How does your Dynamis LS Operate? (aka BLM/NIN vs BLM/RDM)

[Lithiani]

We use a THF/NIN puller w/ full evade gear and striders (hi Kayberry!) to tag the statue or other mob and run. The BLM alliance nukes the stones down and Sleep avatars, BST pets and other threats, or nuke down a single vanguard mob themselves. They also swing back to nuke down PLD and THF mobs to keep the melee alliances moving.

Melee alliances have 2 "DD" PTs, which optimally consist of WHM, THF, either a BRD or a RDM and 3 DDs. However we are often short of RDM (although rarely short of BRDs).

The third party in the melee alliance is the tank set, usually PLD PLD RDM NIN WHM BRD. The NINs pull mobs off the train and kite in towards the alliance, trying to time it so the melee are constantly fighting but with no overlap.

Usually there are 2 melee alliances, A1 and A2. Occasionally thursday runs are so light on members we only have 1 alliance, and occasionally we've had the numbers for A3.

Melee alliances are supposed to stay apart to reduce lag.

Sleepga is largely reserved for when pulls go bad, or for the wall of death in Xarcabard.

Xarca strategy as a whole is different, with the BLM alliance operating to snipe eyes for the most part. Most kite pulls are sacrfices, although the addition of striders makes kiting a lot easier on small pulls. NIN single-mob kiting is a lot more prevalent here.

[Kerberoz]

Puddings? I sub RDM on puddings and never even buff. Just gravity and nuke. When you never get hit, you never need to waste time buffing at all.

I've seen BLM/NIN in dynamis. We never let them use it again because it's completely worthless. They die twice as often because they get raped by unblinkable AoEs then run around expecting other people to cure them. Fuck that, I'm not curing a BLM/NIN. Stoneskin is 350 HP absorbed if you're not gimped and carry around MND gear... and it absorbs everything, not just a select few AoEs.

Believe it or not, some jobs really should not sub NIN.

[Suiram]

Don't get me wrong, I know blm/nin serves it's purposes, but when people claim it's far superiour than other SJ's that offer something diverse other than just shadows, that's what I don't agree with.

The thing is, in this thread nobody is doing that. A few people are saying that BLM/NIN can work *just as well* as the other subjobs in many situations, while others like the poster above me are saying flat-out that it sucks when they clearly don't understand how to make it work.

[Fng]

sig explain plz!!

How does nightmare bunny defeat nightmare bunny?

[Suiram]

sig explain plz!!

How does nightmare bunny defeat nightmare bunny?

No clue, that's why I screenshotted it and put it in there. We were overrun with bunnies at the time. I think I've seen a glitch like that before when a MNK killshots with a Counter? Possibly that's what happened.

[Seditedi]

Why would you wanna even bother blink tanking a pudding? They have double attack and can wipe your shadows and continue to own you.. lol You don't need shadows if you don't get hit, which is why /RDM is far superior. I think the BLMs that say /NIN is better for solo are the ones that have shit for enfeebling gear (or none at all). I do have the occasional resist bind, but almost never resist gravity (269 enfeebling magic, w/ no merits), the last few times I've gone soloing to cap back up my exp I did not get one resist on gravity in about 20k exp.

How is Utsusemi worth losing Cures, Blink, Stoneskin, and Shell II? Sometimes you'll get hit by an unlucky Ga III, possibly even Thundaga III and as BLM/NIN I'd never survive it without stoneskin and shell II.... I use Sorcerer's Ring w/ Convert HP to MP gear to make it always active for BLM @ 562 HP as a Taru, no way in hell BLM/NIN is worth using.

The other issue with /NIN, you guys are saying you rely on Bind and Sleeps between nukes etc.. that uses more MP, so your argument about blink/stoneskin wasting MP is invalid because your just wasting it with sleep spells. Sleep 19 MP, Sleep II 29 MP. Blink 20 MP, Stoneskin 29 MP.... 1 MP saved wooo. lol.

Drain recast is 1 minute without fast cast, that is a hardly reliable way of supporting your HP if you do take a few hits.

[Charitwo]

I think the BLMs that say /NIN is better for solo are the ones that have shit for enfeebling gear (or none at all).

lol

edit: nvm

[Suiram]

I think the BLMs that say /NIN is better for solo are the ones that have shit for enfeebling gear (or none at all).

lol

Wait til Suiram see's this

Heh, I actually overlooked that. Anyhow, this guy continues to demonstrate that he simply doesn't understand how to play /NIN; and I'm not really inclined to spell it out for him. Or maybe it's because I only get 268 enfeebling in ToAU areas to his 269 that I'm forced to gimp myself with /nin.

[Seditedi]

I resist bind and sleep plenty enough (not a lot, but once every 4-5 pudding I'd say), but when that happens it doesn't matter, just put up Ni and try another sleep spell, etc.

Is where I got the idea you had shitty enfeebling gear, regardless, we're not arguing the issue of how to play BLM/NIN, we're arguing that BLM/RDM is far superior. 3 Shadows is nothing, and why would you blink attacks if you can simply not even be attacked with BLM/RDM...... lol.

[Suiram]

Not quite, my argument is that you don't know how to play BLM/NIN, which is why you feel incorrectly that BLM/RDM is far superior. Look, neither of us get hit by puddings, you because you run away with gravity, me because utsusemi absorbs a shadow while i'm standing there nuking. Neither of us dies more than the other in Dynamis, because my shadows eat mobs' AoE TP moves and attack rounds while you let stoneskin absorb it and then cure yourself back up the rest. I don't really plan on mothering you and explaining in detail how one works just as well as the other, since personally I am comfortable in the knowledge that I'm right.

[Seditedi]

lol... if you think not being able to heal yourself in Dynamis must be far superior then you've got serious problems.

[Awoir]

lol... if you think not being able to heal yourself in Dynamis must be far superior then you've got serious problems.

He didn't say far superior I think. He's just saying he plays BLM/NIN and doesn't take damage, you play BLM/RDM and don't take damage. You both blow stuff up, why is anyone complaining?

[Seditedi]

lol... if you think not being able to heal yourself in Dynamis must be far superior then you've got serious problems.

He didn't say far superior I think. He's just saying he plays BLM/NIN and doesn't take damage, you play BLM/RDM and don't take damage. You both blow stuff up, why is anyone complaining?

I just think that losing 90% of your sub job spells/abilities is worthless when you way out the Pros and Cons of both subs.
/NIN gets Utsusemi...
/RDM or /WHM gets... well a whole lot more

[Suiram]

/NIN gets Utsusemi...
/RDM or /WHM gets... well a whole lot more

awesome argument, dude

[Devek]

Utsusemi is more than 3 blinks.

If you start with Ichi thats 3 blinks.
You can recast ichi while taking hits for another 3 blinks.
You can cast Ni the moment your last blink goes down, thats another 3 blinks.

Usually if you're not solo, the moment you go through 9 blinks you've either lost hate or the mob is dead or slept by someone else.

Interesting fact.. mnk/nin out parses mnk/war by like 4:1 in places like Dynamis-Windurst. AoE stun moves are nasty and annoying, Utsusemi is the only way to mitigate it. I suppose a black mage can stand out of AoE range and not get stunned all the time, but shit happens ya know?

I don't care about the discussion at hand really, I'm just bored.

[Kaylia]

You're gonna rely on 1 drain per 40 seconds? lol

Then again, I guess you're one of the blms that never resist on drain/aspir/nukes/sleeps either. Or never make mistakes. I love those blms, always wish I could be one

1 drain every minute would be more than enough to keep my hp full, but like I said, I will rarely need it. You wont get hit often on blm/nin if you play correctly and when you do, it's usually because you screwed up

You never get resisted on gravity? I've the same tool as a blm/rdm, minus gravity, which is more than enough to keep me alive. Utsu:ni can be used as an emergency, you can just run 15 sec till it cast a spell, you can sleep 50% of the time. Surviving isnt a problem when something goes wrong, and you can kill about as fast.


I've all 3 subs, but /nin is what I use solo, and it works just as well when you do it right. When I'm in group, I usually go /whm unless dispel/grav are needed.

Don't get me wrong, I know blm/nin serves it's purposes, but when people claim it's far superiour than other SJ's that offer something diverse other than just shadows, that's what I don't agree with.

Not "far superior", I wouldnt make such a claim. However, it's better against pudding imo for both survival and chaining. Not having to run or stun ancient/IV.

Puddings? I sub RDM on puddings and never even buff. Just gravity and nuke. When you never get hit, you never need to waste time buffing at all.

It would be believable if pudding wouldnt engage 50% of the time with DoT moves. You will have to stoneskin those either way. You will have to stun a bunch of crap too

I've seen BLM/NIN in dynamis. We never let them use it again because it's completely worthless. They die twice as often because they get raped by unblinkable AoEs then run around expecting other people to cure them. Fuck that, I'm not curing a BLM/NIN. Stoneskin is 350 HP absorbed if you're not gimped and carry around MND gear... and it absorbs everything, not just a select few AoEs.

Which "unblinkable aoe". Beside aga spell, everything I can think off is blinkable. You shouldnt get hit by those anyway if you pay a little attention to what happen around you. There is no reason why you should have to cure a blm/nin more than blm/rdm.

[Seditedi]

/NIN gets Utsusemi...
/RDM or /WHM gets... well a whole lot more

awesome argument, dude

Didn't think you were that stupid have to go into detail, but guess it had to be done.. lol

Protect II, Shell II, Stoneskin, Blink, Phalanx (/RDM), Cure III, Curaga II, Erase, Poisona, Paralyna etc. All of these spells from a mage sub > Utsusemi.

BLM serves other purposes in addition to nuking in Dynamis such as Cures, status effect removal etc. /NIN cannot do any of that. Its worthless, solo it can work like you said, but BLM/NIN in dynamis is a very poor choice for a sub. I'd never heal a BLM/NIN asking to be healed. lol.

[Suiram]

We weren't talking about other aspects, we were talking about survivability, and utsusemi negates the need for protect 2, shell 2, stoneskin, blink, and phalanx. I never ask to be healed as BLM/NIN, and if the BLMs in your LS do they're evidently as bad as you are.

[Kaylia]

How is Utsusemi worth losing Cures, Blink, Stoneskin, and Shell II? Sometimes you'll get hit by an unlucky Ga III, possibly even Thundaga III and as BLM/NIN I'd never survive it without stoneskin and shell II.... I use Sorcerer's Ring w/ Convert HP to MP gear to make it always active for BLM @ 562 HP as a Taru, no way in hell BLM/NIN is worth using.

Using gear to activate sorcerer ring only work for taru >_>. For me, it's actually easier to activate ugallpih pendant on /nin. On /nin, you would probably have enough mp to survive aga tho.

The other issue with /NIN, you guys are saying you rely on Bind and Sleeps between nukes etc.. that uses more MP, so your argument about blink/stoneskin wasting MP is invalid because your just wasting it with sleep spells. Sleep 19 MP, Sleep II 29 MP. Blink 20 MP, Stoneskin 29 MP.... 1 MP saved wooo. lol.

Did you even read what I said multiple time? The only thing you will need on most fight against pudding is bind. That's 8mp. You won't have to stun nearly as often too (save 25mp for stun 1/2 of the fight)

Nuke nuke --> bind --> nuke and fight end 3/4 of the times, the last 1/4 will require an additional spell, but it's not really different than blm/rdm, where it wont go perfectly every time.

[Charitwo]

Can't really provide and input to this as my NIN still remains at 15, guess I should get it up there and try it for myself