Salvage: Zhayolm Remnants

[cdgreg]

hoping to verify a few little things. Agros on the first and second floor are they:

puk: sight/sound & link
ziz: sight & link
raptors: sound & no link
bugard: sound? & link
draco lizard: sound? & link
wyvern: sight & link

Are these correct/incorrect and are any true sound or sight?

[Ferien]

Not to mention you can still determine which is which via widescan placements, so this isnt a "hidden" secret, it is just an optimization.

And time for bitch session:

FUCK the days the madames want to be bitches.

Im talking the days they use Chorus for EVERY FUCKING TP MOVE, and then cast death every fucking time they use Providence. Seriously, lets take a five min fight and turn it into 20 for no reason. Fuck you Madame, get off your goddamn tampon and stop cock blocking my Gotes for the last 8 months. Fuck your Chorus, Fuck your Death, Fucking your god damn 1% drop rates while other teams are going 1/1.

Fuck.

We've only seen Death twice, and once it was at 1% so we killed it before it went off =x

hoping to verify a few little things. Agros on the first and second floor are they:

puk: sight/sound & link
ziz: sight & link
raptors: sound & no link
bugard: sound? & link
draco lizard: sound? & link
wyvern: sight & link

Are these correct/incorrect and are any true sound or sight?

Sounds about right. Bugards might not link, not too sure, and none of the regular mobs on the first two floors is True anything.

[Terrestrialrage]

puk: sight/sound & link
ziz: sight & link
raptors: sound & no link
bugard: sound? & link
draco lizard: sound? & link
wyvern: sight & link

Mobs in salvage act exactly as they would anywhere else, so:

Puk: Sight/Sound + Link
Ziz: Sight + No link
Raptors: Sound + No link
Bugard: Sound + No link
Lizard: Sound + Link
Wyvern Sight + No Link

[cdgreg]

puk: sight/sound & link
ziz: sight & link
raptors: sound & no link
bugard: sound? & link
draco lizard: sound? & link
wyvern: sight & link

Mobs in salvage act exactly as they would anywhere else, so:

Puk: Sight/Sound + Link
Ziz: Sight + No link
Raptors: Sound + No link
Bugard: Sound + No link
Lizard: Sound + Link
Wyvern Sight + No Link

I swear our puller linked 3 wyverns last time with 1 pull since I didn't want anymore pulls anyways and he came back with 3 lol. hmm?

[Suiram]

Puks, Lizards and Wyverns link. Puks, Raptors, Bugards, and Lizards detect sound. Puks, Ziz, and Wyverns detect sight.

[Terrestrialrage]

Youd think after upwards of 60 Zhayolms id remember that the wyverns link when im typing that up

[cdgreg]

Am I correct in assuming the edited dat is named 4-1-72.DAT because it goes in ROM4/1/ as 72.dat? I don't want to replace the wrong one

[Ferien]

Am I correct in assuming the edited dat is named 4-1-72.DAT because it goes in ROM4/1/ as 72.dat? I don't want to replace the wrong one

Yes, that's correct.

[Kaeko]

Another group in my LS recently tested a potential "trick" with the 5F Madame pop.

She says that they somehow accidently only had 2 people with full unlocks going into 5F. During this time on 5F, another player accidently DC'd (not one of the unlcoks). When he returned, the Madame immediately popped despite the fact only 2 people were unlocked...

She believes that this works and is not a 'glitch' because when you DC or log off in Salvage, when you return, you momentarily have 0 pathos (it all comes back on a few seconds after logging on). During this moment, you have 3 players with 0 pathos - the 2 unlocks and the person that just logged back on and hasn't had their pathos put back on them. This moment enables the condition (3 unlocks) to pop the madame.

Can anyone doing 5F just have 1 player hold 1 cell in inventory and not use until on 5F to test this? Would be interested to see, although I don't know how useful this would be if it worked. Perhaps if you were able to somehow 'time' 3 players logging on simultaniously. That would essentially pop the madame with 0 unlocks.

[Kaylia]

Could be nice if someone screw up, but I see very little benefit to such trick. Unlocking people usually help you more than not in this zone, and you should spend enough time to unlock at least 3. Could give str cell to your 3rd melee instead maybe, but meh, doubt it would change much.

[Wolfknight]

Could be nice if someone screw up, but I see very little benefit to such trick. Unlocking people usually help you more than not in this zone, and you should spend enough time to unlock at least 3. Could give str cell to your 3rd melee instead maybe, but meh, doubt it would change much.

would nice for times when zhay decides to hate you and give you only 2 rings and 2 ranges cause you had TH1(or TH3/4 failed)

[Ferien]

Another group in my LS recently tested a potential "trick" with the 5F Madame pop.

She says that they somehow accidently only had 2 people with full unlocks going into 5F. During this time on 5F, another player accidently DC'd (not one of the unlcoks). When he returned, the Madame immediately popped despite the fact only 2 people were unlocked...

She believes that this works and is not a 'glitch' because when you DC or log off in Salvage, when you return, you momentarily have 0 pathos (it all comes back on a few seconds after logging on). During this moment, you have 3 players with 0 pathos - the 2 unlocks and the person that just logged back on and hasn't had their pathos put back on them. This moment enables the condition (3 unlocks) to pop the madame.

Can anyone doing 5F just have 1 player hold 1 cell in inventory and not use until on 5F to test this? Would be interested to see, although I don't know how useful this would be if it worked. Perhaps if you were able to somehow 'time' 3 players logging on simultaniously. That would essentially pop the madame with 0 unlocks.

I think this was one of the ideas that was played with when everyone was still figuring out the Madames, and it was shown to not work. Not sure though, will have to look it up (or test it, it wouldn't be that difficult to test).

[Shassira]

Another group in my LS recently tested a potential "trick" with the 5F Madame pop.

She says that they somehow accidently only had 2 people with full unlocks going into 5F. During this time on 5F, another player accidently DC'd (not one of the unlcoks). When he returned, the Madame immediately popped despite the fact only 2 people were unlocked...

She believes that this works and is not a 'glitch' because when you DC or log off in Salvage, when you return, you momentarily have 0 pathos (it all comes back on a few seconds after logging on). During this moment, you have 3 players with 0 pathos - the 2 unlocks and the person that just logged back on and hasn't had their pathos put back on them. This moment enables the condition (3 unlocks) to pop the madame.

Can anyone doing 5F just have 1 player hold 1 cell in inventory and not use until on 5F to test this? Would be interested to see, although I don't know how useful this would be if it worked. Perhaps if you were able to somehow 'time' 3 players logging on simultaniously. That would essentially pop the madame with 0 unlocks.

I propossed this along with the 1F d/c thing some pages ago and i believe someone said they tried and nothing happened. I haven't bothered trying though, but it should be very easy to do. Next Zhayolm i'll go ahead and do it. it is true that when you zone back you do have no pathos and then they are applied. This seems to happen aparently when you die too, although the death condition may have been taken into account because it doesn't seem to work with that. Either way, it does count for 1F (since it won't pop when someone's dead). You can see how it re applies the pathos because you lose TP upon raise.

As for it's usefulness, it's honestly limited, but under my view it would be very nice to minimize stat farming in 3F or specialy to have an easy ride when doing 4F 30' frog and being able to chain 5F on the same run.

[Lyriane]

Keep in mind that unless you can synchronize people well enough that the game considers them to all be in this pathos-free limbo state at once, this is only going to get you a third person to go with your first two that are actually cleared. If you manage to get just 0 or 1 rings/ranged (starter box and no drops) you're still done, and since 3f only drops stats in clumps of 3 this won't be able to save you any time there, at best it means you could reallocate some cells that are worthless to that third full-clear, which is probably not worth the trouble.

However, I do think it's cool and totally a glitch. SE can't figure out how to apply status effects when zoning or dead, I don't mind taking advantage of it where advantage can be taken. I figure we've earned any exploits we can find here by putting up with their reraise-automatically-wearing-when-you-die shit and having tractor in campaign take away your exp. ><

[mallister]

would nice for times when zhay decides to hate you and give you only 2 rings and 2 ranges cause you had TH1(or TH3/4 failed)

last night we got no rings at ALL. didn't even know that was possible. complete waste of a run.

[chapstick]

would nice for times when zhay decides to hate you and give you only 2 rings and 2 ranges cause you had TH1(or TH3/4 failed)

last night we got no rings at ALL. didn't even know that was possible. complete waste of a run.

Happened to me once, totally sucked.

[Neosutra]

I have had 2 runs in about 70 madame farming runs that we recieved 0-1 Rings or Ranged. Both times I had to afk for about 2-3 minutes to stop cursing and go get a beer, then proceeded to go farm the boss for some 25s.

[Zidiane]

Isnt their mobs on the 4th you can farm for extra cells? I've never tried to farm them for extra's because i've never needed too. Gent (lol), and the gears?

Another thing, i've been looking over this area to try cut down more time so possible 1>5>6>Boss, a friend sent me his strat but it didnt quite cut any time off from what i would normaly do, question is tho:

Is setting camp on 2F in the middle and having 2 pullers pull mobs back to it a better idea instead of runing to each room and pulling the mobs inside? (Providing they can keep up with kill speed)

I was thinking a bard could gather a few mobs, horde lul them and run back for the wyverns (Providing they dont lose aggo), has anyone else tried this before? Trying to cut time down on second from 20 mins to 10 mins and hitting the 5th floor with 60 mins of the run left.
15 Mins on 1st floor for 1F clearing either puks or Ziz depending on set up (Madame pop)(Melee or blm heavy). 10-12 mins for second, 8 mins or so for 3rd(Farming stats for main 3 people and a few extra's), 5 mins for 4th(lol rampart) then having the rest of the run to do, 5th, 6th frog, clear chariot and use SV to clear the rest of the gears and have 15-20 mins for boss.

[stinkypoo]

You can farm mamools on 4th for stats (see the Zhayolm thread made in this forum a couple days ago).

Pulling with sleep might make them deaggro, yeah. Pulling without sleep is not an option because the wyverns would eat you. You could pull with grav, but to do dual pulls you'd need 2 people who can cast it. Also we normally kill the 3 mobs in the back left corner of the room since you're guaranteed 2 drops that way....but everything links, so using grav/sleep pulls on them would cause the ones at the front to link :S

What we do after leaving the NE room is split up: make 2 teams with at least 1 melee + 1 person who can heal + sleep in each, and spread the rest logically. We send the team with highest DPS to clear the 1st & 3rd rooms on the left while the low DPS team takes the 2nd on the left. If you're gonna pop Jakko, make sure the person with a card ends up in the correct room when you're planning who goes where. If the low DPS team is done early, its melees can go help out in the last room while the mage from that team goes to wait at the portal.

It works well as long as people are good at following instructions and we do it with as few as 5 people (melee melee rdm for team 1, melee brd for team 2 for example). Just call out the teams and where they go while fighting the madame NE, and repeat them as people start running out of the room.

[Hanyoko]

Another group in my LS recently tested a potential "trick" with the 5F Madame pop.

She says that they somehow accidently only had 2 people with full unlocks going into 5F. During this time on 5F, another player accidently DC'd (not one of the unlcoks). When he returned, the Madame immediately popped despite the fact only 2 people were unlocked...

She believes that this works and is not a 'glitch' because when you DC or log off in Salvage, when you return, you momentarily have 0 pathos (it all comes back on a few seconds after logging on). During this moment, you have 3 players with 0 pathos - the 2 unlocks and the person that just logged back on and hasn't had their pathos put back on them. This moment enables the condition (3 unlocks) to pop the madame.

Can anyone doing 5F just have 1 player hold 1 cell in inventory and not use until on 5F to test this? Would be interested to see, although I don't know how useful this would be if it worked. Perhaps if you were able to somehow 'time' 3 players logging on simultaniously. That would essentially pop the madame with 0 unlocks.

I think this was one of the ideas that was played with when everyone was still figuring out the Madames, and it was shown to not work. Not sure though, will have to look it up (or test it, it wouldn't be that difficult to test).

Would be fairly simple to test. Fully unlock 2 people and give a 3rd all the cells but have them not use one. Have someone else logout and see if it pops when they log back in. If it does not pop have the 3rd person use their last cells and then murdernate. I know I'll try and keep this in mind next run to try.

As far as syncing login with 2-3 people would make this next to impossible. Its probably a check that fires "Should they have pathos" which most likely occurs on login/cell usage