Stage 5 - Completed Relic Weapons List

[Neosutra]

Max:

Since when does relic damage proc occur on WS ?

And Alky's should perform alot better for WS than the AF+1 hands.

As for wether dex increases chance of triple damage, thats an interesting suggestion which I dont have the answer for. Looks like something that could be fun to test.

[Max™]

Wait, does relic dmg proc on WS?

I could swear I remember the explanation for that 9k Tachi: Jinpu being Weak Flea+Wind Weak+3x Dmg proc=ftmfw.

[RKenshin]

I've never heard anything about the critical-hits during WS thing being debunked since it was first proved about a year or so ago. Where was this proven?

I'm also rather certain it can't crit just from experience. My WS averages line up rather well with what's to be expected with my stats, and if critical hits could happen there wouldn't really be any doubt as to whether it could with how often SAMs pump out WS and how easily we cap our attack. The difference between a capped attack WS and a capped attack critical WS is rather easy to see.

I'm also sure that 3% is the linear chance all relics have to triple. In all the testing from the first relic we've seen (Elvaan Apoc DRK), to the ones that followed shortly after, to the first Daggers, etc... All suggested about a 3% rate. Despite the various critical-hit rates and amounts of DEX between them. It also wouldn't make sense in regard to my tests with a DEX build having lower melee averages.

And yeah, it doesn't occur on WS.

[Max™]

*bow*

Well, I learned something then, I REALLY thought 3x happened during WS from time to time too.

What the hell was that 9k Jinpu to a Chigoe about then?

[RKenshin]

Jinpu is broken on those mobs. I don't know why or how, but it is. Kaiten averages significantly lower than a normal Jinpu there, even though that'd never be true anywhere else.

I've done anywhere from 2k to 9k or so damage on them, with an average at like 4000 without any DAs. Which is like 1.5-2x more damage than Kaiten averages on them... Adding on a DA or two you'll see some in the 6000-9000 range.

Also, the 9xxx Jinpu screen shot I saw on the SAM forum was done by a SAM that didn't have a relic iirc. So that dispels it all together anyway.

[Max™]

Wow, that's pretty wicked shit.

Man, that's kind of screwed up that 3x can't kick in during WS, but it can for Barrage and Jump and shit... at least it should happen for the relic WS.

[evilpaul]

Sexy, <3 Elf girls, but... please tell me thats a stage 4 relic sword too... the rest of the gear is so nice, that can't be a Durandal can it?

no, it's not a work-in-progress excalibur.

[Starr]

Not the first Durandal/Aegis PLD on Hades and I doubt the last. . .

[finale23]

http://img129.imageshack.us/img129/1...165916aew9.jpg
http://img129.imageshack.us/img129/1...165935atk8.jpg
Epic's first, took forever to finish lol

holyshit, ameyna still plays? is miah still on hades as well?

[evilpaul]

holyshit, ameyna still plays? is miah still on hades as well?

Yep, he's still here as well.

[finale23]

holyshit, ameyna still plays? is miah still on hades as well?

Yep, he's still here as well.

how about brimestonne? congratz your ls on the relic btw.

[Yuffy~]

I've been testing out the sword strap with good results.

Oh god ...

110 dex w/o using dex rings, or earrings, or food, or anything silly like that. Just good old taru dex, and I prefer to not use alkys and Byrnie +1. With /war I manage to get a solid amount of crit WS's, very happy with the build so far.

so i guess that understanding a job/game takes more time than funding a relic, sadness these days, sadness ...

[Zalius]

is that jealousy i hear

[Demosthenes11]

to be fair, shouldn't you notice that you never crit WSs after using a dex build for 100+ WS?

[Max™]

Well, Kaiten with that build might be kind of flukey and have a broad damage range.

I did that testing on Gigas Leeches I mentioned earlier.

100 Tp, No SA=980 +/- 20 every time.
100 Tp, SA=1100-1250 every time.
200 Tp, No SA=1400
200 Tp, SA=1800-1900

Steel Cyclone at least, does not crit without being forced too.

I can't hold it against Kareface though, cause brown pigtail taru girl is cute.

[RKenshin]

to be fair, shouldn't you notice that you never crit WSs after using a dex build for 100+ WS?

I don't think it's a matter of not seeing it, but more just a matter of thinking you see one when you're really just seeing a high pdif roll.

I know that if I didn't know better in regard to how the equations work and what a crit would really look like, as well as all the tests regarding this, I would swear that it seems like I can get crits. But it's just an illusion created by outliers.

But yeah, regardless, I don't think anyone has ever proven those original findings in regard to all WS being unable to crit (aside from ones with a crit mod) incorrect. It doesn't even seem possible to disprove, you could go WS on bunnies in ronfaure all day... And you'll never match the damage values of a SA + WS. You can't really explain why that is so any other way.

[Yuffy~]

is that jealousy i hear

how can you be jealous of an amano SAM WSing in full DEX and being happy for his/her crit % on WSs, seriously.

[Jaffar]

Its not like its an ALL out dex build- no osode, usu instead of byakko... I think it just happens to have a lot of DEX.

[Zanz L. Barre The 3rd]

I don't see why you're giving him shit for sword strap; as far as I'm concerned, if he/she can achieve a 6-hit set-up with it, go for it (although, I'm willing to bet Pole Strap would provide better overall results).

And yeah, theory craft regarding crits during non-crit WSs seems a bit questionable. You may be misunderstanding the gap of dmg affiliated with a lot of single hit WSs or disregarding double attack.

[Zanz L. Barre The 3rd]

is that jealousy i hear

how can you be jealous of an amano SAM WSing in full DEX and being happy for his/her crit % on WSs, seriously.

As they say in France, whoosh'd.