Red Mage Meritpo Builds

[Kyreth]

Why do people still think spells with higher potency will overwrite ones with weaker? Please name one effect in this game that will sometimes overwrite another and sometimes not (and no, slow from a spider is not the same effect as slow from a crawler.)

The elemental debuffs (burn, shock, etc) work like this. One cast from higher int tiers than what's on the mob will overwrite, one cast from the same int tier reapplies and one cast from lower tiers than what's currently on the mob will have no effect.

How are these tiers determined? Definitely something I want to read up on.

[Not Kuno]

Why do people still think spells with higher potency will overwrite ones with weaker? Please name one effect in this game that will sometimes overwrite another and sometimes not (and no, slow from a spider is not the same effect as slow from a crawler.)

The elemental debuffs (burn, shock, etc) work like this. One cast from higher int tiers than what's on the mob will overwrite, one cast from the same int tier reapplies and one cast from lower tiers than what's currently on the mob will have no effect.

How are these tiers determined? Definitely something I want to read up on.

INT. I think its every 20 or 30 or something.

[nivlakian]

Why do people still think spells with higher potency will overwrite ones with weaker? Please name one effect in this game that will sometimes overwrite another and sometimes not (and no, slow from a spider is not the same effect as slow from a crawler.)

The elemental debuffs (burn, shock, etc) work like this. One cast from higher int tiers than what's on the mob will overwrite, one cast from the same int tier reapplies and one cast from lower tiers than what's currently on the mob will have no effect.

How are these tiers determined? Definitely something I want to read up on.

It's on ffxicyclopedia under Elemental Debuff

1 - 39 INT = 1hp/tic (-5 stat)
40 - 69 INT = 2hp/tic (-7 stat)
70 - 99 INT = 3hp/tic (-9 stat)
100 - 149 INT = 4hp/tic (-11 stat)
150 - ??? INT = 5hp/tic (-13 stat)

Edit: The first range 50-99 might be incorrect.
Edit2: First range should be 70-99
Edit3: With some minor testing, I filled in what should be the missing range.

[Grandcross]

In my tests, in terms of which overwrites what,

SlowII > Haste > Hojo Ni > Slow = Hojo ichi > Refueling.

[FFXIFlux]

Why do people still think spells with higher potency will overwrite ones with weaker? Please name one effect in this game that will sometimes overwrite another and sometimes not (and no, slow from a spider is not the same effect as slow from a crawler.)

The elemental debuffs (burn, shock, etc) work like this. One cast from higher int tiers than what's on the mob will overwrite, one cast from the same int tier reapplies and one cast from lower tiers than what's currently on the mob will have no effect.

I'd meant a debuff (or buff) overwriting a DIFFERENT buff. Although a 99 or lower INT frost won't overwrite a 100+ INT frost, a 99 or lower burn WILL overwrite a 100+ frost. I can't think of any examples where the potency of a buff/debuff determines if a DIFFERENT buff/debuff will overwrite it, it seems to be set. Like hojo 2 will ALWAYS(*) overwrite Slow 1 no matter how much MND was used.

Buff/debuffs in FFXI seem to be a mess of special rules and exceptions, but it does seem to be a rule that potency doesn't determine if a spell is overwritten or not (by a different spell), just what the spells in question are. The elemental debuffs seem to be a special case where their overwriting pattern is a circle instead of a line.

(*)Not counting if a corsair earth shots it, then all bets are off.

[nivlakian]

Why do people still think spells with higher potency will overwrite ones with weaker? Please name one effect in this game that will sometimes overwrite another and sometimes not (and no, slow from a spider is not the same effect as slow from a crawler.)

The elemental debuffs (burn, shock, etc) work like this. One cast from higher int tiers than what's on the mob will overwrite, one cast from the same int tier reapplies and one cast from lower tiers than what's currently on the mob will have no effect.

I'd meant a debuff (or buff) overwriting a DIFFERENT buff. Although a 99 or lower INT frost won't overwrite a 100+ INT frost, a 99 or lower burn WILL overwrite a 100+ frost. I can't think of any examples where the potency of a buff/debuff determines if a DIFFERENT buff/debuff will overwrite it, it seems to be set. Like hojo 2 will ALWAYS(*) overwrite Slow 1 no matter how much MND was used.

Ah, I misinterpretted what you meant.

[Kimiko]

Why do people still think spells with higher potency will overwrite ones with weaker? Please name one effect in this game that will sometimes overwrite another and sometimes not (and no, slow from a spider is not the same effect as slow from a crawler.)

The elemental debuffs (burn, shock, etc) work like this. One cast from higher int tiers than what's on the mob will overwrite, one cast from the same int tier reapplies and one cast from lower tiers than what's currently on the mob will have no effect.

How are these tiers determined? Definitely something I want to read up on.

It's on ffxicyclopedia under Elemental Debuff

1 - 39 INT = 1hp/tic (-5 stat)
40 - 69 INT = 2hp/tic (-7 stat)
70 - 99 INT = 3hp/tic (-9 stat)
100 - 149 INT = 4hp/tic (-11 stat)
150 - ??? INT = 5hp/tic (-13 stat)

Edit: The first range 50-99 might be incorrect.
Edit2: First range should be 70-99
Edit3: With some minor testing, I filled in what should be the missing range.

I don't see how the 150 int barrier can be breached even with extemly powerful gear

[FFXIFlux]

I don't see how the 150 int barrier can be breached even with extemly powerful gear

I can get over 120 as a mithra rdm without trying too hard. A taru blm with a bard should have no problem breaking 150.

[nivlakian]

I don't see how the 150 int barrier can be breached even with extemly powerful gear

You're not thinking hard enough.

Taru 75BLM/RDM has base INT of 79.

Main: Kirin's Pole (+10)
Hat: Demon Helm +1 (+6)
Body: Errant Hpl. (+10)
Back: Prism Cape (+4)
Neck: Phil. Stole (+3)
Hands: Errant Cuffs (+5)
Waist: Penitent's Rope (+5)
L. Ear: Morion Earring (+1)
L. Ring: Snow Ring (+5)
Legs: Mahatma Slops (+8)
Ammo: Phtm. Tathlum (+2)
R.Ear: Abyssal Earring (+2)
R.Ring: Tamas Ring (+5)
Feet: Yigit Crackrows or Rostrum Pumps (+3)

= +69INT if math is correct bringing a Taru BLM/RDM to 148INT.

The above gear is not difficult to obtain. Then you just need food, merits, INT potions, HQ certain gear or a BRD to do the rest.

Edit: It's even easier if you /nin (bringing a taru to 77INT) and dual weild wands.

[Golandra]

the overwrting, lol .

BRD/COR< (sometimes same) BLU < NIN </same RDM/BLM/WHM type of spell

tier 1< tier 2 < tier 3 etc

Dia< Bio (higher tiers overwrite lower tiers e.g. Bio< Dia II)

elemental debuffs working with the elemental chart earth<wind<ice etc.

Their is no stat calculator, who overwrites a weak casted spell with a stronger one with the exception of elemental debuffs. Because they got weaker over time SE allowed them to renew those.

The prob with merit spells is, that they are programmed worse: Seems SlowII (1 merit) is more a Slow 1.9 and with 3 merits a 2,1 and can overwrite Hojo:Ni. I would't wonder, when SE programmed 3 Slow II spells and they were activated 1 by one with a merit.

AND BRD is a job full of bugs especially with equipment (see the last mazurka crap, SE strikes again). It shouldn't exist any overwritten stuff ; only Threnody working like elemental debuffs and can be overwritten with same song.

And my merit suggestion: When you only want to play the mages jobs, delete all elemental merits. Even as Blm you should merit enfeebling. This is the weakest point and you need it: Sleep, Gravity, Bind in many situations. Boosting elemental only helps for HNMs resists, when you can reach 320 + skill with gear, you are good enough for HNMs resist rate and your int is good enough anyways. RDM has the prob of his "Jack of all trades", better max all enfeebling and use stat gear: mnd!!! as Taru , int just what the situation needs. From my point of view as Elvaan Rdm and BLM, my BLM spells resists not very often, instead my RDM enfeebling are resisted more, much more, because most mobs have implemented, resist slow, resist silence traits etc - the jobtraits, which a normal player character has got. Magic defense instead only afflicts the amount of damage, not the resist rate.

Status merits: you should boost mnd +5 for support job role (or whatever you like, when you want to be the an all around rdm)

Job Merits: difficult, instead of the common opinion, some points there , some here i say that is BS, you want wind acc (so +5 merits), you want earth ( +5), be consequent 1 merit is not much, its like a drop on a hot stone. + 5 merits are noticable , at +1 you will ask yourself: "Where is the difference". And for all chars out there with convert recast. Useless, 40 or more seconds faster , why ? I could hold the puk chain with my low mp as elvaan without this feature - Dynamis same. Convert recast is for long runs and (forced) wasting mp mages (or for solo freaks, who need evry bit of mp and 40 seconds are a matter of death)
2nd category is much more difficult, Phalanx 2 is maybe a good choice for support. Chainspell Phalanx II is awesome at some zerk fights. Slow vs. Slow II etc: there are much threads about it. Personally i think the tier 2 spells are a waste to cast for most fights. Dia III or Bio III instead could help "normal" xp partys, but burns are more common. I would merit the option, that you use more.

Rest of the merits, whatever you want.

[Demosthenes11]

gibberish

Didn't understand a word of this...wtf@backwards '<'

[Khamsin]

gibberish

Didn't understand a word of this...wtf@backwards '<'

Ironically, his use of '<' is actually mathematically appropriate.

[divisortheory]

And my merit suggestion: When you only want to play the mages jobs, delete all elemental merits. Even as Blm you should merit enfeebling.

lol, are you serious?

[Septimus]

gibberish

Didn't understand a word of this...wtf@backwards '<'

I'm glad I'm not the only one who didn't get that.

I thought I slipped into ultra-mega-ninja-thunderzord dyslexic mode and lost the ability to comprehend English.

[aurik]

Wafik overwrote my 10hp/tic invigorate regen with 5hp/tic regen1 last night

[Mifaco]

Invigorate: Because you can't rely on dumbass mages to heal you when you're in the orange.

[DrObvious]

Their is no stat calculator, who overwrites a weak casted spell with a stronger one with the exception of elemental debuffs. Because they got weaker over time SE allowed them to renew those.

They don't get weaker over time. That is all.

[Kyreth]

Their is no stat calculator, who overwrites a weak casted spell with a stronger one with the exception of elemental debuffs. Because they got weaker over time SE allowed them to renew those.

They don't get weaker over time. That is all.

Funny, all those Rasps I get hit with from worms have a decreasing Dex penalty over time. The DoT doesn't change though.

[nivlakian]

Their is no stat calculator, who overwrites a weak casted spell with a stronger one with the exception of elemental debuffs. Because they got weaker over time SE allowed them to renew those.

They don't get weaker over time. That is all.

Funny, all those Rasps I get hit with from worms have a decreasing Dex penalty over time. The DoT doesn't change though.

.......

No, they don't get weaker over time.

[Jeryhn]

Welcome to the smash hit TV game show "What the Fuck?", only on the BG channel!
Today's contestant is Golandra. Tell us about youself Golandra!

Well I have a hamster and...

Nobody cares <call5>! Hahaha.
Gets 'em every time. Anyway, on with the show!

The prob with merit spells is, that they are programmed worse: Seems SlowII (1 merit) is more a Slow 1.9 and with 3 merits a 2,1 and can overwrite Hojo:Ni. I would't wonder, when SE programmed 3 Slow II spells and they were activated 1 by one with a merit.

What the fuck?
There's only one Slow II entry in the spell .DAT file list. Perhaps it is feasible that SE got up off their lazy asses and actually programmed the merit levels put into these spells rather than took the shortcut route.

And my merit suggestion: When you only want to play the mages jobs, delete all elemental merits. Even as Blm you should merit enfeebling.

What the fuck?
A BLM's job is to enfeeble? Well, holy shit, who knew? Its a good thing we don't have another job class with a higher enfeebling skill and access to more enfeebling gear so that BLMs can be relegated to Sleepga roles seeing as how elemental magic has been declared fundamentally useless!

This is the weakest point and you need it: Sleep, Gravity, Bind in many situations. Boosting elemental only helps for HNMs resists, when you can reach 320 + skill with gear, you are good enough for HNMs resist rate and your int is good enough anyways.

What the fuck?
A BLM's job is also to enfeeble HNMs?

RDM has the prob of his "Jack of all trades", better max all enfeebling

What the fuck?
Because RDMs cannot obviously enfeeble, at all, being a "jack of all trades".

I think I've OD'd on my daily dose of sarcasm folks. We'll be right back, after I puke my brains out, after this message!

Oi, mate! Bonzer! Need a relic weapon? Finally done with playing at the next level, only to find that your suppliers are too busy camping Asura Tiamats? Well there's something you can do about it. Crikey!

All you need to do is call 1-999-MANABURN, and if you meet the qualifications of having all your currency, and not being a gilselling douchebag, we can help! Excelsior!

Welcome back to the show folks.
Before the break, our contestant Golandra was being an obvious idiot.
Let's continue.

And for all chars out there with convert recast. Useless, 40 or more seconds faster , why ? I could hold the puk chain with my low mp as elvaan without this feature - Dynamis same. Convert recast is for long runs and (forced) wasting mp mages (or for solo freaks, who need evry bit of mp and 40 seconds are a matter of death)

What the fuck?
Now, I can hold down my MP just fine on a 10-minute timer, just suggesting that emergencies don't happen where having Convert up as opposed to not having it up could lead to the party's survival is just plain... retarded.

Chainspell Phalanx II is awesome at some zerk fights.

What the fuck?
People use Chainspell just to get Phalanx II up that much faster?

Slow vs. Slow II etc: there are much threads about it. Personally i think the tier 2 spells are a waste to cast for most fights. Dia III or Bio III instead could help "normal" xp partys, but burns are more common.

Oh my folks. This section deserves a double "What the fuck"?
Of course, BLMs cast Thunder3 over Thunder4 because higher tier spells are a waste to cast for most fights! Not to mention Dia3 for 30 seconds in a "normal" EXP party where it takes 2 minutes to kill a mob is less of a waste than a burn party where mobs generally die within 40-50 seconds.

That's all for today folks.