How does your Dynamis LS Operate? (aka BLM/NIN vs BLM/RDM)

[Nystul]

I'd make the argument that he understands the game but is just trying to rationalize what is convenient to him. Every time I see someone say x job doesn't need y sub, it eventually comes out that the person just can't stand to level that job and is trying to make themselves feel better for not having it.

[Suiram]

I'd make the argument that he understands the game but is just trying to rationalize what is convenient to him. Every time I see someone say x job doesn't need y sub, it eventually comes out that the person just can't stand to level that job and is trying to make themselves feel better for not having it.

Heh, perhaps. But whether he doesn't understand the mechanics of the game, or understands them but chooses to ignore them to make himself feel better, you'll agree the end result is the same--at least for our purposes--right?

[Seditedi]

I'm now told that apparently Kerberoz has made posts on allakhazam BLM forums to the effect of "BLM doesn't need WHM sub" as well, so I'm content to put him in the 'doesn't understand the game' category.

Wow just wow... BLM/WHM is far more useful than BLM/RDM especially when you have to support other party members. If you think BLM doesn't need /WHM then there are some major problems with understanding of the game. Not having /NIN is debateable and I feel it is not required for any situation because of reasons I stated, but not having /WHM and thinking it is not required it just wow.. lol.

[aurik]

One of the main reasons I go everywhere as /whm is because all my blm friends are addicted to /rdm 8) A 3rd gravity doesn't do nearly as much as wide array of -na spells and raise.

[Kerberoz]

You think I don't intentionally keep WHM at lvl 1 with no exp whatsoever on it? It's useless unless you like being a support bitch.

And someone above asked... Faith: Umm... fairly obvious, no? Just kite/nuke and don't get hit by breakga. Fort... sac the kf'ghrahs and kite/nuke. Need gaiters on at least 2 people. Same for Ix'mnk with 3 triggers... hope you didn't think I meant one trigger; that's soloable.

I've still yet to hear when or why /NIN is ever better than /RDM. You're not a melee-Utsu-monkey. Quit trying to be one. Makes the job look undignified.

[aurik]

You think I don't intentionally keep WHM at lvl 1 with no exp whatsoever on it? It's useless unless you like being a support bitch.

And someone above asked... Faith: Umm... fairly obvious, no? Just kite/nuke and don't get hit by breakga. Fort... sac the kf'ghrahs and kite/nuke. Need gaiters on at least 2 people.

I've still yet to hear when or why /NIN is ever better than /RDM. You're not a melee-Utsu-monkey. Quit trying to be one.

The fact that you have 2 jobs at 75 and only a single sub for each of them tells me we can safely ignore your opinion.

[Kerberoz]

You think I don't intentionally keep WHM at lvl 1 with no exp whatsoever on it? It's useless unless you like being a support bitch.

And someone above asked... Faith: Umm... fairly obvious, no? Just kite/nuke and don't get hit by breakga. Fort... sac the kf'ghrahs and kite/nuke. Need gaiters on at least 2 people.

I've still yet to hear when or why /NIN is ever better than /RDM. You're not a melee-Utsu-monkey. Quit trying to be one.

The fact that you have 2 jobs at 75 and only a single sub for each of them tells me we can safely ignore your opinion.

Lol, k. Thanks for admitting defeat by not answering my question. Wait... are you saying you advocate COR/NIN too? LOL.

[aurik]

You think I don't intentionally keep WHM at lvl 1 with no exp whatsoever on it? It's useless unless you like being a support bitch.

And someone above asked... Faith: Umm... fairly obvious, no? Just kite/nuke and don't get hit by breakga. Fort... sac the kf'ghrahs and kite/nuke. Need gaiters on at least 2 people.

I've still yet to hear when or why /NIN is ever better than /RDM. You're not a melee-Utsu-monkey. Quit trying to be one.

The fact that you have 2 jobs at 75 and only a single sub for each of them tells me we can safely ignore your opinion.

Lol, k. Thanks for admitting defeat by not answering my question. Wait... are you saying you advocate COR/NIN too? LOL.

Thanks for admitting defeat by not even having WHM leveled for 2 75 jobs where it is considered an endgame requirement!

[ahjir_shiva]

after reading this thread im convinced that i been subbing the wrong sj for mnk

[Kerberoz]

I only play COR in merits. Now answer the question.

[aurik]

I only play COR in merits. Now answer the question.

Yes, apparently you like playing jobs to half their potential.

Have fun doing JFaith without shadows. He runs faster than 100% speed, doesn't have pathing glitches, and hits for 300+ (sometimes double-attacking). Unless you and your team are absolutely perfect at bouncing hate so that he NEVER gets an attack off, you'll be eating floor several times.

Oh yea he also casts quake2, which will floor you instantly if you don't have shadows. Same with stone4...you can outrun that one, but it's actually useful if you have shadows; you can blink it and use his casting time to cast spells.

In this case, /nin is way better than both whm and rdm: it will largely keep you from eating the floor.

Have fun doing J42 without shadows. Even sac'ing the kf'ghrah you have to deal with his reflect. Sure, 1 reflected spell takes you down to 300hp you say...but you could be at full hp and 2 shadows instead. Why be stupid?

Rdm doesn't even give you the ability to avoid or erase dots on yourself. Have fun losing your stoneskin to bio while you're trying to rest. With /nin you can blink it, or with whm you can erase it.

[Kerberoz]

Done faith multiple times with 3 BLM/RDM. Maybe you just lack the skill to play any job without the crutch of /NIN?

[Kaylia]

You think I don't intentionally keep WHM at lvl 1 with no exp whatsoever on it? It's useless unless you like being a support bitch.

And someone above asked... Faith: Umm... fairly obvious, no? Just kite/nuke and don't get hit by breakga. Fort... sac the kf'ghrahs and kite/nuke. Need gaiters on at least 2 people. Same for Ix'mnk with 3 triggers... hope you didn't think I meant one trigger; that's soloable.

I've still yet to hear when or why /NIN is ever better than /RDM. You're not a melee-Utsu-monkey.

Holy shit, you are not only useless, you are also mentally challenged. People already explained more than 10 times why /nin is better than /rdm in certain situation. Both sub are good, but they do have their own strength and weakness. You're not a melee, but you will get hit if you use your mp, and utsu does a much better job at keeping you alive than ss/blink will ever do. Not that you seem to have a damn clue how to use /nin efficiently, so continue repeating the same thing over and over.


I will bold it so you don't ask again.
/nin help you to live more easily than /rdm, it allows you to takes more risk and remove the dmg cap imposed by enmity. It allow you to get hit by many WS/spell/attack that would kill you on rdm

A dead blm/rdm is useless and one who isnt taking any risk isn't doing everything he can. When it applies, than /nin is better than /rdm. In any case, I've all 3 subs avaible, and I'm ready to change any time to use what the party need the most.




I havent done faith in awhile. I thought that one run fast and couldnt be gravity'd well since the nerf. Never did it with with less than 6 too, and we usually just melee zerg (cause you know, there is a large amount of mnk in sea when you do Faith >_>). In any case, /whm would be better than /rdm against jFa. Erase slowII if you get hit by WS, magic def, na spell...etc. You wont kill it fast, and I know it's gonna start resisting gravity after the first 3. I would like to see this one being trio'd

I don't see why you would need blm/rdm for fortitude with your technique. 2 blm/nin with herald gaiter could kite just the same. >_> 2 blm/nin and 1 brd/whm could probably trio it too. Brd can spam songs to slow it down. Hell, even whm/brd would work for this. In any case, saying /rdm is "needed" or goes better is stupid, especially when your strats involve 2 blm with gaiter.


Trio'ing ix'mnk doesnt require blm/rdm or gaiter, the only hard part is the suicide pull with 3.

[nivlakian]

There isn't an answer to your question Kerberoz because I don't think people are trying to mainly argue that /nin is better than /rdm always. The point to get across is that /nin is a viable sub for protecting yourself in dynamis (although we've strayed from the dynamis focus now).

In some cases /nin offers better protection against certain things and in other cases it does not which I outlined in my previous post. The things that truly hurt /nin are a rare enough occurence, fixable with meds (which a /rdm needs anyway), or are avoidable which allows for the sub to function. It would also depend on what functions the group truly needs (like making up for lack of particular mage jobs).

[Not Kuno]

The only time I ever /nin is for Fortitude and it owns.

This is the original comment.

BLM/NIN is useless for everything in the game except... soloing wyverns in Riverne 50 cap, and possibly KingV if you kill slow enough to get hit by more than 2 AOEs.

Jailer of Fortitude in 30 seconds.

To which you respond

Can do that with /RDM just fine. Stoneskin Blink Barthunder/Barblizzard.

Then we tear you mutiple new ones due to your close mindedness. But then all of a sudden you change your story.

On fort, you either have a full alliance so you kill the ghrahs with melee, or you go in a small manaburn and sac the ghrahs away.

So you've never even done the strategy youre arguing for? How the fuck would you know if something wont work if your rebuttle doesn't even exist. Of course you can kill the ghrahs and play it safe but if you do it the blm/nin way it's literally 30 seconds with maybe a death or two. I'm not saying /nin is the greatest thing ever useful at every event. But for this it's vastly superior.

Why make jailers harder than you have to? It's pointless. Ix'drk, Ix'drg, Ix'mnk, Fort, and Faith can all be killed by 3 BLM/RDMs.

I fail to see how killing it in 30 seconds with maybe 1 or 2 deaths is harder. Man I wish I lived in your wacky bazarro world.

I've still yet to hear when or why /NIN is ever better than /RDM. You're not a melee-Utsu-monkey. Quit trying to be one. Makes the job look undignified.

It sounds to me you just have some anger towards /nin. What something never done before is better then the accepted norm! WITCH BURN THEM AT THE STAKE!

[Seditedi]

You think I don't intentionally keep WHM at lvl 1 with no exp whatsoever on it? It's useless unless you like being a support bitch.

That was what did it for me, lol.

After hearing y'all out I still don't really agree with BLM/NIN for most circumstances, but in those rare cases where BLM won't have to toss some support cures or -na spells then I guess it'd be feasible. I just see Dynamis as one of those cases where BLM DOES need to help out with some support.
In cases where BLM does need to support, BLM/NIN is worthless for support for obvious reasons.

Kaylia, I think BLM/WHM and BLM/RDM both good for Faith /RDM for ES gravity order so that you can keep it gravitied at all times, and /WHM for some support and putting up bar-ra spell on your party, but yea BLM/NIN pretty poor for Faith.

[Kaylia]

Kaylia, I think BLM/WHM and BLM/RDM both good for Faith /RDM for ES gravity order so that you can keep it gravitied at all times, and /WHM for some support and putting up bar-ra spell on your party, but yea BLM/NIN pretty poor for Faith.

I'm doing faith atm on blm/nin Nothing special here for /nin, but it's not terrible either. I had hate most fight, and shadow were useful when you kite, it cast often enough to give you time to outrun/recast. All 3 subs kinda suck here tho, you don't have stona from whm, and it will rape your ss/blink/utsu.

I was blm/nin for hope and saved tank life by pulling hate on purpose after thundaga/silence WS. Didnt have a lot of ppl (9 i think and 1rdm/2whm/brd has only healer) and the fight lasted longer than usual. Didnt really need cure, only viruna once. I think I got hit twice in ~30hits. What rdm would have gave me here? Nothing probably

I just see Dynamis as one of those cases where BLM DOES need to help out with some support.

Blm/nin is generally the one that need the less support of the 3 in dyna >_>. Finish your sub and try it once or twice, you will see what I mean.

[nivlakian]

After hearing y'all out I still don't really agree with BLM/NIN for most circumstances, but in those rare cases where BLM won't have to toss some support cures or -na spells then I guess it'd be feasible. I just see Dynamis as one of those cases where BLM DOES need to help out with some support.
In cases where BLM does need to support, BLM/NIN is worthless for support for obvious reasons.

Suiram described our dynamis group on page 2 I believe. Basically, melees/tanks have their own alliance(s) with proper supporting mages and blms have their own alliance of 2-3 parties consisting of rdm and/or brd with remaining slots being blm.

In that case, the only support in regards to cure would generally be for myself or to wake up sleeping people (if I happened to not be slept or wake early). Any BLM not subbing /whm can't do more than that. BLM/NIN works fine here.

I'm not sure what other support you're referring to gained from /rdm other than gravity which our RDM mains typically do or dispel which our brd or rdm does.

Understandibly, when your group is setup in such a way that you will need to be curing on a regular basis or something, you would choose an alternative sub appropriate for it.

[Septimus]

I think this thread is the perfect example of why you don't argue with a brick wall.

You: "Brick Wall, I think that you fail to look at this situation from any viewpoint other than your own."

Brick Wall: "Briiiiiiiiiiiiick Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaall."

[Not Kuno]

I think this thread is the perfect example of why you don't argue with a brick wall.

You: "Brick Wall, I think that you fail to look at this situation from any viewpoint other than your own."

Brick Wall: "Briiiiiiiiiiiiick Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaall."

I didn't know that brick walls were Pokemon.