Unclaimed NMs!

[Demosthenes11]

60 hours over 6 months = 2 hours a week on average < 13+ hours a week needed for your salvage math

[Thorny]

60 hours over 6 months = 2 hours a week on average < 13+ hours a week needed for your salvage math

Really? I didn't notice that.


Are you retarded? Do you think salvage gear would be at all rare without the 1 day restriction? People would spam it back to back until they got their crap.. day restrictions are the major cockblocks for almost anything >_> Better yet, would people still care about ebodies if kings had back to back 3 hour windows instead of a 21h cooldown?

[Cairthenn]

Would definitely say a Macha's Coat takes less time (on average) to get than Nashira Seraweels unless you are purchasing Seraweels. If you're going with a Linkshell (the only other option for Ultima really), you have to deal with prerequisites, drop rate, and the fact that most would prefer Apollyon anyways.

[Demosthenes11]

Really? I didn't notice that.


Are you retarded? Do you think salvage gear would be at all rare without the 1 day restriction? People would spam it back to back until they got their crap.. day restrictions are the major cockblocks for almost anything >_> Better yet, would people still care about ebodies if kings had back to back 3 hour windows instead of a 21h cooldown?

i think you are making a horribly bad assumption thinking that everyone that wants coat solo/duos arrapago almost every day. I'd say most people that do salvage do it in a set, which means a 4 zone rotation most of the time (differs based on need ofc). So lets say you go 6 days a week on average, and do a 4 zone rotation and you need to beat out 1 person on the coat. suddenly, it takes 8x as long to get a coat on average, not to mention you have outliers like neo or sath's wife that take almost 2 years to get their body.

idk why you are really making this argument >.> does someone complaining about macha body drop rate really hurt you?

[Cairthenn]

i think you are making a horribly bad assumption thinking that everyone that wants coat solo/duos arrapago almost every day. I'd say most people that do salvage do it in a set, which means a 4 zone rotation most of the time (differs based on need ofc). So lets say you go 6 days a week on average, and do a 4 zone rotation and you need to beat out 1 person on the coat. suddenly, it takes 8x as long to get a coat on average, not to mention you have outliers like neo or sath's wife that take almost 2 years to get their body.

idk why you are really making this argument >.> does someone complaining about macha body drop rate really hurt you?

But you could.

..and it's just being bored and wanting to argue, all the internet ever is.

[Demosthenes11]

well you could change the focus of your ls too if you have shitty ultima drop rates, not to mention with 20 people attending limbus on average you could pump out an omega every other time and an ultima every 3 runs.

im not making a judgment call either way here, im just saying this is a really stupid argument lol

[Shinryuu]

idk why you are really making this argument >.> does someone complaining about macha body drop rate really hurt you?

When they shouldn't be bitching? Yeah.

[pchan]

i think you are making a horribly bad assumption thinking that everyone that wants coat solo/duos arrapago almost every day. I'd say most people that do salvage do it in a set, which means a 4 zone rotation most of the time (differs based on need ofc). So lets say you go 6 days a week on average, and do a 4 zone rotation and you need to beat out 1 person on the coat. suddenly, it takes 8x as long to get a coat on average, not to mention you have outliers like neo or sath's wife that take almost 2 years to get their body.

idk why you are really making this argument >.> does someone complaining about macha body drop rate really hurt you?

Salvage IS designed to be done once a day. If you don't do it as much as you can you are not entitled to complain about droprates. Did you seriously expect SE to give a 25% droprate on item that is as easily farmed as a nyzul bodies ?

[Demosthenes11]

jfc im not even complaining about macha body drop rate (hell i got it on my 20th or so arra), im just saying that calling nashira legs drop rate miles worse is a real stretch.

and 6 times a week is a real stretch too considering even the most dedicated players have shit to do on some days or their significant other actually wants to spend time with them >.>

[Thorny]

well you could change the focus of your ls too if you have shitty ultima drop rates, not to mention with 20 people attending limbus on average you could pump out an omega every other time and an ultima every 3 runs.

20 people means more people interested in legs, i can make a pickup arra that'll pass macha's coat to me in under an hour every time(guess what, it's because i did it when i was getting my coat.. 1/216 and i didn't complain throughout it because it's still a statistically common drop)

good luck getting pickup groups to reliably win temenos zones and pickups to do ultima with that don't want your legs and won't wipe

[Airenn]

I lost some respect for you when you posted your gear. Lost some more when you whined about macha's coat droprate(seeing as it's the most common 35 in salvage). A bit more when you complained about RDM hat, some when you implied your mule was better than mine.. just lost the last bit when you thought that was serious.

See? Now I know you're joking, you come across clear when you want to!

[Demosthenes11]

20 people means more people interested in legs, i can make a pickup arra that'll pass macha's coat to me in under an hour every time(guess what, it's because i did it when i was getting my coat.. 1/216 and i didn't complain throughout it because it's still a statistically common drop)

good luck getting pickup groups to reliably win temenos zones and pickups to do ultima with that don't want your legs and won't wipe

so you are assuming freelot on legs and everyone being able to manifest a group of people willing to give you macha body with little luck, as well as not being in a static that has multiple people wanting the same pieces (there are more drops in salvage than macha coat)

[pchan]

Doing salvage everyday doesn't mean with the same static every day. At one point mdk was doing JP pickup runs several times a week and going with 2 different groups. If you have an alt, you can also use it in the group runs when they don't do the zone you need, assuming your alt has a needed job, saving you a permit for personal runs.

[Thorny]

so you are assuming freelot on legs and everyone being able to manifest a group of people willing to give you macha body with little luck, as well as not being in a static that has multiple people wanting the same pieces (there are more drops in salvage than macha coat)

a long-existing static will be capped on them, if you aren't using a static you can easily shout and get a party of 6 that can reliably kill all 4 QQ and will pass coat

i never said freelot on legs, i said averages.. next pair of legs that drops will be mine unless i miss epic amounts of limbus runs between now and then, it doesn't change that the average is lower because the other people who want them aren't getting a shot at that pair

[FailureMidgard]

It's an insanely unfair comparison to go with spammed Arrapagos (including pick-ups) and not Ultimas. If we want to assume pickups, then do some shout Temenos runs. Let's say your shell has what, 9 people to kill Ultima comfortably? And we'll say 2 of those 9 have a mule?

Day1 - Mule1 organizes a pickup Temenos Tower. Main 1 lots chip. Mule2 organizes a pickup Temenos Tower. Main 5 lots chip. Main9 organizes a pickup Temenos Tower. Main 9 lots chip. Main 1-4 do Central Temenos. Main 5-8 do Central Temenos.
Day4 - Main 5-9 do Central Temenos. Ultima Set is complete. 2 mules get 2 chips. Main 1-4 start next set.
Day 8 - (This is assuming 2xweek, not every 3 days) Ultima. 2 mules get 2 chips.
Day 11 - 2 mules get 2 chips. Complete Ultima set.
Day 15 - Ultima. I'm not mentioning chips anymore, because you should have -tons- of t1 chips.
Day 18 - 2/3 Ultima.
Day 22 - Finish Ultima, 1/3 next set.
Day 25 - Ultima.
Day 29 - Finish Ultima.
Day 32 - Ultima.

You are seriously delusional if you think popping QQThs is that much harder than tier1 Temenos. Neither is hard, and a pug can most definitely do both. Your argument is oversimplifying it greatly. Ya, your friends you do shit with probably want homam. Guess what, they probably want drops in other salvage zones too. I guess you can go with Mdk's idea and do Arrapago every day, but I don't think everyone has a mule to do that with, and that is kinda extreme.
In any case, if you drop to doing it regularly (every 3 days until your soap gets too late, then let it roll over), I'd say you can easily do 4 Ultimas per month with a 9 man group (assuming Ultima is 9mannable, I've never tried to lowman him, but I seem to recall reading that was ideal #?).

[pchan]

There is a BIG difference. You need /shouts groups to give up the *only* worthwhile drop to you or your mule, for every zone. In a pickup arrapago run others are lotting other worthwile drop, which have the same value as machas's coat. Being able to lot random AF upgrade material is not on par with being able to lot hikazu hakama or deimos cuirass.

Also you can hit the jackpoat every salvage pickup, while you can only hit the jackpot in limbus every ultima.

[Thorny]

You are seriously delusional if you think popping QQThs is that much harder than tier1 Temenos.

I don't. I think finding pickups willing to do tier1 temenos is harder than finding pickups willing to do AR. There's precious little incentive unless they need a specific AF+1 mat, most of which is outdated. Same goes for your linkshell's willingness to spam ultima and skip omega.

Ya, your friends you do shit with probably want homam. Guess what, they probably want drops in other salvage zones too.

This is assuming too much, really. To make a basic comparison, you need to look at the events and not anyone's specific group. I'm sure there are people in existing shells with unholy points that can decide they want nash legs anytime and gank them from next ultima, but that's not a fair example of their difficulty to obtain. Pickup salvage is viable, pickup limbus is not.

Pretty sure when Thorny and Pchan are both disagreeing with you for the same reason, you should just give it up, lest the world implode.

[FailureMidgard]

I don't. I think finding pickups willing to do tier1 temenos is harder than finding pickups willing to do AR. There's precious little incentive unless they need a specific AF+1 mat, most of which is outdated. Same goes for your linkshell's willingness to spam ultima and skip omega.


This is assuming too much, really. To make a basic comparison, you need to look at the events and not anyone's specific group. I'm sure there are people in existing shells with unholy points that can decide they want nash legs anytime and gank them from next ultima, but that's not a fair example of their difficulty to obtain. Pickup salvage is viable, pickup limbus is not.

Pretty sure when Thorny and Pchan are both disagreeing with you for the same reason, you should just give it up, lest the world implode.

I don't understand how you say AF+1 is obsolete, there's still a ton of useful stuff there, situational sure, but good items. Past that, from my experience, I've actually seen a lot of shout temenos, and never any shout apollyon. Partly because as you say, most shells like their Omegas.
Also, for calling the chip the only useful drop seems crazy to me, I used to be part of a lowman limbus group that didn't care about ultima at all, we capped on homam, and kept running for coins to sell (pretty good coin splits when you go with 3-4) and af+1 mateirals. I tried to get people to pay stupid low amounts for temenos chips, and never could find anyone to take me up on the offer.

[Fottiti]

I don't understand how you say AF+1 is obsolete, there's still a ton of useful stuff there, situational sure, but good items. Past that, from my experience, I've actually seen a lot of shout temenos, and never any shout apollyon. Partly because as you say, most shells like their Omegas.
Also, for calling the chip the only useful drop seems crazy to me, I used to be part of a lowman limbus group that didn't care about ultima at all, we capped on homam, and kept running for coins to sell (pretty good coin splits when you go with 3-4) and af+1 mateirals. I tried to get people to pay stupid low amounts for temenos chips, and never could find anyone to take me up on the offer.

Except the main point was that it will be much harder to get a pickup group for Temenos Farming in comparison to Salvage, which is true. There are useful AF+1 pieces out there, but the majority of it is useless and most jobs have 1-2 pieces at most that have any application.

Unless you are part of a decently sized and well organized group of people, you will get machas coat more easily than you will nashira legs by the difference in design of the 2 events.

[Wulfgang]

There is a BIG difference. You need /shouts groups to give up the *only* worthwhile drop to you or your mule

There are an enormous amount of people who need Temenos AF items. Your average Whitegate, NQ player without cerebral palsy would likely have a pretty strong interest in /seacom or free lot Temenos items.