm an RDM. Am I going to be seriously tossing much Black magic around at monsters except Sleep (which I can always macro for) on these big raids?

[FFXIFlux]

I mean, I'm an RDM. Am I going to be seriously tossing much Black magic around at monsters except Sleep (which I can always macro for) on these big raids?

Sleep/bind/gravity you want as much enfeebling as you can get. RDM can get enough elemental skill to land nukes reasonably well. I have ice meritted and it lands on Ouryu, Aspi and dynamis and limbus stuff fairly well. Chainspell blizzard III did over 1k damage to spear in Xarcabard yesterday, which, while not amazing, is better than doing 0.

[phirien]

At least from lower-level experience, I like my high MND stuff. Yes, I'm one of the RDM's who chows down on those gobbie mushpots all the time. Seems to do good things for my Paralyze procs and the like. So I am tempted to go with as much MND as I can get along with the +Macc gear on HNM/NM runs, once I get there. I mean, I'm an RDM. Am I going to be seriously tossing much Black magic around at monsters except Sleep (which I can always macro for) on these big raids?

chances are, your LS wont necessarily NEED your nukes, but most good RDM have absolutely no MP issues, and with convert you might as well throw out a blizzard or thunder 3 from time to time.

like flux said, gravity/sleep/bind are all enfeebling based as well as INT.
As an Elvaan RDM with below average nuking gear (elemetal torque/moldavite/zenith hands) and only 1 Ice Mgc. Accuracy merit i land about 30-40% of my thunder3s on shit like Fafnir/KB (around 680-720 MB), but not even worth casting on stuff like Tiamat.

[Larkwynn]

As an Elvaan RDM with below average nuking gear (elemetal torque/moldavite/zenith hands) and only 1 Ice Mgc. Accuracy merit i land about 30-40% of my thunder3s on shit like Fafnir/KB (around 680-720 MB)

>.>

[Lockecole]

At least from lower-level experience, I like my high MND stuff. Yes, I'm one of the RDM's who chows down on those gobbie mushpots all the time. Seems to do good things for my Paralyze procs and the like. So I am tempted to go with as much MND as I can get along with the +Macc gear on HNM/NM runs, once I get there. I mean, I'm an RDM. Am I going to be seriously tossing much Black magic around at monsters except Sleep (which I can always macro for) on these big raids?

chances are, your LS wont necessarily NEED your nukes, but most good RDM have absolutely no MP issues, and with convert you might as well throw out a blizzard or thunder 3 from time to time.

like flux said, gravity/sleep/bind are all enfeebling based as well as INT.
As an Elvaan RDM with below average nuking gear (elemetal torque/moldavite/zenith hands) and only 1 Ice Mgc. Accuracy merit i land about 30-40% of my thunder3s on shit like Fafnir/KB (around 680-720 MB), but not even worth casting on stuff like Tiamat.

Why are you grouping Fafnir/KB together? >.>

[phirien]

At least from lower-level experience, I like my high MND stuff. Yes, I'm one of the RDM's who chows down on those gobbie mushpots all the time. Seems to do good things for my Paralyze procs and the like. So I am tempted to go with as much MND as I can get along with the +Macc gear on HNM/NM runs, once I get there. I mean, I'm an RDM. Am I going to be seriously tossing much Black magic around at monsters except Sleep (which I can always macro for) on these big raids?

chances are, your LS wont necessarily NEED your nukes, but most good RDM have absolutely no MP issues, and with convert you might as well throw out a blizzard or thunder 3 from time to time.

like flux said, gravity/sleep/bind are all enfeebling based as well as INT.
As an Elvaan RDM with below average nuking gear (elemetal torque/moldavite/zenith hands) and only 1 Ice Mgc. Accuracy merit i land about 30-40% of my thunder3s on shit like Fafnir/KB (around 680-720 MB), but not even worth casting on stuff like Tiamat.

Why are you grouping Fafnir/KB together? >.>

my thunder3s on Fafnir are resisted at approximately the same rate as my blizzard3s on KB.

[phirien]

As an Elvaan RDM with below average nuking gear (elemetal torque/moldavite/zenith hands) and only 1 Ice Mgc. Accuracy merit i land about 30-40% of my thunder3s on shit like Fafnir/KB (around 680-720 MB)

>.>

way to completely miss my point.

[Xajii]

i dunno, i've leveled rdm to 75 and played it as such for over a year now, looked into all sorts of rdm forums, tested all different theories and my best conclusion is that enfeebling is pretty fucking random.

today i went out to wajaom to camp jody for a friend and put on a 67+55 MND setup, not the greatest but it's pretty good. i tossed a para1 on a PH and it lasted whole fight but only proc'd twice, next time i tossed it proc'd 5-6 times.

kings are easy for me to land things on and i can get good para procs on fafhogg at least. but even then landing it can be random. i only have 319 skill (no AF2 hat, whead, earring, seraweels or cape /gimp) but can land everything i want to sooner or later unless it's gods where there's no way in hell you can find rhyme or rhythm.

i wear a mnd over skill setup on everything but kirin, cerb, hydra and omega/ultima and put on skill if i'm having trouble. i also use mistilteinn over staves when not on the former, and again will change if i have trouble.

as it's been said before and should be said again, ther'es very little point in skill whoring. you reach a level where it doesn't really matter anymore. from what i've seen if you have a natural skill cap + full merits and AF body + torque, you should be doing fine.

slow has a cap on its % and there's a nice test for it with slow2, slow1 and elegy comparisons by masago on odin server, you can find it in a thread i made on KI about new merits under rdm forum (wqill dig link up later). basically there's a mnd cap that caps slow1 at 30%, slow2 lv1 at 33.33% and slow2 lv2 at 35.xx%. same works with chr and elegy at 48%.

one would assume there's probably a mnd cap on para too. i'm guessing the way para works in the scripts is that it has a chance of procing every time the para'd target does something and the % will be increased to a certain point with mnd.

in conclusion from a long-winded post: skill whoring and mnd whoring are cute, but only go so far.

[/post nobody will read because of my post count]

[DrObvious]

slow has a cap on its % and there's a nice test for it with slow2, slow1 and elegy comparisons by masago on odin server, you can find it in a thread i made on KI about new merits under rdm forum (wqill dig link up later). basically there's a mnd cap that caps slow1 at 30%, slow2 lv1 at 33.33% and slow2 lv2 at 35.xx%. same works with chr and elegy at 48%.

You must have read that wrong, elegy is unaffected by chr and has a static effect ~50%.

one would assume there's probably a mnd cap on para too. i'm guessing the way para works in the scripts is that it has a chance of procing every time the para'd target does something and the % will be increased to a certain point with mnd.

in conclusion from a long-winded post: skill whoring and mnd whoring are cute, but only go so far.

We don't know how much mnd hnms have so we don't even know if we're able to reach the cap or not, hence the whole point of this thread.

[FFXIFlux]

one would assume there's probably a mnd cap on para too.

20% is max paralyze. I haven't tested but it seems that the amount of MND needed is much smaller than that needed to reach the cap on slow.