Endgame BST

[Runningdemon]

It's still utterly retarded to think a BST would have Sword merited. I thought this was a question about best BST DD possibility, in which case Man/Temp > Temp(Man)/Ridill still, because once again, see that broadside of a barn, BST is gonna be lucky to hit 1/2 hits with Ridill and sushi. I'll stick with my Man/Temp and swing 4-5 times an attack.

[Ryko]

It's just as retarded to assume that a BST is going to be given a ridill on their BST as opposed to their being given a ridill for another job then level BST, what's your point? We're already accepting the given that the BST has the thing, why not add some plausability to it?

Oh I get it, because it closes the gap with a logical justification behind it, it's stupid right...

Like I said, a better platform would be bringing up how much more a hit dual axe would likely do. But keep ignoring it and stick to the acc point, that'll do you good

Here comes the "LEVEL IT TO 75 THEN TALK" rehash

[Runningdemon]

Then why do you parade BST-Ridill around as godly? If they are never going to get it, there must be a reason, besides they are lolBST. Maybe it is because since the introduction of Sea weapons, there are better options?

Hell, can BST us Mec. Cris? If so, that would be even better cause of higher base dagger skill. You are the one here bringing up how BST Ridill would be better than BST Man/Wood and no one is agreeing with you from a numbers perspective or from a BST perspective.

LOL I CAN TALK SMALL TOO!

[aurik]

mkris blows because of low damage.

[kawkawkaw]

lol@people arguing with Ryko on DD'ing, lurk moar

[Ryko]

Then why do you parade BST-Ridill around as godly? If they are never going to get it, there must be a reason, besides they are lolBST. Maybe it is because since the introduction of Sea weapons, there are better options?

Never said godly, said doable with miniscule differences in total damage output if even that. They didn't give BST-only's ridills before sea was around too, and lastly it's because 4 of the other 5 jobs that can use it put it to (from arguably to much) better use.

And yeah, d... what, 8? vs d40...

[Demetrick]

It's just as retarded to assume that a BST is going to be given a ridill on their BST as opposed to their being given a ridill for another job then level BST, what's your point? We're already accepting the given that the BST has the thing, why not add some plausability to it?

Oh I get it, because it closes the gap with a logical justification behind it, it's stupid right...

Like I said, a better platform would be bringing up how much more a hit dual axe would likely do. But keep ignoring it and stick to the acc point, that'll do you good

Here comes the "LEVEL IT TO 75 THEN TALK" rehash

So if the BST was given the Ridill on a number of other jobs, why would they still chose to merit sword on another job?
Rng sword merits?
Thf sword merits?
Blm sword merits?
War sword merits?

Axe merits only.

[Lordwafik]

I know of one bst who got ridill/adaberk (when he was bst only), the only reason he meritted sword was he turned into a warrior after a few months.

Not even ridill is reason enough to give a bst sword merits, it'll give it a little push but it's just not worth using over axe due to the greatness of the two weapons.

Then again it all depends what you fight. I wouldnt use it on my bst say, mamook/trolls, but I'd probably try it in the mire, or on demons(i was surprised at how lackluster their evasion is when I went to U.range the other day) , soloing T mobs, farming, and see how I go, but at the end i'd probably end up just going axe/temp untill my virtue stones finish if it were xp mobs.

[Lily]

I doubt I'll ever ever get a ridill, but I'm not bothered. Could only use on my bst, so probably a waste anyway. ;x

However, temperance axe is very funky. :O I really like this, except virtue stones really do get used up fast. I wish you could stack them. Have a little virtue pouch, 12x99. :> Maybe that's asking for too much.

And RunningDemon I remember doing precisely the same as you, getting tp for spirits using Seiryu's sword. Then I lvled rdm to be more useful to ls. I've been cursed ever since..

[SamanosukeShiva]

Temperance Axe > Ridill, the DA proc rate of Temp Axe is ridiculously high.

[epigram]

Just from observations of fighting jhun with no acc, or as rdm/bst with about 20 acc, your percentage hits would be around 70% for most T-low VT mobs.

That's not so bad when you consider that ridill gives around 2.01 hits per round with brutal (actually I think it's less, but I have yet to see any actual evidence if it is 1*.25 + 2*.5 + 3*.25 or 1*.5 +2*.25 + 3*.25, so I'll choose the highest one).

With A- skill and 50 acc your going to have around 90% acc on the same mobs.

So for a bst maneater/ridill you are looking at 1.05 * .9 + 2.01 * .7 =2.35 hits per round.

For maneater/temp you are looking at 1.05* .9 + 1.55* .9 = 2.34.

Now this isn't really fair since ridill has lower delay if we look at tp per 100 delay of each weapon we have around 31.6 tp per 100 delay for the man/ridill combo and 31.3 tp per 1000 delay for the man/temp combo.

So, supprisingly if ridill really has an average of 2 attacks per round, then it's tp gain is the same as temp. However, dot would be considerably better on the side of man/temp since the attack difference between swords and axes still does exist. Ridill would also lower expected WS damage.

Temp/Ridill would be an interesting combo though, but I would be much happier with Guttler/Temp

edit: typo

[Jaffar]

Considering I usually solo when I'm on bst, fighting Tish mobs, I don't see accuracy being an issue with a sword at all, especially if im popping tuna sushi & have halfway respectable gear.

If you wanna argue temp> ridill on meripo fodder, that would be a sounder arguement.

[solsovly]

Considering I usually solo when I'm on bst, fighting Tish mobs, I don't see accuracy being an issue with a sword at all, especially if im popping tuna sushi & have halfway respectable gear.

If you wanna argue temp> ridill on meripo fodder, that would be a sounder arguement.

Why would you pop tuna sushi when fighting T mobs?

[Jaffar]

for the CHR, i typically merit on tigers vs. tigers & even with sushi, i have a fair # of resists.

[Demetrick]

for the CHR, i typically merit on tigers vs. tigers & even with sushi, i have a fair # of resists.

Tigers vs Tigers where?

[Lordwafik]

Only EM/T tigers I can think of at the top of my head is in Aydeewa, but that one looked like link heaven.

[epigram]

My argument was actually about exp PT. For trivial eva T -> VT mobs Ridill is going to do a bit worse than temp simply because of your loss of 60+ attack if you use a sword. Ridill also has no extra bonus that can compensate for this when axes and ridill are slashing weapons.

Now when your approaching capped pdif then ridill will probably out-shine temp, but as eva and attack move beyond non trivial levels then ridill becomes a giant low damage fan.

[Jaffar]

yeah, its aydeewa, in crystal eater's room (nice bonus of popping him from time to time).

it can get hairy if you're not careful, but there's a cluster of 2, 3, 2, and 1 solo tiger spread around the room, with a few marlboro's scattered about. I just pay attention to my kill order & links have never been a problem.

[solsovly]

yeah, its aydeewa, in crystal eater's room (nice bonus of popping him from time to time).

it can get hairy if you're not careful, but there's a cluster of 2, 3, 2, and 1 solo tiger spread around the room, with a few marlboro's scattered about. I just pay attention to my kill order & links have never been a problem.

I'm assuming you go /whm for paralyna. How is the xp there? I treid really briefly and it seemed pretty horrible (2.5-3kkish). I didn't spend much time learning the camp though as the risk was too high for the reward.

[Ryko]

It's just as retarded to assume that a BST is going to be given a ridill on their BST as opposed to their being given a ridill for another job then level BST, what's your point? We're already accepting the given that the BST has the thing, why not add some plausability to it?

Oh I get it, because it closes the gap with a logical justification behind it, it's stupid right...

Like I said, a better platform would be bringing up how much more a hit dual axe would likely do. But keep ignoring it and stick to the acc point, that'll do you good

Here comes the "LEVEL IT TO 75 THEN TALK" rehash

So if the BST was given the Ridill on a number of other jobs, why would they still chose to merit sword on another job?
Rng sword merits?
Thf sword merits?
Blm sword merits?
War sword merits?

Axe merits only.

16 from my 8 sword merits and 5 from my suppanomimi? Assuming very well that the BST wasn't given the ridill for his bst to begin with (which is a safe one to make) and had a much more capable melee job that they likely built around the weapon. Fine fine, "a ridill warrior turned BST", how's that.

Let's do the time warp again, could also apply to DRK.

Just from observations of fighting jhun with no acc, or as rdm/bst with about 20 acc, your percentage hits would be around 70% for most T-low VT mobs.

That's not so bad when you consider that ridill gives around 2.01 hits per round with brutal (actually I think it's less, but I have yet to see any actual evidence if it is 1*.25 + 2*.5 + 3*.25 or 1*.5 +2*.25 + 3*.25, so I'll choose the highest one).

With A- skill and 50 acc your going to have around 90% acc on the same mobs.

So for a bst maneater/ridill you are looking at 1.05 * .9 + 2.01 * .7 =2.35 hits per round.

For maneater/temp you are looking at 1.05* .9 + 1.55* .9 = 2.34.

Now this isn't really fair since ridill has lower delay if we look at tp per 100 delay of each weapon we have around 31.6 tp per 100 delay for the man/ridill combo and 31.3 tp per 1000 delay for the man/temp combo.

So, supprisingly if ridill really has an average of 2 attacks per round, then it's tp gain is the same as temp. However, dot would be considerably better on the side of man/temp since the attack difference between swords and axes still does exist. Ridill would also lower expected WS damage.

Temp/Ridill would be an interesting combo though, but I would be much happier with Guttler/Temp

edit: typo

Finally someone gets it, thank you.