Ninja Endgame Katana Question

[Bluedemon]

[quote=Eulore][quote=aurik]

Jin is 4 hit, Senj would be 3 of the hits, Fudo would be 1.

Delivers a threefold attack. Chance of critical hit varies with TP.

orly?

Oh wow, lol. While dualwielding you get an extra hit for your offhand.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y93...el/parse-1.jpg

Neophytal = BB MNK, fully meritted.

Hailie = Ridill War, not sure on merits, and no adaman hauberk.

I'll stick with my Senj/Unji =) Even if the damage difference is minimal, swinging fast is fun (I'd get an unsho but I have more important things to worry about)

you realize this parse is less than 60 battles right? that means it's garbage. hell i don't even think you fought VT/IT mobs lol

m.avg of 115? hit% 100? what are you fighting? Easy Prey mobs? this tells us nothing.

As he said, he has filters set on for party, so instead of giving him an accurate reading of others' accuracy, it just lists it as 100%. His accuracy is the only one that's valid, which I believe shows 72% or something? And as I think he mentioned before Jedimind was DRK/WAR, so probably using a Scythe or Gsword, therefore why the M.Avg would be >100.

M.Hit for the nin 72 = using meat?
M.Avg for the mnk only 54 = using sushi?[/quote:b54f0]

We were both using sushi. Like I said before, the accuracy isn't really accurate because flashga lowers the parsed hit rate, my accuracy is much higher than 72%. I use sushi, I'd hope I'd hit more than 42 average with meat >.>

and I'm not sure what the mnk was eatting.[/quote:b54f0]

Even with sushi the monks M avg shouldn't be that low.
I also don't get why the NINs M. Hit is 72 while everyone else is 100. If the low acc is because of Obfuscate, wouldn't that effect everyones M. Hit?

[layoneil]

I also don't get why the NINs M. Hit is 72 while everyone else is 100. If the low acc is because of Obfuscate, wouldn't that effect everyones M. Hit?

chat filtered of other's missed attacks.

[Stilgar]

I don't have them so I can't test myself, but I believe that Koga Tekko (at night) parse better than either O/B kotes or ninja tekko+1.

For purposes of DoT, Koga Tekko at night are pretty hard to beat. I think this is more due to the +haste than the +STR though, as I don't notice a huge difference in my damage per hit. I still macro in AF+1 hands for weapon skills however, for the better balance of STR/DEX.

Who cares about balance? lol
11 STR should blow 6 STR 6 DEX out of the water on your WS. Remember that non-STR secondary modifiers are generally pretty worthless, especially when you have a situation like this. The STR will be factored into your WS damage calculation 3 times, whereas the DEX only will be factored in once (not counting acc or miniscule critical boosts). If you're going to worry about WS modifiers, at least make STR the priority.

[Zilong]

I don't have them so I can't test myself, but I believe that Koga Tekko (at night) parse better than either O/B kotes or ninja tekko+1.

For purposes of DoT, Koga Tekko at night are pretty hard to beat. I think this is more due to the +haste than the +STR though, as I don't notice a huge difference in my damage per hit. I still macro in AF+1 hands for weapon skills however, for the better balance of STR/DEX.

Who cares about balance? lol
11 STR should blow 6 STR 6 DEX out of the water on your WS. Remember that non-STR secondary modifiers are generally pretty worthless, especially when you have a situation like this. The STR will be factored into your WS damage calculation 3 times, whereas the DEX only will be factored in once (not counting acc or miniscule critical boosts). If you're going to worry about WS modifiers, at least make STR the priority.

Well, one can argue that the fact that all katana are rank 4 FSTR weapon at most, capping the FSTR value at 13, hence making the FSTR easier to cap.

Then again, even with the low FSTR value, I still don't think most exp mob's VIT is that low to a point where STR only matter as secondary mod.

[Bluedemon]

I also don't get why the NINs M. Hit is 72 while everyone else is 100. If the low acc is because of Obfuscate, wouldn't that effect everyones M. Hit?

chat filtered of other's missed attacks.

Ahh that makes sense then ty.

[Ehran]

Who cares about balance? lol
11 STR should blow 6 STR 6 DEX out of the water on your WS.

And yet, with all other gear the same, my jin average with AF+1 is higher than with Koga Tekko at night...

[Btight]

Yeah NIN is the one of the only jobs (THF being the other) where the secondary modifier on the WS is sometimes preferred to stacking pure STR.

[Michaera]

But the secondary modifiers are STR and DEX in equal proportions...

Blade: Jin		1.00			3x	STR_30%, DEX_30%		Crit Rate

Taken from a post taken from that studio ghobli thing, correct me if its' wrong. :/

Though since it was mentioned, this Kitsutsuki weapon was a lot of fun, as was trying to duo the fight for it with my WHM friend (hi2u1400 mijin). It's extremely fast, but hits like a locked Senji, though when I get the chance to use it against Gizmo in our normal merit party I can give a personal opinion on its damage. Very fun little kunai.

[Mikeal]

I use Unji/Unsho, and honestly I don't even understand the concept behind using Senji/Fudo or Senji/Rai anymore, lol... Or at least as far as thinking it's the best combination (I know some people just do it because it's cheapest).

IMO the two best combos without a doubt would be Senji/Unji and Unji/Unsho, Fudo as an offhand weapon over Unji is basically useless. It ends up being 1.5% crit rate and 8 base damage (which means almost nothing in off-hand) vs +2STR/4DEX and ~11.5% Haste.

Although, the new HQ katana with 185 delay might be worth a shot as well.

Senji/Fudo outparses U/U bigtime for me.

I have +21% haste a night, max crit and normally 2(march march att att) and a redmage for haste when I exp.

I pretty much never stop swinging in the first place.

U/U are just show or solo items imo.

[DontGiveYourPasswordOut]

With the EXACT same gear but just switching weapons, Senj/Fudo rapes all other katana combo, you're nuts if you think otherwise. Don't test yourself versus another who's using the different katana setup, test vs yourself and you'll see.

[Amastacia]

Why, then, with the exact same gear, did my parses go up when I switched to Senj/Unji?

And since fucking when did NINs start giving a shit about secondary mods (besides the +15 DEX on Haidate) instead of stacking STR?

[Stilgar]

Who cares about balance? lol
11 STR should blow 6 STR 6 DEX out of the water on your WS.

And yet, with all other gear the same, my jin average with AF+1 is higher than with Koga Tekko at night...

Can you post some proof? I'd like to see it, and your other gear. Oh, and the mobs you fought, too.

[RKenshin]

With the EXACT same gear but just switching weapons, Senj/Fudo rapes all other katana combo, you're nuts if you think otherwise. Don't test yourself versus another who's using the different katana setup, test vs yourself and you'll see.

Ok, I did, and my results support everything I've said.

Funny too how just about all the best equiped/meritted NINs I know get the same results as well... NIN's on my server like Keichan, Baudan, Miruka, and NIN's on other servers like Kisada, Stellar, etc. Meanwhile, all the worst NINs I've seen use either Mamux2 or Senji/Fudo.

Guess it's just all in my head.

[Michaera]

Mamux2

This combo completely owns when you have one and only one in your 3x-4x NIN merit party. It's like the acid bolt RNG in a RNG party. xD Makes things so much easier on the RDM, especially with some luck in a zone like Caedarva... [/random]

[Zilong]

Mamux2

This combo completely owns when you have one and only one in your 3x-4x NIN merit party. It's like the acid bolt RNG in a RNG party. xD Makes things so much easier on the RDM, especially with some luck in a zone like Caedarva... [/random]

Mamushito+1 won't lower your damage by enough to break chains provided that the rest of your gear isn't crap, and if I ever get 3x-4x NIN on merit, I'd make it a point to have at least 2 of the NIN wear it, but preferably, I'd have them all wear it and just watch the mob get stunlocked to death.

Functionality > E-peen

[Ehran]

Who cares about balance? lol
11 STR should blow 6 STR 6 DEX out of the water on your WS.

And yet, with all other gear the same, my jin average with AF+1 is higher than with Koga Tekko at night...

Can you post some proof? I'd like to see it, and your other gear. Oh, and the mobs you fought, too.

I will see what I can do. I play on Xbox, and parses are recorded by ls mates. I normally write down ws damage, and enter them in a spreadsheet after the party. Not exactly what you'd call hard-core evidence, I know...

For merits, I prefer Cerberus Trolls, since it's almost always empty, although lately my friends and I have been meriting on Aerns for HQ organs to pop Ix'MNK.

My gear is ok for ws, but nothing to wet your pants over:
Katanas: Senj/Unji
Ammo: Bomb Core
Head: Shura Kabuto
Neck: Breeze Gorget
Ear1: Brutal
Ear2: Suppa
Body: Hauby
Hands: Koga Tekko / AF+1 / B. Kotes (depending on party setup)
Ring1: Flame Ring
Ring2: Rajas
Back: Ametmet +1
Belt: Warwolf
Legs: Byakko's
Feet: Fuma Sune-Ate

I also have maxed STR/Katana/Critical hit rate merits.

I will try to get some more data this weekend and post the results.

[RKenshin]

I'm talking strictly about DD capabilities, not other utilities.

[Damen]

Only thing that's kept me from actually trying it is I don't have and probably will never have Katana merits,

Meanwhile, all the worst NINs I've seen use either Mamux2 or Senji/Fudo.

Stop acting like your the best DD ninja in the entire game. You don't even have katana merits. I have no question in my mind that you know how to DD, and I'm sure that U/U works best for you. But really you have no right to call Senj/Fudo users the "worst nins i've seen." That's the most absurd accusation I've ever heard. Katanas don't make or break the ninja, and they don't turn a bad ninja into a good one or vice versa. But having merits, equipment, skill and experience, are going to make you a good ninja (DD or otherwise), than what katana you main/offhand.

Also, consider that this game isn't all about efficiency. While I'll agree it's fun to parse and tweak your equipment and merits to build a good DD, the point here is to have fun with what you use. I personally didn't like ninja DD until around level 66 when Kororito+1's came into play. I liked the higher base damage, and I don't think I would ever go back to a lower base damage weapon simply because that's not what I prefer.

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b1...compliment.jpg

I use Senj/Fudo. Senj/Unji, or U/U just wasn't for me. Use whatever katanas that fit you, your equip, and your merits.

[Zilong]

Using compliment collage to prove a point usually means that you fail.

[Swatt]

Only thing that's kept me from actually trying it is I don't have and probably will never have Katana merits,

Meanwhile, all the worst NINs I've seen use either Mamux2 or Senji/Fudo.

Stop acting like your the best DD ninja in the entire game. You don't even have katana merits. I have no question in my mind that you know how to DD, and I'm sure that U/U works best for you. But really you have no right to call Senj/Fudo users the "worst nins i've seen." That's the most absurd accusation I've ever heard. Katanas don't make or break the ninja, and they don't turn a bad ninja into a good one or vice versa. But having merits, equipment, skill and experience, are going to make you a good ninja (DD or otherwise), than what katana you main/offhand.

Also, consider that this game isn't all about efficiency. While I'll agree it's fun to parse and tweak your equipment and merits to build a good DD, the point here is to have fun with what you use. I personally didn't like ninja DD until around level 66 when Kororito+1's came into play. I liked the higher base damage, and I don't think I would ever go back to a lower base damage weapon simply because that's not what I prefer.

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b1...compliment.jpg

I use Senj/Fudo. Senj/Unji, or U/U just wasn't for me. Use whatever katanas that fit you, your equip, and your merits.

a = worst nins
b = senj fudo nins

a belongs to b.
not all of b belongs to a.

logic ftw.

i'm just beginning nin merits, but senj/unji works better than /fudo for me.