Pro-SAM Input pt.II

[Kaylia]

Just for reference, I did a quick Excel chart (better than SE's!):

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g2...Zero/zrate.gif

So.. if you parse at 50% accuracy on a given mob, assuming you had 10% Zanshin proc rate, you'd gain a whopping 2.5% to your parsed accuracy. So you'd be parsing at 52.5% accuracy.

50% is, by far, the most "efficient" parsed accuracy rate to make the most of Zanshin, but since that isn't very practical, let's look at something a little more typical.

If you parse at 75% on a given mob without Zanshin, you'll parse at 76.85% with 10% Zanshin proc rate. If you parse at 85% on a given mob without Zanshin, you'll parse at 86.25% with 10% Zanshin proc rate.

And this is all assuming a very generous 10% Zanshin rate. You can see what happens with more realistic proc rates.

I'm pretty sure they inreased accuracy on the second hit last update. I can't give you a number, but it seem to work well as I'm rarely missing the 2nd hit now...well, way less than before.

But yeah, Zanshin on gear is still useless. It's good to have, but doesnt change anything

[Lithiani]

http://www.ffxiah.com/item.php?id=15493&sid=4

At least 3 of those buyers are people who I know, from personal experience, to suck at SAM (or the entire game).

And lol @ 6 up and no sales in the last few days.

The price is high because it's new, and tied to the value of other stuff on Periquia assault points.

[Mifaco]

Is that cape supposed to be some sort of joke? "Store TP" AND "Subtle Blow" AND Evasion +1?

[Khamsin]

http://www.ffxiah.com/item.php?id=15493&sid=4

At least 3 of those buyers are people who I know, from personal experience, to suck at SAM (or the entire game).

And lol @ 6 up and no sales in the last few days.

The price is high because it's new, and tied to the value of other stuff on Periquia assault points.

Veazil apparently understood the true value of it from the start. First sale was 50k.

[Lyramion]

Dont forget if you hit enemy Shadows it counts as "MISS" towards Zanshin and you have a Chance to strike again.

Practically seen still sorta useless outside of Ballista

[Khamsin]

Dont forget if you hit enemy Shadows it counts as "MISS" towards Zanshin and you have a Chance to strike again.

Practically seen still sorta useless outside of Ballista

Can multiple Zanshins proc on a single hand's attack round? e.g. Zanshin + Kraken Club = chance of 1 extra Zanshin if one of the hits miss, or chance of up to 8 Zanshins if all 8 miss?

[Navia]

Zanshin only works on 2h weapons.
If it activated on 1h weapon, it would only activate on a single attack round from kraken/ridill.
If it activated on missed from additional attacks, i'd gimp my acc and blind myself just to see the hilarity of 6 missed swings on soboro in 1 round.

[Kaylia]

Dont forget if you hit enemy Shadows it counts as "MISS" towards Zanshin and you have a Chance to strike again.

Practically seen still sorta useless outside of Ballista

Can multiple Zanshins proc on a single hand's attack round? e.g. Zanshin + Kraken Club = chance of 1 extra Zanshin if one of the hits miss, or chance of up to 8 Zanshins if all 8 miss?

Isn't zanshin for 2h weapon only? I tried using ridill in 70 in xp party last night, and don't remember seeing more than 3 hits. Maybe it doesn't proc at all when multi hit weapon proc too...dunno.

Btw, ridill on fomor at 70 was kicking ass. Well, not really stronger than g.ktn, and you lose seigan, but seeing tp gain made me smile. Too bad vorpal doesn't chain with vorpal

[Hyjynx]

Once again didnt read the whole topic.

There is no question that Zanshin is an amazing skill, made more so after the patch. A free second chance to hit (regardless of what your parser says) is just that, a free second chance to hit. Ill take it!

I once ate Meat in a party where I had intended to eat sushi instead and missed quite a bit but my Zanshin accuracy rate made up for the misses dramatically. Once I even went on a lol8attack wiff streak with Zanshin picking up the hit on 6 of the 8 attacks.
(post acc+ update)

To the OP: That mantle doesnt have enough benefits to warrant gimping yourself with the lack of amemet+1

[Genosync]

Zanshin procs on 1hd weapons only when they hit for one time.

aka if Ridill swings 3 times, it can't proc.

if Ridill swings 1 time (lol) it can proc.

[Lithiani]

I believe that same limitation is in effect for Soboro Sukehiro too

[Hyjynx]

I believe that same limitation is in effect for Soboro Sukehiro too

Yes it is but, that's also the case for Double attack and Soboro Procs... No nothing gained nothing lost.

[Imitarate]

I'm not sure how long you could get away with it, but it seems like an interesting piece of gear for a paladin. Since paladins will gear for defense instead of offense, many wind up averaging 50% accuracy (give or take 20%). Zanshin might be more effective than Vit+4, or other various items, at least until endgame (as for endgame, I barely know what I'm doing on red mage half the time, I won't conjecture on paladin).

[RKenshin]

Zanshin would be good if it can work during a WS.

I know a response was posted already, but I just wanted to back this up... For a while I wasn't sure if Zanshin really worked for WS, and even though it'd make the most sense if it did since every other trait/ability/etc can work during a WS I still didn't know for certain.

For a bit I thought that it might've been possible that Zanshin activiating in a WS would replace the initial hit with the same strength.. So like, if you land the initial hit it'd be 16 TP return, and if you miss the initial hit then Zanshin would take its place and you'd still get 16 TP return and the same strength, which seemed to make the most sense for the results I was getting. Then, 1 TP return WS would just be missing the first hit and landing a DA.

But, have pretty reasonable proof it just works like a DA and is an unmodified 1 TP return. I've had two WS now getting 2 TP return, implying that Zanshin activated and I landed the second hit, and DA activated and I landed that hit as well. The damage and the log both justify this, as normally a 1 TP return is like 300-400 damage, and the two 2 TP returns were 600-800. And, there's no way to double attack twice in a one-hit WS.

Which, would also seem to prove that Double Attack is checked before Zanshin. Although, in my experience they don't stack, so that kind of complicates things. /shrug

[BRP]

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g2...Zero/zrate.gif

It's a rainbow of colors and fail!

But, then again, you can make Zanshin stronger... though, it's really hard to tell if it will be useful. If it was possible to get Zanshin 50%, then it wouldn't suck I guess, but likely we are only getting +1% per bonus, 5% at best. SE could of did something nice, like make it an auto critical hit at least, even without using any merits.

[nekoshoonen]

I thought almost all gear with "enhances" since CoP actually gave you the Job Trait. See Loq., Brutal, Rostrums etc... so might this cape be /ok/ for some other jobs who don't have Zanshin?

semi noob derail : if Zanshin works with WS would it work with Multi-hit BLU spells and would there be any way to possibly test this? Since Amamet isn't incredibly amazing for BLU (Commander is far more superior imo) Maybe this may be a semidecent alternative for a BLU?

[Krandor]

As Xavier often puts it, Zanshin is the only job trait in the game that gets worse as your gear improves.

For a melee job I really see no reason to ever want to remove Amemet+1/Forager's/Cerb(+1), unless you're on of those people who wants to TP in Shadow Mantle to save xp or something.

[Khamsin]

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g2...Zero/zrate.gif

It's a rainbow of colors and fail!

But, then again, you can make Zanshin stronger... though, it's really hard to tell if it will be useful. If it was possible to get Zanshin 50%, then it wouldn't suck I guess, but likely we are only getting +1% per bonus, 5% at best. SE could of did something nice, like make it an auto critical hit at least, even without using any merits.

How does it fail? It shows exactly the effect a given Zanshin proc rate has on your parsed hit rate. It's been calculated accurately, and plainly shows what it does: suck.

[BRP]

Yeah it sucking is where the fail comes from. I don't mean the chart itself. But it does look like a rainbow.

[spooky]

What they should do is make it attack 2-3 times if it procs, then everyone can stack -acc gear!!! FTW! Also go go blind potions.