Stage 5 - Completed Relic Weapons List

[Eaglestrike]

Difference between me adding my 2 cents to something, and you, starting drama for nothing.

http://killingifrit.com/forums.php?m=po ... 06#2862306

Look at the thread, you basically start a giant derail of "Waawaa stop wasting other peoples currency" in a thread that's completely not about it.

And omgosh, you're doing it again, many moons later.

You mean in a thread that was about "relic weapon hidden effects" that had just as much misinformation as information? Yeah, so sorry for derailing that one, it was doing so much! 80hp/tick regen from KOTR, invincible effects! 50+ dmg shock spikes from polearm ws!

Edit: Oh yeah that guy was going on that the shock spikes gave 3-5s stuns too!

[Tekki]

Ya I need to start finding out what the actual proc % is. It doesnt seem to deviate from the norm to often but when it does it can either be annoing or outstanding.

Not sure what more I can add to this argument. Yet again, someone is debating relic. It was old over a year ago, and its stlll old. Fact: People will upgrade every relic until this game ends. Fact: There will always people that disagree with the choosen relic of another player. Fact: Its a dead horse subject.

EDIT: Looking at past results and doing quick calcs with proc %. Another thing is unaccounted add effect procs that get credited to other players. Those arnt in these calculations and I lose a few k per fight from it.
JoL: 9% proc
last Tiamat: 9.6%
Tiamat: 7.4%
Fafnir: 9%
Tiamat: 12.4%
Jormy: 10.6%
Cerberus: 7%

Its luck but it doesnt deviate too far from the 10% proc expectation on these HNM parses of mine.

[Jeryhn]

My argument was "this job makes use of it because of <xxx> which this other job does not have", meaning the application (which you brought up) only fits that job and not yours.

Only you're wrong, because RDMs can equip plenty of HP and accuracy gear. We might not get the effectiveness of the Homam set, or have the natural bonuses of the PLD job towards the weapon, it doesn't mean that we can't gear appropriately for the weapon, or that an RDM upgrading Excalibur is any less worthwhile than a PLD upgrading Excalibur.

I've never said Excalibur is entirely worthless, I've actually posted a number of times that I would like to have one, but I'm more of a DD so my PLD is already semi-DD and therefore would be effective with it. Unlike PLD's that tank in Excal.

...Which goes along the whole "gearing yourself around the weapon" argument.

Is it just me or are you not paying attention?

As above I only have a problem with pretty much completely useless upgrades, staff/club being melee weapons on mage jobs, Ragnarok being as close to an HQ Subduer as you can get and Excal on someone who tanks (or can't melee:rdm) so I don't see the hypocrisy.

I have a problem with a THF who thinks he's anything other than a TH whore. Does this make me wrong about how well a THF can exploit the power of a Mandau? Fuck yea it does.

Considering you need 15k (after the refund) currency for one weapon and only need 1 venomous claw for one scorp harness, yes v claws are in fact quite a bit more rare.

Oh, so you agree that Claws are more rare than Dynamis Currency?

How are those terms I'd understand? Wyrm Mail would be far more useless on a non-drg. Now if a GM came and offered to let RDM body or DRG body drop, I'd say loldrg and choose RDM body to drop.

Except that wouldn't happen, and even if you don't like it and make noise about it, people will still upgrade whatever relic they want. Bitch and complain all you want, yes we understand certain relics are better than others, especially in the hands of certain jobs, but not all of us are upgrading relics. Very few, in fact. Most people can largely care less that a Dagger upgrader has to compete for currency against a Staff upgrader.

Because the blm gets no application aside from "status" and "I can melee too weak mobs!", yes.

This statement shows why you're retarded for trying to bring this argument here. This game and these forums are largely about "status". Many MMOs are about being better than another player or group at doing something. High time you accepted this fact.

[qatsi2]

You know, Eaglestrike, I bet there are upgraders on your server that play more than you. You should stop upgrading because they will get more hours of playtime out of it than you will. It's simple math, and you either need to start popping the Nodoze or cede to the more worthy player.

[Ryko]

That's nice, but how does it make the people pretty much calling the piece a waste incorrect? I mean sentimentality is fine and all, it doesn't make the piece suddenly worthwhile though, it just happens to be a piece of shit that is very dear to someone.

[Eaglestrike]

You know, Eaglestrike, I bet there are upgraders on your server that play more than you. You should stop upgrading because they will get more hours of playtime out of it than you will. It's simple math, and you either need to start popping the Nodoze or cede to the more worthy player.

There is a difference between "applied usage" and "ability to apply usage". I don't like the latter and what you just said applies to the former.

Only you're wrong, because RDMs can equip plenty of HP and accuracy gear. We might not get the effectiveness of the Homam set, or have the natural bonuses of the PLD job towards the weapon, it doesn't mean that we can't gear appropriately for the weapon, or that an RDM upgrading Excalibur is any less worthwhile than a PLD upgrading Excalibur.

RDM can't get close to a PLD with Homam on in terms of total HP, accuracy and haste. Tekki parses well because of the total combination of it, if he was on RDM he'd do significantly less damage and be less useful in that slot than a number of other jobs.

...Which goes along the whole "gearing yourself around the weapon" argument.

Is it just me or are you not paying attention?

And there are plenty of people who don't gear around the weapon or know how to gear around the weapon, but still do it. Those are what I call wastes, not the weapon entirely when it comes to Excal. But apparently I'm the one not paying attention?

I have a problem with a THF who thinks he's anything other than a TH whore. Does this make me wrong about how well a THF can exploit the power of a Mandau? Fuck yea it does.

Then you have a problem a number of other people do not see at all. Pretty much anyone who has seen a good THF knows they are more than a TH whore.

Oh, so you agree that Claws are more rare than Dynamis Currency?

This is a stupid argument. Are there more Scorpion Harnesses or relic weapons? I hope you can figure that one out.

Except that wouldn't happen, and even if you don't like it and make noise about it, people will still upgrade whatever relic they want. Bitch and complain all you want, yes we understand certain relics are better than others, especially in the hands of certain jobs, but not all of us are upgrading relics. Very few, in fact. Most people can largely care less that a Dagger upgrader has to compete for currency against a Staff upgrader.

Nor would I or any leader that isn't a complete asshole say "DRG AF2 FREE LOT" when there is a drg who needs.

People will still upgrade relics that are useless? Really? I didn't notice! Thanks for the enlightenment. The only reason I ever continue discussions like this is (well, other than being bored) because there are people out there with false beliefs in their relic making a difference.

This statement shows why you're retarded for trying to bring this argument here. This game and these forums are largely about "status". Many MMOs are about being better than another player or group at doing something. High time you accepted this fact.

And what improves a groups "status" more, being able to kill Fafnir faster than anyone else because of a Gjallarhorn, or the BLM swinging away at him with Claustrum?

[Jeryhn]

And yet, as I said, I have no delusions of grandeur about me upgrading an Excalibur making a difference. You seem to be hung up on the fact that I know this, and don't care, but you're trying to make me and still failing thus far.

To answer the status question, neither. Getting a Ridill to drop is the winner.

[NynJa]

This statement shows why you're retarded for trying to bring this argument here. This game and these forums are largely about "status". Many MMOs are about being better than another player or group at doing something. High time you accepted this fact.

And what improves a groups "status" more, being able to kill Fafnir faster than anyone else because of a Gjallarhorn, or the BLM swinging away at him with Claustrum?

I dont think Gjallarhorn will help you kill Fafnir faster, since usually if a BLM is nuking to the point they're expending all their MP, they generally wind up like *female you dislike*: face down ass up (or in the case of elvaan's, on their back w/ their legs spread).

[divisortheory]

I dont think Gjallarhorn will help you kill Fafnir faster, since usually if a BLM is nuking to the point they're expending all their MP, they generally wind up like *female you dislike*: face down ass up (or in the case of elvaan's, on their back w/ their legs spread).

NIN/BRD to the rescue!

[qatsi2]

Since relics aren't really needed on the kings, we should make a list of LS's that kill cop wyrms, do Bahamut v2, etc. Then, only members of those linkshells should be able to upgrade relics, because no one else has any applied usage for them.

I really don't think that invoking some "All for one, one for all!" server solidarity argument is going to get you your Mandau4Jesus any faster.

[Jeryhn]

Since relics aren't really needed on the kings, we should make a list of LS's that kill cop wyrms, do Bahamut v2, etc. Then, only members of those linkshells should be able to upgrade relics, because no one else has any applied usage for them.

Yeah, but they'd still be worthless because everyone kills CoP wyrms and Bahamut with jobs that'll be using either elemental staves or Kraken Clubs.

Well... I suppose relic weapons would be good for Hydra.

[Eaglestrike]

Since relics aren't really needed on the kings, we should make a list of LS's that kill cop wyrms, do Bahamut v2, etc. Then, only members of those linkshells should be able to upgrade relics, because no one else has any applied usage for them.

I really don't think that invoking some "All for one, one for all!" server solidarity argument is going to get you your Mandau4Jesus any faster.

I used that argument in response to someone elses argument, never said it's what I subscribe to. But if going by what you said I guess my Mandau is justified since my LS does those things!

[divisortheory]

And I've heard the proc is more like 5% on Excal, which means you lose damage...

Proc rate completely varies by mob level, it works like that with every add effect weapon (cept 100% proc stuff).


When I fight xp mobs, I get the poison effect every 1-3 mobs, but when I'm farming EP----, It'll go off 1-3 times per mob. And dont play the "well xp mobs go down quicker" card, cause EP's dont last longer than 30-35 seconds when I'm going all out..

Poison is a really bad additional effect to test with. The reason is that it's impossible for it to proc if the poison effect is already active. Sometimes I try to figure out what the poison proc rate is and I end up just getting pissed off, because I never know if my proc rate is just really low, or if the poison is just lasing a really time, thus not giving more chances for the proc.

[divisortheory]

Only ones "I DON'T LIKE" are:

1) Claustrum
2) Mjollnir
3) Ragnarok
4) Excalibur for a tank (i.e. they use it to tank and don't even attempt to DD, Soup right?)

Mjollnir would fucking own in a KRT WHM burn.

[Undeadhunter]

Only ones "I DON'T LIKE" are:

1) Claustrum
2) Mjollnir
3) Ragnarok
4) Excalibur for a tank (i.e. they use it to tank and don't even attempt to DD, Soup right?)

Mjollnir would fucking own in a KRT WHM burn.

and ragnarok is fun to play with :D (doing it atm)
WAR with ragnarok ftw !

[NynJa]

And I've heard the proc is more like 5% on Excal, which means you lose damage...

Proc rate completely varies by mob level, it works like that with every add effect weapon (cept 100% proc stuff).


When I fight xp mobs, I get the poison effect every 1-3 mobs, but when I'm farming EP----, It'll go off 1-3 times per mob. And dont play the "well xp mobs go down quicker" card, cause EP's dont last longer than 30-35 seconds when I'm going all out..

Poison is a really bad additional effect to test with. The reason is that it's impossible for it to proc if the poison effect is already active. Sometimes I try to figure out what the poison proc rate is and I end up just getting pissed off, because I never know if my proc rate is just really low, or if the poison is just lasing a really time, thus not giving more chances for the proc.

even on TW, it only lasts like 10 seconds.

[Gatsby]

Only ones "I DON'T LIKE" are:

1) Claustrum
2) Mjollnir
3) Ragnarok
4) Excalibur for a tank (i.e. they use it to tank and don't even attempt to DD, Soup right?)

Mjollnir would fucking own in a KRT WHM burn.

The owner of the Mjollnir on Titan used to KRT with MNKs and he put out respectable numbers. Mjollnir with offhand Kraken. I never partied with him but he had all the great DD WHM gear though.

[Toth]

Only ones "I DON'T LIKE" are:

1) Claustrum
2) Mjollnir
3) Ragnarok
4) Excalibur for a tank (i.e. they use it to tank and don't even attempt to DD, Soup right?)

Mjollnir would fucking own in a KRT WHM burn.

The owner of the Mjollnir on Titan used to KRT with MNKs and he put out respectable numbers. Mjollnir with offhand Kraken. I never partied with him but he had all the great DD WHM gear though.

That's what I mean by playing style. That WHM may just love to be a DD WHM for whatever reason and the Mjollnir fit his needs. If it brings him a reason to love the game and its not hurting anyone (if you don't have a good dynamis shell getting you coins, why bother anyway), then again, I wish them well. I admire people who follow through with their dreams, no matter what people from other servers love to spout as gospel.

[Rocl]

Upgrading Claustrum to piss Eaglestrike off.
Come now Sendoh! Clearly I deserve a staff to compliment Xavier's shield!

[Ryko]

I dont get how what server you're on changes what pieces are a joke.